Return-Path: X-Scanned-By: RAE MPP/Clamd http://raeinternet.com/mpp X-Scanned-By: This message was scanned by MPP Lite Edition (www.messagepartners.com)! X-Real-To: stagecraftlist [at] theatrical.net Received: by prxy.net (CommuniGate Pro PIPE 4.2.10) with PIPE id 24440120; Fri, 26 Aug 2005 03:01:30 -0700 X-ListServer: CommuniGate Pro LIST 4.2.10 List-Unsubscribe: List-ID: Message-ID: From: "Stagecraft" Sender: "Stagecraft" To: "Stagecraft" Precedence: list Subject: Stagecraft Digest #500 Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 03:00:17 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.7 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.4 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.4 (2005-06-05) on prxy.net X-Spam-Level: X-TFF-CGPSA-Version: 1.4f2 X-prxy-Spam-Filter: Scanned For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- Stagecraft Digest, Issue #500 1. Chorus line research by Herrick Goldman 2. Re: Chorus line research by "Paul Sanow" 3. Re: Chorus line research by Stephen Litterst 4. Re: Chorus line research by John McKernon 5. Re: Chorus line research by Herrick Goldman 6. Re: Chorus line research by John McKernon 7. Re: Chorus line research by Herrick Goldman 8. Re: Chorus line research by "richard j. archer" 9. Re: Chorus line research by "ladesigners [at] juno.com" 10. Re: Red Letters in Pool by "Paul Guncheon" 11. Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread by Herrick Goldman 12. Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread by "Peter Scheu" 13. Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread by Scott Parker 14. Phoenix area resources by "Michael Finney" 15. Re: Red Letters in Pool by "C. Dopher" 16. Position available by "Waxler, Steve (waxlers)" 17. ACL by sbmtbike [at] optonline.net 18. Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread by "Jon Ares" 19. Re: Like Shelley Winters . . . by Loren Schreiber 20. Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread by Chris Davis 21. Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread by "Jon Ares" 22. Re: Chorus line research by "Tony Deeming" 23. Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread by Bruce Purdy 24. Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread by IAEG [at] aol.com 25. Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread by Bruce Purdy 26. Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread by IAEG [at] aol.com *** Please update the subject line of your reply to use the subject *** line of the message you are replying to! Please only reply to *** one message subject in each reply. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 08:10:00 -0400 Subject: Chorus line research From: Herrick Goldman Message-ID: Hey folks, I'm embarking on some research of Tharon Musser's A Chorus Line. I spent a few hours of web searching and looked at many of the hits under "Tharon Musser" "A chorus Line" etc... I'm pretty aware of most of the "lore" I know how the L5 came about and understand the basic stuff. I have been told that the plot was published in Theater Crafts. But I can't find a reference on the web. I'm going to Lincoln Center Library soon to do more research but if anyone knows the year/date/issue of the theater crafts article that would help. If you happen to have it and could get me a fax or a scan or point to a web page that would be great. I did find a few fun things in my googling. One was a stagecraft archives hit from 2003 that actually had me in some kind of discussion with Chris "Chris" Babbie. Go figure. One was a cool lighting history website: And the best was this quote from Tharon that would get me killed in most union houses: "The virtue of the memory board," she said, "is that you don't have to depend on some guy who may be drunk pulling levers every night -- or worse, an electrician who decides to become imaginative on you. The last thing you want is an imaginative electrician. With the memory board, you have consistency and smoothness. You get the same show every night." -Tharon Musser I thought that was pretty fun. If anyone has some really deep trivia I'd like to hear it. I know we had Steve Terry on here ages ago and I found a transcript of an LDI discussion he held a decade ago with some of the players. Thanks for any help on the plot or useful articles, -herrick -- Herrick Goldman Lighting Designer, NYC www.HGLightingDesign.com 917-797-3624 "To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS ------------------------------ Subject: RE: Chorus line research Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 08:31:44 -0400 Message-ID: From: "Paul Sanow" Herrick, Don't know if this is useful to you, but NPR's Weekend Saturday Morning = Edition just included a piece on Joseph Papp and the Public Theatre. In = it they discussed the evolution of the show and interviewed Papp's = widow. Mostly the piece is about the 50th Anniversary of the Public. = Evidently there is also an exhibition at the NY Public Library. http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=3D4807567 Nothing about the lighting, but this might be of interest to you and = other listers. Good luck. Paul *********************************************************** Paul Sanow psanow [at] vls.com Technical Sales www.vincentlighting.com Vincent Lighting Systems 1420 Jamike Ln. #2 Erlanger, KY 41018 (859) 525-2000 x211 FAX (859) 525-2050 *********************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 08:43:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Stephen Litterst Subject: Re: Chorus line research In-reply-to: Message-id: <2341.172.136.72.37.1124973825.squirrel [at] 172.136.72.37> References: > --------------------------------------------------- > Thanks for any help on the plot or useful articles, Linda Essig's book "The Speed of Light" has some good conversations about the development and early use of memory consoles. I can't remember of the top of my head if there are any specific references to "Chorus Line" but I'll check when I get into the office. Steve Litterst ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:04:00 -0400 Subject: Re: Chorus line research From: John McKernon Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Herrick, So you're writing an article? Call Marilyn Rennagel. She's Tharon's partner and associate and would know everything there is to know about the lighting for "A Chorus Line". You can reach her at Tharons' phone#, which was in the NYC white pages the last time I looked. - John ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:25:05 -0400 Subject: Re: Chorus line research From: Herrick Goldman Message-ID: In-Reply-To: I'm actually not writing an article. I am designing a tour and the producer and director have specifically requested a "re-creation". While normally I have a knee-jerk response to that It's hard to argue with them wanting a recreation of a seminal design. So I've actually undertaken it as an intellectual and technical challenge. And rather than just see the video at NYPL (whish I will) and guess at stuff I wanted real hard facts. I'm currently working with 2 friends of Marylin's and I have obtained her cell # and a phone introduction. But I also want to be prepared and not just another LD pestering her with lame questions. If the information is out there and accessible I'd like to have it before I speak with Marilyn so I'm not wasting her time. I also want to make it clear to her and to anyone else that I have no intention of taking design credit for a reproduction of Tharon's work. I intend to have the producers list Tharon's name in the credits with my name below. Specifically I have become curious about color choices and am fascinated about how she called/used followspots to "overlap seamlessly" I also have become so used to our theater technology that going back to my roots is a fun challenge. For those of you who may be on the tour route. It begins in El Paso and goes to Honolulu and Maui. If you happen to live in those places. Drop me a line. Thanks for the responses I've gotten so far and keep them coming. -Herrick On 8/25/05 9:04 AM, "John McKernon" wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > Herrick, > > So you're writing an article? Call Marilyn Rennagel. She's Tharon's partner > and associate and would know everything there is to know about the lighting > for "A Chorus Line". You can reach her at Tharons' phone#, which was in the > NYC white pages the last time I looked. > > - John > > -- Herrick Goldman Lighting Designer, NYC www.HGLightingDesign.com 917-797-3624 "To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:43:02 -0400 Subject: Re: Chorus line research From: John McKernon Message-ID: In-Reply-To: > I'm actually not writing an article. I am designing a tour and the producer > and director have specifically requested a "re-creation". While normally I > have a knee-jerk response to that It's hard to argue with them wanting a > recreation of a seminal design. It's also illegal to copy anyone's design... If you recreate Tharon's lighting, the producers owe her a royalty for each performance. - John ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 10:03:01 -0400 Subject: Re: Chorus line research From: Herrick Goldman Message-ID: In-Reply-To: On 8/25/05 9:43 AM, "John McKernon" wrote: > > It's also illegal to copy anyone's design... If you recreate Tharon's > lighting, the producers owe her a royalty for each performance. > > - John This is true. And while I intend to recreate the look of the show as per the producer's request the cues and timing will come from me. As I said it's an intellectual exercise and the 3 venues are not exactly well equipped. I have a feeling that once I start drafting the plot that most of the angles, equipment, and other elements will change to fit the realities of the road houses and the time restrictions. But I do want to know what the goal is and try to achieve it as best I can. I have found in my research a number of university productions and professional productions where the playbill references Tharon's design such as "lighting design based on original by Tharon Musser" obviously they may have sought permission or have done it without her knowledge and been in the wrong. But this is why I'm looking into it now and asking questions before hand. I hate begging for forgiveness later. -H - Herrick Goldman Lighting Designer, NYC www.HGLightingDesign.com 917-797-3624 "To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS ------------------------------ Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:18:23 -0500 From: "richard j. archer" Subject: Re: Chorus line research You might also read a San Francisco Chronicle article http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2005/03/03/DDGRHBIMLF14.DTL It's about the fall 2006 Broadway revival which will preview in SF in summer 2006 Dick A TD, Cornell U ------------------------------ From: "ladesigners [at] juno.com" Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:24:04 GMT Subject: Re: Chorus line research Message-Id: <20050825.072415.23402.138904 [at] webmail10.lax.untd.com> Dear Herrick, One look that perhaps you shouldn't recreate too accurately is having the lights reflect off the mirrored upstage periaktoi back into the eyes of someone who WAS enjoying the show until the final number. /s/ Richard This is true. And while I intend to recreate the look of the show as per the producer's request the cues and timing will come from me. Herrick Goldman ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 04:26:41 -1000 From: "Paul Guncheon" Subject: Re: Red Letters in Pool Message-id: <000701c5a981$03899230$c6354104 [at] yourxhtr8hvc4p> References: <> Bite your tongue. <> Huh? Mahalo for the many great suggestions... possibly excluding the above. The first of which would get me fired / not hired, the second of which I don't understand. The tech scout today should point to the correct solution. When I am cooking for something, it had better sing. Paul "I am so singing in tune", Tom sounded off. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 11:39:17 -0400 Subject: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread From: Herrick Goldman Message-ID: In-Reply-To: On 8/25/05 10:18 AM, "richard j. archer" wrote: > > It's about the fall 2006 Broadway revival which will preview in SF in > summer 2006 > > Dick A > TD, Cornell U > Now that the topic of the new ACL has been brought up. I've been bouncing around some semantic arguments in my head. (there is a lot of room up there) If you are a producer , a director, a designer, an audience member in 2006 creating or going to see A Chorus Line. What do you want to see more? A faithful reproduction of the original Or A newer updated version incorporating scrollers, moving lights, etc... I personally wouldn't change a thing. However each of the above mentioned individuals have their own goals. The director may want to put his or her stamp on the piece (like the recent Fiddler). I realize the 2006 director is a faithful friend of the departed Michael Bennet so this is not the case. (we're having a philosophical discussion) The producer may think that American/Broadway audiences are frequently drawn in by Glitz and SFX and that these help sell seats...even to a proven musical. The designer may want more flexibility or to cater to more modern designs that have more cues and more changes. It's hard to resist the temptation to update. What does the audience want? What do they deserve? Should we listen to, what the audience wants or is Art for Art's sake the best reason? If Moving lights are good enough for "Oklahoma" can't they work for "Chorus Line"? For that matter why not bring the whole show into 2006? I read somewhere that modern Audition-wear (baggy pants and stuff) didn't work well in a previous regional production. It's not like the chorus gypsies of today don't have the same stories to tell. Should it, could it be updated? And would it hurt the show in any way? We've got enough theater historians on this list that I expect there are strong opinions. Again I'm not advocating changing anything but I think in this day and age, with the glitz and tech of Broadway and other live entertainment, that the theater-going audience might expect something other than a faithful recreation. Talk amongst yourselves. _Herrick -- Herrick Goldman Lighting Designer, NYC www.HGLightingDesign.com 917-797-3624 "To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "Peter Scheu" Subject: RE: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 12:18:05 -0400 Organization: Scheu Consulting Services, Inc. Message-ID: In-reply-to: Herrick Goldman wrote: >We've got enough theater historians on this list that I expect=20 >there are strong opinions.=20 > >Again I'm not advocating changing anything but I think in this=20 >day and age, with the glitz and tech of Broadway and other=20 >live entertainment, that the theater-going audience might=20 >expect something other than a faithful recreation. I would suspect producers and directors of opera have the same = discussions and challenges all the time. Who could REALLY recreate the original production of Mozart's The Magic Flute (or would want to), and might not modern audiences find such a production childishly quaint and maybe even very corny and/or boring? Theatre by it's very nature is a "transitory" art form, and by that definition, the passage of time is a viable that can't be controlled = (like viewing a recorded show on video or DVD over and over). Every live show, = no matter how any times it is performed, is different in some way every = night. Some differences are subtle and unnoticeable (a lamp burned out halfway through the show). Some are substantive (the lead actor was replaced, = and brings a different interpretation to the role). I would think that trying for a 100% faithful, nuts-n-bolts recreation = of the original production of any show would be difficult at best if not impossible. Trying to capture the "spirit" or "soul", while also = difficult, may be more easily accomplished (especially given that some of the = original producers are part of this project).=20 Sets and lighting may be recreated without difficulty for a more modern = show like ACL. It would seem that it's all on the Director's shoulders to recreate the show's soul. Technical bells and whistles like moving = lights and SFX cannot give a show a "soul". All above is totally IM very, very, very HO. But an interesting = discussion nonetheless. Peter Scheu =20 Scheu Consulting Services, Inc. Syracuse, NY www.scheuconsulting.com ------------------------------ Message-ID: <90d9c99805082509295216f742 [at] mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 12:29:27 -0400 From: Scott Parker Subject: Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread In-Reply-To: References: Interesting to note: in the current issue of the Theatrical Index, Tharon Musser is listed as LD for the upcoming B'way revival. Personally, I did ACL last year and use just a few moving lights along with several scrollers. I didn't have the equipment to give each person a spot special, but used the moving lights to do so. The scrollers were used only for the "inner thought" times. Otherwise, worklight was represented (stylized.) I'm with you Herrick, I didn't wish to change much... I did, however, use an ETC Express! Getting the original board (I believe the actual one lives in a tech museum in Boston, I think) was out of the question;-) Scott >=20 > A newer updated version incorporating scrollers, moving lights, etc... >=20 > I personally wouldn't change a thing. However each of the above mentioned > individuals have their own goals. > --=20 Take care, Scott =09Scott C. Parker =09Professor/Technical Director =09Dept. of Performing Arts =09Dyson College of Arts and Sciences [at] Pace University =09Office/shipping: 41 Park Row, 1205F =09Mailing: 1 Pace Plaza=20 =09New York, NY 10038 =09212-346-1423 Fax: 914-989-8425 ------------------------------ Subject: Phoenix area resources Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 10:16:41 -0700 Message-ID: From: "Michael Finney" Oh great and knowing list! Coming up this fall, it looks like I'll have a small industrial to deal with in Phoenix. The production design is just starting, so I don't know much more than it's going to be a typical ballroom stage with I-mag for speakers. Any suggestions for production rentals in the area (primarily lighting, but I suspect that the other stuff will shortly crawl into my scope) would be appreciated, as I really don't see any reason to package the gig in LA and truck it out. Please feel free to contact me off list. Thanks! Michael Finney Thinkwell Design & Production mfinney [at] thinkwelldesign.com www.thinkwelldesign.com PS - apologies if the line spacing is odd...I'm trying to fix the formatting issues I've been having with plain text out of Outlook.... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:17:26 -0400 Subject: Re: Red Letters in Pool From: "C. Dopher" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003401c5a8bb$62a63e60$c6354104 [at] yourxhtr8hvc4p> If a soft solution is required, can you cut and sew? If the letter is all continiguous and not too incredibly complicated, it might be possible to cut the letter from red nylon cloth and sew lead tape to the edges, maybe some in the middle. This contraption can then be folded up and sit on the front seat of your truck and fairly easily deployed. I've seen some children's pool toys that make an underwater target this way. Cris Dopher On 8/24/05 10:52 AM, "Paul Guncheon" wrote: > I am cooking for some additional techniques. I am working on a commercial > and I have to put a large script letter on the bottom of two swimming pools. > The size of the letters is yet to be determined, but may be as large as 10' > in diameter. > ------------------------------ Message-ID: From: "Waxler, Steve (waxlers)" Subject: Position available Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:26:18 -0400 Theatre Stage Technician (Master Carp/Shop Foreman) POSITION SUMMARY: Building and supervising the building of scenery as well as support Technical Director and ATD in supervision of graduate and undergraduate students building scenery and props for mainstage and workshop productions in well equipped shop. Oversee shop operations, shop safety, tool maintenance, inventory control. MINIMUM QUALIFICATIONS: Bachelor of Arts in theater, fine arts or related field, or an equivalent combination of education and experience and at least one (1) year of related experience. The ideal candidate will have advanced skills in carpentry, welding, rigging and mechanics; have leadership and problem-solving abilities; and be CAD (AutoCad) literate. REPLY TO: Human Resources Employment Services 51 Goodman Drive University of Cincinnati PO Box 210117 Cincinnati, OH 45221-0117 CONTROL #: 25PV0142 Steve Waxler Technical Director College Conservatory of Music University of Cincinnati (513) 556-3709 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 16:02:46 -0400 From: sbmtbike [at] optonline.net Subject: ACL Message-id: -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Scott Parker >Personally, I did ACL last year and use just a few moving lights along >with several scrollers. I didn't have the equipment to give each person >a spot special, but used the moving lights to do so. The scrollers were >used only for the "inner thought" times. Otherwise, worklight was >represented (stylized.) I distinctly recall that Tharon had installed into the Shubert an FOH bridge, specifically to allow the use of high angle incandescant follow spots - I believe there were 5. She did not want lower angle, high intensity carbon's from the booth. They needed a variance from the NYC landmarks commission for the bridge. I'm certain that the modern version would be ML's in a similar position. >I'm with you Herrick, I didn't wish to change much... I did, however, >use an ETC Express! Getting the original board (I believe the actual >one lives in a tech museum in Boston, I think) was out of the >question;-) You probably mean the LS8 ?, as I believe it was called. An Electro Controls illegal copy of a Skirpan, that they created for the ACL move to Broadway and that they got into a patent infringment lawsuit (they lost) with Skirpan. There's an LS8 owned by Fred Foster and sitting in the new ETC facility in Madison, way up on top of a bunch of stuff (as of last summer), awaiting a stage lighting museum, that I was told Fred hopes to put together. Note that this is all being recalled from old memory cells, that may or may not be totally intact. Steve Bailey Brooklyn College ------------------------------ Message-ID: <000301c5a9ba$f70f1860$0600000a [at] BRUTUS> From: "Jon Ares" References: Subject: Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:21:32 -0700 > A newer updated version incorporating scrollers, moving lights, etc... > > I personally wouldn't change a thing. However each of the above mentioned > individuals have their own goals. > I can't comprehend "doing it like the original" (lighting-wise) unless there was a specific effect or such that the show really cries for. (speaking in generalities - not of Chorus Line specifically.) I didn't see the original ACL, so I can't imagine what made Tharon's design absolutely memorable to the audience, that would tell me, "I should do it that way, or else the audience won't like the show." Yes, sometimes the audience has a certain expectation for a show (they want to see the chandelier, the staircase, the helicopter, etc) but I don't know any 'general audience' that remembers the lighting. Why not 'change' the lights? Who remembers them anyway? (And I *am* an LD.) - Jon Ares www.hevanet.com/acreative ------------------------------ Message-Id: <6.1.1.1.2.20050825144817.03ab9f90 [at] mail.sdsu.edu> Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:50:17 -0700 From: Loren Schreiber Subject: Re: Like Shelley Winters . . . In-Reply-To: References: "There's got to be a morning after . . ." At 03:01 AM 8/25/2005, you wrote: > > What about making the letters out of something like plexiglass that will > > sing to bottom. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 18:24:25 -0400 From: Chris Davis Subject: Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread In-reply-to: Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20050825181709.00a264b0 [at] mail-hub.optonline.net> References: At 02:21 PM 8/25/2005 -0700, Jon Ares wrote: >Yes, sometimes the audience has a certain expectation for a show (they >want to see the chandelier, the staircase, the helicopter, etc) but I >don't know any 'general audience' that remembers the lighting. Why not >'change' the lights? Who remembers them anyway? (And I *am* an LD.) Lighting-wise, I'd say that ACL's signature look would be the Mondrian effect, or as it's put every time I've lit the show, "the part where you make the floor look like the Partridge Family bus". That look, along with the periaktois, is ACL's helicopter. As for "changing" the lights, it's actually something I've always wanted to do, but everyone I've done it for has wanted a recreation. Not that there's much that can be changed if you're doing the original choreography. Maybe a different color here, a slightly different approach to the "internal thought" sequences there, but the placement and purpose of the origional cues is so "right" that you'd most likely end up doing a derivative of them anyway, IMO. __________________________________ Chris Davis cdavis [at] queenstheatre.org Production Manager/Lighting Supervisor Queens Theatre In The Park http://www.queenstheatre.org ------------------------------ Message-ID: <000501c5a9c9$2eb6cde0$0600000a [at] BRUTUS> From: "Jon Ares" References: Subject: Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 16:03:18 -0700 > As for "changing" the lights, it's actually something I've always wanted > to do, but everyone I've done it for has wanted a recreation. Not that > there's much that can be changed if you're doing the original > choreography. Maybe a different color here, a slightly different approach > to the "internal thought" sequences there, but the placement and purpose > of the origional cues is so "right" that you'd most likely end up doing a > derivative of them anyway, IMO. Agreed. Most of the time, you just know it's "right." Did someone light this moment, and execute a cue here in this fashion on this particular show similar to me before me? Probably. - Jon Ares www.hevanet.com/acreative ------------------------------ From: "Tony Deeming" Subject: RE: Chorus line research Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:39:00 +0100 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: > It's also illegal to copy anyone's design... If you recreate Tharon's > lighting, the producers owe her a royalty for each performance. > > - John > As an amateur looking in on the world as a whole, I often chuckle at some of the comments I hear. Trying to justify a comment like "It's also illegal to copy anyone's design" on the same forum as I've heard "You HAVE to do this play in EXACTLY that way or you'll be in trouble with the author/copyrighter" seems a little humorous! I'm sure there are legitimate rules about what has to be done by whom to what and when in SOME cases, as well as what CAN'T be done, but there HAS to be a lot of artistic licence to this business. I mean, you do 'Oklahoma' - you HAVE to have that shiny li'l surrey, and it's GOT to be yeller with fringe on top! Not only will there be hire companies out there hiring the same surrey to different groups, there's only gonna be so many ways to build a different 4-wheeler, so how far do you go before you (might) infringe someone's copyrights? Same as a set of scenery - there will be guidelines in any script as to what's needed, but say something like 'Noises Off' - if my design for that happened to coincide with someone else's in some way, are they gonna sue me? And how can anyone in a different theatre with different instruments be accused of stealing the lighting plot for the majority of shows? OK, there will be some set pieces, (eg the 3 banks of aircraft lights with scrollers on left, right & back of Saigon spring to mind) but am I stealing design if I use something similar because I saw the show 10 years ago and remember it looked good so I use a memory? I've seen effects in shows that I've thought "Hey - that looked cool - I'll think about that for my (completely different) show next month" - that to me is complimentary to the designer in many ways. If no-one used an idea once in a while that they'd seen elsewhere we'd soon run out of ideas! Remember that plagiary is the sincerest form of compliment (or summat like that!). Just my thoughts TD ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 20:15:56 -0400 Subject: Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread From: Bruce Purdy Message-ID: In-Reply-To: > A faithful reproduction of the original > Or > A newer updated version incorporating scrollers, moving lights, etc... > Personally, I would always look to the original version first, and then ask yourself if there is a *need or a reason* to make changes. Sometimes an update here or there is called for due to "Changing times", or due to limitations of your budget or facilities. What I vehemently object to is "Change for change's sake". This summer, two local community theatre companies both happened to do "Sweeney Todd" - the second being in my venue. The first was as close to a reproduction of the version I fell in love with on Broadway, as their abilities would allow. The actress playing Mrs Lovett could have been Angela Lansbury's clone! Her delivery was fantastic, and I felt like I was seeing the original again. The director for the second production took a different approach. He criticised the other production for just being a "Carbon copy" and vowed to make *his* version "original". Mrs. Lovett had a much different interpretation, and wasn't nearly as funny. One particular scene with Pirelli was changed in such a way that it just didn't make sense. I asked the director why he had changed it, and he replied that he had to in order to make a particular gag that he created work. (It didn't anyway.) I felt that the first production was much better, and would have felt cheated had I paid to see the second one. I understand the director's urge to put his stamp on his production, but the original was as good as it was for a reason. To recreate that, allows a new audience that didn't have the opportunity to see it on Broadway to experience the show the way it was "Meant to be done". If there is a real *reason* to change something, then go for it. But don't change things just because you can. On the other hand, sometimes major changes are made in terms of setting, time period etc. to create a totally new interpretation. (Such as Leanardo DeCrapio's film version of "Romeo & Juliet".) In this case, make sure that advertising highlights the fact that it is an "Original interpretation" or you'll have a ticked off audience. Of course all the above is my personal opinion. The views expressed do not necessarily represent those of this station or our sponsors. Bruce -- Bruce Purdy Technical Director Smith Opera House ------------------------------ From: IAEG [at] aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 20:34:38 EDT Subject: Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread In a message dated 8/25/05 8:16:42 PM, bpurdy [at] rochester.rr.com writes: << To recreate that, allows a new audience that didn't have the opportunity to see it on Broadway to experience the show the way it was "Meant to be done". >> but, , as I have heard, , Sonheim's original concept was for it to be a small chamber show and he wasn't particularly fond of the industrial gantry / Industrial Revolution to the max setting, , so, , "meant to be done" is in and of itself a pretty relative concept very best, Keith Arsenault ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 20:38:50 -0400 Subject: Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread From: Bruce Purdy Message-ID: In-Reply-To: > so, , "meant to be done" is in and of itself a pretty relative concept Point taken. Bruce -- Bruce Purdy Technical Director Smith Opera House ------------------------------ From: IAEG [at] aol.com Message-ID: <1a3.3a927ecb.303fbf5d [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 20:42:05 EDT Subject: Re: Chorus Line the new version another discussion thread In a message dated 8/25/05 8:35:22 PM, IAEG [at] aol.com writes: << Sonheim's original concept >> ack, , , drives me crazy when I make a typo like that, I beg forgiveness very best, Keith Arsenault ------------------------------ End of Stagecraft Digest #500 *****************************