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X-Real-To: stagecraftlist [at] theatrical.net Received: by prxy.net (CommuniGate Pro PIPE 4.2.10) with PIPE id 24560390; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 03:01:55 -0700 X-ListServer: CommuniGate Pro LIST 4.2.10 List-Unsubscribe: List-ID: Message-ID: From: "Stagecraft" Sender: "Stagecraft" To: "Stagecraft" Precedence: list Subject: Stagecraft Digest #508 Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 03:01:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.5 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,AWL,BAYES_00, SARE_MILLIONSOF autolearn=ham version=3.0.4 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.4 (2005-06-05) on prxy.net X-Spam-Level: X-TFF-CGPSA-Version: 1.4f2 X-prxy-Spam-Filter: Scanned For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- Stagecraft Digest, Issue #508 1. Out of Office AutoReply: Stagecraft Digest #507 by Steve Gambino 2. Re: on a not-really-serious-anymore note by "LES LIND" 3. Re: Ethics by "ladesigners [at] juno.com" 4. Re: on a not-really-serious-anymore note by "Fritz, Barry L" 5. Re: Ethics by Stan Pressner 6. Re: on a not-really-serious-anymore note by Dale Farmer 7. Re: on a serious note by "Tony Deeming" 8. Re: on a not-really-serious-anymore note by Herrick Goldman 9. Re: Relief for New Orleans by "Jon Ares" 10. Re: on a serious note by "Tony Deeming" 11. Re: on a serious note by "Paul Schreiner" 12. Re: on a not-really-serious-anymore note by Kevin Lee Allen 13. Re: on a serious note by "Tony Deeming" 14. Re: on a serious note by "Paul Schreiner" 15. Re: on a serious note by "Tony Deeming" 16. Re: on a serious note by "Jon Ares" 17. Re: on a not-really-serious-anymore note by "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" 18. Re: on a serious note by "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" 19. Re: on a serious note by Steve Larson 20. Re: on a serious note by "C. Dopher" 21. Re: on a serious note by "Tony Deeming" 22. Re: on a serious note (and additional comments) by "C. Dopher" 23. Re: on a serious note by Pat Kight 24. Re: Pepsi at the Coke show by Mark O'Brien 25. Re: on a serious note by Stan Jensen 26. Re: Pepsi at the Coke show by "Jon Ares" 27. Re: Pepsi at the Coke show by Mark O'Brien 28. Re: on a serious note by Charlie Richmond 29. Re: Relief for New Orleans by "Maurice Moe Conn" 30. Re: on a serious note by Stuart Wheaton 31. Re: Plagiarism by June Abernathy 32. Re: on a serious note by Dale Farmer 33. Re: on a serious note by "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" 34. Re: Ethics by "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" 35. Re: on a serious note by Jerry Durand 36. Re: on a serious note by Greg Bierly 37. Re: on a serious note by Dale Farmer 38. Re: on a serious note (long and grouchy and obviously OT) by "Michael Finney" 39. Re: Katrina by Steve Larson 40. Re: on a serious note (long and grouchy and obviously OT) by Herrick Goldman 41. Press Release - Grand Opening by "Sam Fisher" 42. Re: on a serious note (long and grouchy and obviously OT) by "C. Andrew Dunning" 43. Re: on a serious note by IAEG [at] aol.com 44. Re: on a serious note by "Tony Deeming" 45. Re: on a serious note by IAEG [at] aol.com 46. Re: on a serious note by "Tony Deeming" 47. Re: Pepsi at the Coke show by "ladesigners [at] juno.com" 48. Re: Pepsi at the Coke show by "ladesigners [at] juno.com" 49. Ethics by CB 50. Re: on a serious note (and additional comments) by CB 51. Re: OSHA lifting limitations by CB 52. Re: Pepsi at the Coke show by "Occy" 53. Re: on a serious note (long and grouchy and obviously OT) by John McKernon 54. Doing something - student opportunity by MissWisc [at] aol.com 55. Fw: on a serious note (long and grouchy and obviously OT) by "chrisharris25" 56. Re: OSHA lifting limitations by "Chris Warner" *** Please update the subject line of your reply to use the subject *** line of the message you are replying to! Please only reply to *** one message subject in each reply. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message-ID: <9E53DD7DC667D311A47A0000F808EC8E02A7BC5D [at] strandla> From: Steve Gambino Subject: Out of Office AutoReply: Stagecraft Digest #507 Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 02:55:28 -0700 I am out of the office until Monday September 12th, and may not receive your e-mail until then. If you need immediate assistance please forward your e-mail to John.Sofranko [at] strandlighting.com or call John at 714-230-8143 Regards, Steve ------------------------------ Message-Id: Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 07:24:50 -0400 From: "LES LIND" Subject: Re: on a not-really-serious-anymore note We have some mighty fine breweries here in Pa including some good micros. If you're ever in Harrisburg make sure you stop by Appalachian Brewing Co on Cameron Street and try the Susquehanna Stout. It's delicious!!... Let me know when you're gonna visit and I'll meet you there and... discuss stagecraft. (had to keep it somewhat on topic) Les Les Lind, TD NHS Dramatics Northeastern High School Manchester, PA >>> bigfred [at] mindspring.com 9/1/05 8:27 PM >>> For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- Oh, I dunno... Some of us former Pennsylvanians might do you one better and send them some Yuengling - as soon as I can get my hands on some! (Although, the Shiner Bock that they serve 'round these parts makes a pretty tasty substitute in a pinch.) :P "Big Fred" Schoening -----Original Message----- If every one of us buys a six-pack of Leinies and sends it down, we can make sure no one lacks for good beer. ------------------------------ From: "ladesigners [at] juno.com" Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 13:28:06 GMT Subject: Re: Ethics Message-Id: <20050902.062851.19411.255983 [at] webmail28.lax.untd.com> I'd like to know who 'ditched' the show for my 'do not hire' list. /s/ Richard > He needed a designer STAT, as the one he had ditched the show. > Cris Dopher ------------------------------ Subject: RE: on a not-really-serious-anymore note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 09:59:33 -0400 Message-ID: From: "Fritz, Barry L" Mr. Yuengling will be speaking in one of my venues in a few days. =20 Thursday, September 22 [at] 7:00 PM=20 Family Business Center presents: Richard L. Yuengling,=20 Mr. Yuengling, the fifth generation of his family to run the D.G. Yuengling & Son Brewery in Pottsville, will help mark the 10th anniversary of Elizabethtown College's Family Business Center.=20 A lifelong resident of Pottsville, Yuengling is president and owner of America's oldest brewery. Since he took over in 1985, the Brewery has grown ten times in size, becoming the sixth largest brewery in the country. In addition to developing and perfecting the Brewery's portfolio of beer, ale and porter, Yuengling has introduced his company's products to new markets up and down the East Coast. Demand has grown so steadily that in the late 1990s when most of the American beer industry was shrinking, consolidating or both, Yuengling committed his company to its most aggressive growth plan ever by building a brand new facility in Pottsville and buying a former Stroh plant in Tampa Bay, Fla. In his hometown of Pottsville, Yuengling is a member of the Chamber of Commerce, volunteer fire department and both the Pottsville Rotary and Lions Clubs. He also serves on the Board of Directors at the Pottsville Hospital and Warne Clinic and is an active member of the Pennsylvania Brewers Association and the National Beer Wholesalers Association. He has also raised four daughters, all of whom are currently involved in the brewery's daily operations. Open to the public free of charge.=20 Registration is required by Sept. 12th.=20 Contact Rosa at 717-361-1275 Barry Fritz, Technical Operations Elizabethtown College > -----Original Message----- > From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Fred > Schoening > Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 8:28 PM > To: Stagecraft > Subject: Re: on a not-really-serious-anymore note >=20 > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- >=20 > Oh, I dunno... Some of us former Pennsylvanians might do you one better > and send them some Yuengling - as soon as I can get my hands on some! > (Although, the Shiner Bock that they serve 'round these parts makes a > pretty tasty substitute in a pinch.) :P >=20 > "Big Fred" Schoening > Technical Director > Dallas Theater Center > Dallas, Texas, USA >=20 >=20 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 10:07:25 -0400 From: Stan Pressner Subject: Re:Ethics In-reply-to: Message-id: <08D75C77-134A-48DE-865E-973C1FF9AEF9 [at] verizon.net> References: I would agree that having accepted the show, the assistant had a responsibility to finish it unless released by the theatre. That said, knowing the financial realities of this business, I always try to find a way to release assistants who have found a very good job. Best, Stan Pressner On Sep 2, 2005, at 6:00 AM, Stagecraft wrote: > I'm wondering if this was bad ethics, bad planning or what... And > am I the > only one who feels like having taken a show, you finish it. I'm > particularly interested in the opinions of Herrick, Stan, John, and > others > who've employed B-way assistants. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <43185D24.DBFDD3EA [at] cybercom.net> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 10:09:40 -0400 From: Dale Farmer Organization: The fuzz in the back of the fridge. Subject: Re: on a not-really-serious-anymore note References: "Fritz, Barry L" wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > Mr. Yuengling will be speaking in one of my venues in a few days. > > Thursday, September 22 [at] 7:00 PM > > Family Business Center presents: > Richard L. Yuengling, > Mr. Yuengling, the fifth generation of his family to run the D.G. > Yuengling & Son Brewery in Pottsville, will help mark the 10th > anniversary of Elizabethtown College's Family Business Center. Was working an event where the president of Pepsi Cola was speaker. They only had Coca-Cola products in the convention center for the speaker hospitality room. He used this as fodder for a few digs in his speech. --Dale ------------------------------ From: "Tony Deeming" Subject: RE: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:10:00 +0100 Message-ID: In-reply-to: > -----Original Message----- > From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net]On Behalf Of Paul > > Think there aren't some folks down there in ultra-survivalist mode right > now? Rabid peacenik that I am, I still can't say for sure that I > wouldn't be doing the same thing in their shoes, at least with the guns > and ammo. Drugs? Well, there's bound to be a shortage of good beer for > a while... > Isn't there ALWAYS a shortage of decent beer in the US...... 8-))))))))) TD ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 10:16:29 -0400 Subject: Re: on a not-really-serious-anymore note From: Herrick Goldman Message-ID: In-Reply-To: I'm surprised they didn't replace the Coke machines. Pepsi used to sponsor Pepsico-Summerfare and the entire SUNY purchase campus was only "allowed" Pepsi machines. On 9/2/05 10:09 AM, "Dale Farmer" wrote: >> anniversary of Elizabethtown College's Family Business Center. > > Was working an event where the president of Pepsi Cola was > speaker. They only had Coca-Cola products in the convention center > for the speaker hospitality room. He used this as fodder for a > few digs in his speech. > > --Dale > > > -- Herrick Goldman Lighting Designer, NYC www.HGLightingDesign.com 917-797-3624 "To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS ------------------------------ Message-ID: <000601c5afc9$09512f90$0600000a [at] BRUTUS> From: "Jon Ares" References:

Subject: Re: Relief for New Orleans Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 07:17:22 -0700 > Well a president that gives interviews saying he doesn't expect much > from other countries and that the USA will deal with it on its own, will > not do much good to get help from ppl outside the USA. > Yeah, what was up with that???? What a jerk... Oops, sorry... don't want this to spiral downward into a political discussion.... - Jon Ares www.hevanet.com/acreative ------------------------------ From: "Tony Deeming" Subject: RE: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:17:34 +0100 Message-ID: In-reply-to: > > I wish I could believe the looters taking guns, ammo and drugs > are intending > to re-sell for bread and water. > > - Jon Ares Not to mention those poor styarving souls taking pot shots with sniper rifles outside the hospitals.....??? TD ------------------------------ Subject: RE: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 10:28:57 -0400 Message-ID: <6E497ADB607656479C24E6D7BF6B505A0196C8FD [at] exchange.rmwc.edu> From: "Paul Schreiner" > Not to mention those poor styarving souls taking pot shots=20 > with sniper rifles outside the hospitals.....??? I think from what I've seen of that the ones involved are getting so desperate for assistance that when they see others getting aided or rescued they're taking it personally and basically telling the chopper pilots "Come pick me up or else." After four or five days sans food and water and stuff, can't say I wouldn't be doing the same, especially if you only see a few of those helicopters flying around... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 10:34:42 -0400 From: Kevin Lee Allen Subject: Re: on a not-really-serious-anymore note In-reply-to: Message-id: <5FA503CC-F12C-4CBB-9848-325D487A9F71 [at] klad.com> References:

I discovered this in Atlanta years ago, I always scheduled my trips =20 to allow time for a few. Not available here in the NE. On Sep 1, 2005, at 9:39 PM, gregg hillmar wrote: > Ah, the fresh Shiner Bock! I may have personally kept the Shiner =20 > brewery in business while in grad school in Austin... > ----- Kevin Lee Allen Architect of Dreams http://www.klad.com 973.744.6352.voice 201.280.3841.mobile klad [at] klad.com =F0 ------------------------------ From: "Tony Deeming" Subject: RE: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:44:04 +0100 Message-ID: In-reply-to: > > > Not to mention those poor styarving souls taking pot shots > > with sniper rifles outside the hospitals.....??? > > I think from what I've seen of that the ones involved are getting so > desperate for assistance that when they see others getting aided or > rescued they're taking it personally and basically telling the chopper > pilots "Come pick me up or else." After four or five days sans food and > water and stuff, can't say I wouldn't be doing the same, especially if > you only see a few of those helicopters flying around... > Er, is that what you believe they're doing??? They're not getting attention, so they shoot at the medical staff and choppers, hoping they'll take notice and come see the shooters instead???? Sorry, but hardship and catastrophe aside, what sort of people, even in desperation, would even contemplate that idea to be a go-er...???? And I KNOW that were I in their shoes I most certainly would NOT be pot shooting at anyone!! OK, I'd accept that some sort of PERSONAL protection MIGHT be justified, but that doesn't quite add up in this situation!! And another thing - the film & pictures I've seen of these looters (which admittedly MAY be biassed) shows people that look far from starving (prior to the hurricane) taking stuff that has nothing to do with survival - just stuff that's available and stealable! Again, I can accept to a point the taking of food, shelter and clothing on a 'needs' basis, but armfulls of sportswear, white goods on trolleys, other fancy goods.... Nope - that's just common or garden petty theft, no matter HOW you dress it up or try to justify it! OK - it's hard for me to appreciate the full situation from thousands of miles away in the UK, (though I did see a small measure of the power of a hurricane when Charley passed over us in orlando last August) but pictures speak a thousand words many times, and what I see doesnt support any excuses for the majority of looting. TD ------------------------------ Subject: RE: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 10:56:19 -0400 Message-ID: <6E497ADB607656479C24E6D7BF6B505A0196C8FE [at] exchange.rmwc.edu> From: "Paul Schreiner" > Nope - that's just common or garden petty theft, no=20 > matter HOW you dress it up or try to justify it! Please, please understand that I'm not trying to "justify" 99% of what's going on down there. I'm trying to understand it. Just because I can come up with some rationale or scenario mentally where I could theoretically see myself doing similar things, doesn't mean I'm justifying it. It means I'm trying not to demonize those responsible, because they're still human beings. Human beings caught in a situation I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy, mind you. Enough (or the right kind of) stress on anyone will result in actions you wouldn't normally see from that person... ------------------------------ From: "Tony Deeming" Subject: RE: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 16:03:21 +0100 Message-ID: In-reply-to: > -----Original Message----- > From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net]On Behalf Of Paul > Schreiner > Sent: 02 September 2005 15:56 > To: Stagecraft > Subject: Re: on a serious note > > > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > > Nope - that's just common or garden petty theft, no > > matter HOW you dress it up or try to justify it! > > Please, please understand that I'm not trying to "justify" 99% of what's > going on down there. I'm trying to understand it. Just because I can > come up with some rationale or scenario mentally where I could > theoretically see myself doing similar things, doesn't mean I'm > justifying it. It means I'm trying not to demonize those responsible, > because they're still human beings. > > Human beings caught in a situation I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy, > mind you. Enough (or the right kind of) stress on anyone will result in > actions you wouldn't normally see from that person... > Fair enough, to a point. However, form my (distant) vantage point, I see far more opportunism than survivalism in what's being reported. I've no doubt at all that there are (probably hundreds) of valid hardship and even tragic stories yet to be told but it's hard to spare the sympathy due those cases for the blatant criminal acts of those who are just taking advantage of a very bad situation. TD ------------------------------ Message-ID: <000d01c5afd1$0232da80$0600000a [at] BRUTUS> From: "Jon Ares" References: Subject: Re: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 08:14:26 -0700 > Fair enough, to a point. However, form my (distant) vantage point, I see > far > more opportunism than survivalism in what's being reported. I've no doubt > at > all that there are (probably hundreds) of valid hardship and even tragic > stories yet to be told but it's hard to spare the sympathy due those cases > for the blatant criminal acts of those who are just taking advantage of a > very bad situation. There have been smatterings of interviews with Criminalogists and Sociologists regarding this very issue.... here in Portland, we have a Socialogy/Criminalogy professor that's well known as an expert in race/poverty/terrorism, and there was a good interview with him on one of the local channels. He's actually just finishing a book on race, poverty, opportunistic crime, etc right now. Katrina is probably going to give him an insightful last chapter. - Jon Ares www.hevanet.com/acreative ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" Subject: RE: on a not-really-serious-anymore note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:25:16 -0400 Message-ID: <000401c5afd2$85fc8900$6601a8c0 [at] Dell> In-reply-to: > Pepsi used to sponsor Pepsico-Summerfare and the entire SUNY > purchase campus was only "allowed" Pepsi machines. When I tuaght at Purchase, it was a major accomplishment when we got Diet Coke in the machines. Not only did Pepsi sponsor the annual festival, one of the theaters in the Performing Arts Center is the "Pepsico" Theatre and the campus is right cross the street from the world headquarters of Pepsico. ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" Subject: RE: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:25:50 -0400 Message-ID: <000501c5afd2$9ddff3e0$6601a8c0 [at] Dell> In-reply-to: Those who have housing to offer can sign up at: http://www.hurricanehousing.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 11:46:50 -0400 Subject: Re: on a serious note From: Steve Larson Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Until you've worked and lived for some time in NO, you can't fully understand what is going thru their minds. One of the main reasons I left NO was because of folks like these. Not having food and water simply brought out the true character of some of them. My house was robbed while I slept; my pickup truck was stolen from behind the theatre in the middle of the afternoon, while UNO students played volleyball across the street. Not one student would talk to me or the police about what had happened. I recovered it two weeks later, totally trashed. The thieves were so stupid that they overlooked the key to the chrome rims in the glove compartment. When they couldn't remove them, they took a tire iron and tore up the upholstery and headliner and gouged the paint on every panel of the truck. I'm glad I'm not there. I have friends that are trying to work in first aid shelters quickly set up down there. Police escorted the medical folks to area drug stores and pharmacies, where they cleared out all the pharmaceuticals in garbage bags to take to the clinics. Without the police, they would have not succeeded. Gangs still tried to take the medical supplies despite the police. Steve > From: "Tony Deeming" > They're not getting attention, so they shoot at the medical staff and > choppers, hoping they'll take notice and come see the shooters instead???? > > Sorry, but hardship and catastrophe aside, what sort of people, even in > desperation, would even contemplate that idea to be a go-er...???? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 12:01:16 -0400 Subject: Re: on a serious note From: "C. Dopher" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000901c5aef2$2dd26910$6601a8c0 [at] Dell> On 9/1/05 8:39 AM, "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" wrote: > > >> And when was the last time you went swimming in the >> local creek? > > My local creek is the Hudson River; if it's all the same, I'd rather not > swim in it. It's perfectly safe to swim in the Hudson, Jeff. Heck, a lot of the local triathlons begin with a two-mile swim in the river. Really, it's a lot cleaner than people assume. Perfectly safe. Pay no attention to the hazmat team standing by with fire hoses. Cris Dopher ------------------------------ From: "Tony Deeming" Subject: RE: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:04:15 +0100 Message-ID: In-reply-to: That sort of backs up my read on the situation, really! Every city in every 'civilised' country will have this sort of element these days - heck, we have 'em in our relatively small town. Opportunistic, lazy, workshy criminals who give the genuinely poor but hardworking people of this world the undeserved bad rep. Grrrrr........! Blood boiling at the thought .............. 8-(( TD > Until you've worked and lived for some time > in NO, you can't fully understand what is > going thru their minds. One of the main > reasons I left NO was because of folks like > these. Not having food and water simply > brought out the true character of some of > them. My house was robbed while I slept; > my pickup truck was stolen from behind the > theatre in the middle of the afternoon, while > UNO students played volleyball across the street. > Not one student would talk to me or the police > about what had happened. I recovered it two > weeks later, totally trashed. The thieves were > so stupid that they overlooked the key to the > chrome rims in the glove compartment. When they > couldn't remove them, they took a tire iron and > tore up the upholstery and headliner and gouged > the paint on every panel of the truck. > I'm glad I'm not there. I have > friends that are trying to work in first > aid shelters quickly set up down there. Police > escorted the medical folks to area drug stores > and pharmacies, where they cleared out all > the pharmaceuticals in garbage bags to take > to the clinics. Without the police, they > would have not succeeded. Gangs still tried > to take the medical supplies despite the police. > > Steve > > > From: "Tony Deeming" > > > They're not getting attention, so they shoot at the medical staff and > > choppers, hoping they'll take notice and come see the shooters > instead???? > > > > Sorry, but hardship and catastrophe aside, what sort of people, even in > > desperation, would even contemplate that idea to be a go-er...???? > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 12:14:07 -0400 Subject: Re: on a serious note (and additional comments) From: "C. Dopher" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <217.83e3a7b.30489c02 [at] aol.com> On 9/1/05 2:01 PM, "IAEG [at] aol.com" wrote: > > In a message dated 9/1/05 1:58:25 PM, MissWisc [at] aol.com writes: > > << I told my husband "That's not a strong > enough structure! You don't put people under a roof span that great in a > tornado, shouldn't do it in a hurricane either. The roof won't make it > through those > high winds and if there is any breach or the storm surge overfloods the > levees, the whole city will flood!" Heck if little old me in tinytown WI > knew > that, why didn't the FEMA/engineer/PTB folks figure it out? >> > > likewise, > > if they knew a CAT 4 - 5 hurricane was on it's way to this region, , with the > large populations of poor folks AND the levy issues > > why did it take them a day AFTER if hit to decide to send US Navy Hospital > ships from NORFOLK to New Orleans ? ( when will they reach there ? ? ? > after > New Orelans is evacutated perhaps ? ) The answer to both your questions is quite simple really. The governments - local, state, and federal - all knew that the superdome wasn't strong enough and that the levees wouldn't hold up. They knew the city would flood. They knew that thousands would end up dead, homeless, stranded and starving to death, etc. You see, They put the word out to evacuate NO on communications channels mostly listened to by upper- and middle-class people and theatre technicians. But on channels listened to by actors, the uneducated, and the poor, they only suggested the tried-and-proven "duck and cover" method or, if they must, going to the superdome and riverwalk. Yes, you can probably go ahead and read "white" and "black" into the former and latter groups. The governments count on disasters like this to thin the population of "undesireables" and do their subtle best to support it. I have no proof of this; tin foil hats are free! Cris Dopher (Disclaimer for those of you who have no sense of irony or dark humour: I don't really believe this and would be horrified if it were true, OK?) ------------------------------ Message-ID: <431879A5.5000000 [at] peak.org> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 09:11:17 -0700 From: Pat Kight Subject: Re: on a serious note References: In-Reply-To: Tony Deeming wrote: Paul Schreiner wrote: >>Please, please understand that I'm not trying to "justify" 99% of what's >>going on down there. I'm trying to understand it. Just because I can >>come up with some rationale or scenario mentally where I could >>theoretically see myself doing similar things, doesn't mean I'm >>justifying it. It means I'm trying not to demonize those responsible, >>because they're still human beings. >>Human beings caught in a situation I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy, >>mind you. Enough (or the right kind of) stress on anyone will result in >>actions you wouldn't normally see from that person... > Fair enough, to a point. However, form my (distant) vantage point, I see far > more opportunism than survivalism in what's being reported. I've no doubt at > all that there are (probably hundreds) of valid hardship and even tragic > stories yet to be told but it's hard to spare the sympathy due those cases > for the blatant criminal acts of those who are just taking advantage of a > very bad situation. What I'm seeing, from the safety of thousands of miles away, is a rapid breakdown of what we like to think of as civilization in a place where the poor have been dirt-poor for generations and have very little to lose anyway, and even that little has been ripped from them by this disaster. Some people - not all of them certainly, but enough to be highly visible and highly dangerous - appear to have reverted to feral, "screw you, I'm getting mine" behavior. I don't think this is unique to New Orleans; I daresay that almost any large, densely populated urban area in the US would see the same thing happen under similar circumstances. It's the post-apocalyptic urban nightmare, and it's closer to most of us than we dare imagine. This is not to make excuses for the lawless and what they're doing. It's horrendous. But it results in part from generations of living on the edge of despair, and as much as the rest of us like to think we'd behave better, we simply don't share the reality of their day-to-day lives. I sit here in the dry comfort of my home wondering "if I'd grown up in squalor and poverty, if I had no resources - including no car - and had been told I needed to get out of town and was on my own to find a way to do it, if I had kids to feed and nothing to feed them and there were bodies piling up in the street and I saw no prospect of help on the way, if when the cops and Guard finally showed up they seemed more interested in pointing guns at me than helping me - what would I do?" I don't know. I do know what I can do now, and that's give money to the Red Cross to try to get some relief to these people. Because their circumstances right now are unimaginable, and getting worse. I'll save my moral judgments for some other time. -- Pat Kight kightp [at] peak.org ------------------------------ In-Reply-To: References: Message-Id: Cc: marko [at] email.arizona.edu (Mark O'Brien) From: Mark O'Brien Subject: Re:Pepsi at the Coke show Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 09:23:13 -0700 Every-time I worked a Pepsi show there was only Pepsi in the hotel, or venue. Frito-Lay on the craft service table. Before they sold it off to Yum Foods, Pizza Hut, Taco Bell & KFC in trailers on the loading dock. (I must say that the food from those trailers tasted nothing like the food one bought at the restaurants) When we worked IBM shows, (a long time ago) we wore coat & tie backstage, and they closed the bars and locked the mini-bars. When we worked Buick shows, we best not show up in a Toyota rent a car... When in Rome... Mark-O Mark O'Brien Opera Technical Director University of Arizona, School of Music Tucson, AZ 520/621-7025 520/591-1803 Mobile On Sep 2, 2005, at 7:16 AM, Herrick Goldman wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > > --------------------------------------------------- > > I'm surprised they didn't replace the Coke machines. > > Pepsi used to sponsor Pepsico-Summerfare and the entire SUNY purchase > campus > was only "allowed" Pepsi machines. > > > On 9/2/05 10:09 AM, "Dale Farmer" wrote: > > >>> anniversary of Elizabethtown College's Family Business Center. >> >> Was working an event where the president of Pepsi Cola was >> speaker. They only had Coca-Cola products in the convention center >> for the speaker hospitality room. He used this as fodder for a >> few digs in his speech. >> >> --Dale >> >> >> > > -- > Herrick Goldman > Lighting Designer, NYC > www.HGLightingDesign.com > 917-797-3624 > "To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness > and in > light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS > > ------------------------------ In-Reply-To: References:

Message-Id: From: Stan Jensen Subject: Re: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 12:26:05 -0400 On Sep 2, 2005, at 12:11 PM, Pat Kight wrote: > . . .their circumstances right now are unimaginable, and getting > worse. I'll save my moral judgments for some other time. Thank you, Pat. Stan Jensen Central Michigan University Department of Speech Communication and Dramatic Art Moore 242 Mount Pleasant, MI 48859 (989) 774-1990 office (989) 774-2498 fax ------------------------------ Message-ID: <002101c5afdb$b2278440$0600000a [at] BRUTUS> From: "Jon Ares" References:

Subject: Re: Pepsi at the Coke show Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 09:30:57 -0700 > Every-time I worked a Pepsi show there was only Pepsi in the hotel, or > venue. Frito-Lay on the craft service table. I did an American Tobacco sales gig years ago.... yep, smoking was allowed for this group, although the majority were into smokeless chaw. Yes, the hotel had to provide spit cups on the tables.... It was a gross 3 days.... - Jon Ares www.hevanet.com/acreative ------------------------------ In-Reply-To: References:

Message-Id: <171ca39237a6112af4a5906847ca018b [at] email.arizona.edu> Cc: marko [at] email.arizona.edu (Mark O'Brien) From: Mark O'Brien Subject: Re: Pepsi at the Coke show Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 09:36:16 -0700 Oh yeah, I forgot my show with US Smokeless Tobacco Co. Their theme song " It's not smoke, but we-re on fire" 2,000 sales men/women in the ballroom with cups with napkins in them. -disgusting, I thought. Mark-O Mark O'Brien Opera Technical Director University of Arizona, School of Music Tucson, AZ 520/621-7025 520/591-1803 Mobile On Sep 2, 2005, at 9:30 AM, Jon Ares wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > > --------------------------------------------------- > >> Every-time I worked a Pepsi show there was only Pepsi in the hotel, >> or venue. Frito-Lay on the craft service table. > > I did an American Tobacco sales gig years ago.... yep, smoking was > allowed for this group, although the majority were into smokeless > chaw. Yes, the hotel had to provide spit cups on the tables.... > It was a gross 3 days.... > > - Jon Ares > www.hevanet.com/acreative ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:42:34 +0100 (BST) From: Charlie Richmond Subject: Re: on a serious note In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References:

On Fri, 2 Sep 2005, Stan Jensen wrote: > On Sep 2, 2005, at 12:11 PM, Pat Kight wrote: > >> . . .their circumstances right now are unimaginable, and getting worse. >> I'll save my moral judgments for some other time. > > Thank you, Pat. Absolutely! Pat's post is the one I wish I had the time and ability to write and expresses my feelings and opinions perfectly. Charlie ------------------------------ Message-ID: In-Reply-To: From: "Maurice Moe Conn" Subject: Re: Relief for New Orleans Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 18:11:34 +0000 Well a president that gives interviews saying he doesn't expect >>much >>from other countries and that the USA will deal with it on its own, will >>not do much good to get help from ppl outside the USA. >> Sometimes we're (U.S.) right sometimes we're wrong....but why do we have to be wrong so ofton Moe Long Reach Long Riders announce dates for the 2006 Charlty Ride. Check out www.sapsis-rigging.com/LRLR.html for more information. >From: "Jon Ares" >Reply-To: "Stagecraft" >To: "Stagecraft" >Subject: Re: Relief for New Orleans >Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 07:17:22 -0700 > >For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see >--------------------------------------------------- > >> > > >Yeah, what was up with that???? What a jerk... > >Oops, sorry... don't want this to spiral downward into a political >discussion.... > > - Jon Ares >www.hevanet.com/acreative > ------------------------------ Message-ID: <43189B1D.5050005 [at] fuse.net> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 14:34:05 -0400 From: Stuart Wheaton Subject: Re: on a serious note References: In-Reply-To: ladesigners [at] juno.com wrote: > Was the COMFORT or the MERCY, or both, or some other ship(s) deployed? > /s/ Richard > Comfort was deployed the 31st...She is now sailing from Baltimore. If the Navy had acted in anticipation of the need, she could have been sitting, fully stocked, waiting medical teams, in Miami or Orlando or Tampa when FEMA asked for her, not Baltimore. The Navy can put their ships anywhere they want to at any time, even if they can't use them without federal activation. Stuart ------------------------------ Message-ID: <20050902184451.97666.qmail [at] web33112.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:44:51 -0700 (PDT) From: June Abernathy Subject: Re: Plagiarism >OK... hypothetically... let's say I'm working a show >where I'm pretty confident that copyright is being >violated. Whom do I call? FBI? (Copyright is federal law.) Copyright violation is hard to go after, particularly if you aren't the person who actually DOES hold it. >Publisher? Folks who handle the performing rights >(Tams Witmark, MTI, etc.)? Yes, that's the ticket. It's the violation of or lack of a licensing agreement that will usually be addressed. Contact the rights holders. You can send a letter, instead of calling, if you'd rather. You can also ask that your name be left out of it, which is a good precaution if you want to work with those people again. >And what do I tell them when I do call? You say XXXX school/church/organization is putting on a production of your show and I don't believe that they have secured the rights from you folks. Or, that they are doing Grease/Little Shop/A Chorus Line/whatever that they have licensed from you, but are adding songs from the movie, or adding or deleting dialogue, or whatever. It can't hurt to include that the Address and phone number of the theater is ###, and it's being directed/produced/whatever by George Spelvin. Some license holders do have alternate versions of shows available. For instance, I know there is a school version of GREASE with less bad language and sexual references. I would not be surprised to find that there was a similar "lite" version of A CHORUS LINE available from the publishers. I know there is a version of ONCE ON THIS ISLAND made for use with a mixed race cast. Even if there isn't a specific alternative version available, if you like a show but have problems with specific things in the script, you probably aren't the first person with the problem, and contacting the rights holders with the concern might net you permission to remove some particularly offensive material. OTOH, there are just some properties that are not suitable for some performing companies, and my personal opinion is that it's better to choose a more appropriate show than to mangle an innappropriate one beyond recognition. And often, the rights holders will agree with me, and rather than granting any permissions for changes, will just urge you to choose another show. >What if it is a review with some Broadway things >(copied from the vocal scores at the library!) and >some choral scores from Hal Leonard? You can still contact the rights holders of the show(s) in question (and/or Hal Leonard) with the info, and let them ferret out whether there is a violation. Some rights holders will allow you to do "concert versions" of their shows (MTI even has a bunch of them available as a separate package), but some won't. Revues from mixed sources are complicated, because many organizations believe that they are covered by a blanket BMI/ASCAP license for such things, when in fact, using music from theatrical sources gets more complicated. Performing the songs in a dramatic context - i.e., as part of show, changes the rules. Using more than a certain number of songs (3? can't remember) from a given show or by a given composer can put you in a different rights situation. It's not simple, and most of the folks at ASCAP or BMI are clue free and will tell you you are all right when you actually aren't. The folks at MTI or Tams or Sam French might actually be MORE helpful in helping you to do what you want to do (or almost), particularly if consulted in advance. ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ------------------------------ Message-ID: <43189F2E.70B518DE [at] cybercom.net> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 14:51:26 -0400 From: Dale Farmer Organization: The fuzz in the back of the fridge. Subject: Re: on a serious note References:

Stuart Wheaton wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > ladesigners [at] juno.com wrote: > > > Was the COMFORT or the MERCY, or both, or some other ship(s) deployed? > > /s/ Richard > > > Comfort was deployed the 31st...She is now sailing from > Baltimore. If the Navy had acted in anticipation of the > need, she could have been sitting, fully stocked, waiting > medical teams, in Miami or Orlando or Tampa when FEMA asked > for her, not Baltimore. > > The Navy can put their ships anywhere they want to at any > time, even if they can't use them without federal activation. > > Stuart The hospital ships were built for war, to handle the many casualties that war tends to produce. That is within the DoD's scope. They are required not to act until directed by civilian authority. That means the executive branch has to give the orders, and the legislative branch has to authorize the money, before anything happens. Five days before Katrina hit the gulf coast, who was willing to spend the millions of dollars needed to make that happen? And if Katrina had degraded down to a category three, instead of up to category 5, I'll bet that that there would be a chorus of angst from the usual suspects about the government wasting money. There have been periodic efforts to raise the money to have them go do humanitarian aid with volunteer crews. There has been only one such trip in the 15 or so years since they were commissioned. You got a few million in your back pocket to pay for the next one? 20/20 hindsight is easy. Tell me where the next hurricane is going to be and how strong it's going to be, and how much damage it will cause, five days in the future. --Dale ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" Subject: RE: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:00:16 -0400 Message-ID: <000101c5aff0$917653b0$6601a8c0 [at] Dell> In-Reply-To: Perhaps someone can answer this. The Comfort is referred to as the USNS Comfort. Does "USNS" stand for "United States Naval Ship", and does the designation mean it's staffed by civilian rather than by military personnel? ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" Subject: RE: Ethics Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:34:00 -0400 Message-ID: <000701c5aff5$4874ce30$6601a8c0 [at] Dell> In-Reply-To: > I'd love to know who this designer is...But it's probably=20 > better I don't. You may recall that several months ago I posted about my being called in = the day of the first lighting rehearsal because the previous designer had = walked out. Cris and I have compared notes and - surprise, surprise - it = appears to be the same person. If you'll email Cris or me off-list, we'll tell you the name.=20 ------------------------------ Message-Id: <6.2.3.4.0.20050902123945.03b96dd8 [at] 192.168.0.13> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 12:40:12 -0700 From: Jerry Durand Subject: Re: on a serious note In-Reply-To: References:

At 11:34 AM 9/2/2005, you wrote: >Comfort was deployed the 31st...She is now sailing from >Baltimore. If the Navy had acted in anticipation of the need, she >could have been sitting, fully stocked, waiting medical teams, in >Miami or Orlando or Tampa when FEMA asked for her, not Baltimore. Hard to get the ship to Orlando. :) -- Jerry Durand Durand Interstellar, Inc. 219 Oak Wood Way Los Gatos, California 95032-2523 USA tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886 web: www.interstellar.com ------------------------------ In-Reply-To: References:

Message-Id: <9bdd8494a03b606efafb8e622813b311 [at] dejazzd.com> From: Greg Bierly Subject: Re: on a serious note Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 16:11:09 -0400 > Hard to get the ship to Orlando. :) I am glad someone was awake to catch that one. LOL at the mental image of the Disney Cruise ship docking at the Pirates of the Carribean ride. Greg Bierly Technical Director Hempfield HS ------------------------------ Message-ID: <4318B352.47CBE7B2 [at] cybercom.net> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 16:17:22 -0400 From: Dale Farmer Organization: The fuzz in the back of the fridge. Subject: Re: on a serious note References: "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > Perhaps someone can answer this. > > The Comfort is referred to as the USNS Comfort. Does "USNS" stand for > "United States Naval Ship", and does the designation mean it's staffed by > civilian rather than by military personnel? That is correct. It is part of the military sealift command. Civilian ships crew, with a navy medical staff, and navy support staff. If you go to the USN web site link that I posted earlier, there is an info page about the ship. --Dale ------------------------------ Subject: Re: on a serious note (long and grouchy and obviously OT) Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 14:05:12 -0700 Message-ID: From: "Michael Finney" OK, kids - a few random comments and reality checks related to the current response to Katrina. And I apologize in advance if I get snippy - I've spent the last two nights working on the transshipment of somewhere around 35,000 tons of equipment and food stocks from our SoCal warehouses to the teams in the field in NO (and helping piggyback the Red Cross shipments on our rail stock). And we're down about half of our heavy equipment operators, as they're currently deployed to the Middle East, which means I have a radio in one hand while I'm driving a forklift. And we're continuing to ship support supplies and equipment to our technical and graves registration teams over the weekend. So I'm just a little tired and grouchy. And too darned wired at this point to sleep. The current situation in NO has always been one of FEMA's "Big Three" for natural disasters - a combination Cat 4+ (or equivalent storm surge) with a levee breach. Wanna really get scared? It could have been much worse - the real nightmare scenario was a 4-5 point breach of the river side levee, which would have meant 8-10 feet more water and no way to manage the drainage. Some of the reasons NO has always been a nightmare scenario:=20 Best case for a total evacuation was 2 days - most planners agreed on 3. Mandatory evacuation was called less than 24 hours before the leading edge of the storm was scheduled to hit. And NO doesn't have enough police or emergency services people to *force* an evacuation. And, it was pretty well acknowledged that a disproportionate number of the people remaining would be poor, lacking in basic resources within their immediate neighborhood, and (probably) very resistant to authority. The communications systems in NO are also old, badly maintained, and at-risk for damage in flooding...which means that distributing information (even assuming that the local authorities left sufficient personnel in place to do so) was going to be significantly less efficient than it would be in a location like LA (where the comm systems are nicely hardened and distributed). Plans (at least the ones that I've seen) called for National Guard support for any forced evacuation. Unfortunately, the Guard can't deploy until the Governor says so...and he won't do that until the locals ask (he *can*, he just probably *won't*)...and delays kill. It probably doesn't help that the last couple of times NO got the "holy Jesus, run for high ground" notice they ended up getting missed. Never underestimate the ability of people to justify *not* moving.... There aren't many places within the city to establish as disaster relief locations. At least not many places that would be dry, stable, and (I hate to say this) capable of being secured. The Superdome was always a last-ditch option (soft roof, weird airflow, insufficient and vulnerable water supplies, no pre-positioned stocks because there isn't anywhere to store them, etc). The Convention Center has similar issues...not to mention it's usually under some kind of construction.=20 In this situation, there isn't much of an option for local transport of personnel or material other than boat or air - and those are not great choices. Quick reality check: I can fit 30-35 people in a standard military transport truck. I can fit 11 in a Blackhawk. I can fit 6-8 in a RIB; less in most flat-bottomed boats. Yeah, the birds are faster - but they're just not as efficient at getting big loads where they need to go. We won't even start to talk about the issues of range, maintenance, operational personnel, etc. Boats and air assets require a lot more support than trucks. =20 Local hospitals in NO have been shamefully underfunded for years. Disaster preparedness took second seat to keep the doors open in a lot of cases - especially the hospitals serving the most poor communities (the same ones where most of the people who couldn't leave were expected to end up). Not to mention that they suffer the same issues related to stupidly lax building codes (or allowed exemptions, anyway) related to updating the buildings...they're old, they're vulnerable, and a lot of them have done incredible work in the face of failing facilities (even before this event). The docks along the river were expected to take a serious hit in case of a Cat 4+ storm - and most available US flagged vessels in the region don't have provisions to unload from their own decks. The ones that do probably have existing deck loads at any given time that would have to be offloaded before they could be used. Don't forget - a huge amount of the dock capacity there is devoted to *on-loading* grain, *not* to off-loading palletized materials. Oh, yeah - most of these vessels are also going to run for the open ocean to ride out the storm.... Some of our special cases for this event: A large amount of the support that FEMA relies on for response to a flooding or hurricane event like this are military - and most of those are National Guard. Most of those resources are logistical (material transport and quartermaster duties), security (military police), or air transport (yes, it's not as efficient - but it's the best choice for "right now" response to hot spots). Unfortunately, those are many of the same assets that have been called up and sent off. Replacements? Not as many, not as well trained (if at all) in this kind of response, and (frankly) not always on everybody's call list ('cause we don't know the new guys, and we don't' *ever* know in advance when our assets are going to be deployed by the military). Call up the reservists? OK - expect 3 days to get them physically in place and another week to get their full equipment load. And they're not any better trained than the Guard...and probably don't know the area or community as well. We're already running into the same concerns for response to the wildfire season (I understand that the governor of Montana has already asked for his Guard troops to be returned so they're available for wildfires...they're trained in it, and their air assets (fixed and rotary wing) can be configured for fire suppression in many cases). You wanna an example: I saw reports yesterday from Gulfport where the Guard got several trucks of water supplies in...only to discover that there wasn't enough manpower available to both provide security *and* unload. Some of the refugees stepped up and helped...but that's typical of what happens when a lot of your assets just aren't around. Imagine a less cooperative (and probably armed) group of refugees. The storm surge was bigger than expected, and it came from the lake as well as from the gulf. *That's* what killed the levee, not the hurricane. Historically, the wetlands have mitigated that to some extent, but the wetlands are much smaller than they were even 15 years ago. I'm not qualified to talk about "why", but studies point to a combination of warmer climate and the need for the wetlands to experience periodic flooding (which they haven't, due to a number of factors - including aggressive flood control measures). The Corps of Engineers has been trying to deal with this for years (decades in some cases), but have been chronically underfunded. In the words of one of the former commanders: "these projects are huge, slow, expensive, and just not very sexy...they're the first ones on the block when funding dies". The feds declared an official "emergency" 24 hours before the storm hit. That allowed for a certain amount of pre-positioning. Unfortunately, FEMA is now part of Homeland Security and the added level of bureaucracy has slowed average response times. Duh - imagine that. In a lot of cases, the Homeland Security managers in place do *not* have experience in emergency response...it's a specialized field, and one of the reasons that even non-professionals like me get pulled into it. (which makes a lot of our Homeland Security managers just a little nuts). With little or no pre-positioned supplies within NO, *everything* depended on response from outside the perimeter of the disaster. Even in the case of "The Big One", we assume access to a certain amount of pre-positioned (or scavenged) local supplies. I've been hearing a fair amount of crap about "why weren't the ships there right away", and "why didn't "they" fly in everything right away". Reality check (and yet more reasons this has always been a nightmare scenario): =20 NO is actually inland (from the point of view of shipping), up the Mississippi a ways, off the Gulf. Both of which are full of things like oil rigs and barges and floating casinos that tend to break loose and float around in big storms. Think putting a big, unwieldy, hospital or supply ship in the middle of that is a good idea? Do the math - do you want to *know* that the asset is available after the storm, or would you rather *hope* it dodges all the dangers and can respond 14 -18 hours earlier? Ships ain't fast, kids. (not to mention that there is a certain lag time in stocking the perishable supplies onto a hospital ship - again, something I don't deal with...but I know we always factor 48 hours into any application of ship borne resources just to get it off the dock). We looked at airlifting and deploying smaller watercraft previously...but the people who really know how to do that are currently deployed. I think I could put my hands on 7 or 8 teams experienced in deploying small watercraft from the back of helicopters (although there may be some Coasties that I haven't worked with) - helpful? Probably not...they don't have any experience in disaster response, they're special operations troops. r Airlift is a great concept. (Assuming that the air assets are in-country...). Unfortunately, *both* local airports that could handle large aircraft were underwater until yesterday...and there was some serious questions about their condition at that point. Ditto any of the rough-field locations (like the interstates). Even if you could get the aircraft on the ground, the ground transport wasn't available...and the airports ain't exactly convenient to where most of the victims were located (like 20 miles worth of flooded "not convenient"). Airdrop? You wanna try an air drop into a city center? Not if you have the sense god promised a doorknob. Crossload it onto pallets for choppers? The choppers were all tasked to rescue - not supply. And it takes time to break those loads down anyway.... Transport of people away from the Dome (and Convention Center)? Yeah, that might have happened earlier (and the city might have thought about actually leaving some people with experience in managing mass-casualty/refugee situations in place at both facilities) - but the sat images I saw didn't look like getting busses in would have been all that practical before they actually rolled. And I gotta say that the drives of those busses have guts - can you imagine driving a big, slow target into a sea of people who just want out of here *right now*? A sea of people who've already taken shots at helicopters? Alright...I guess I've got something or other off my chest. I'd kind of been hoping that the list was going to be at least a bit of a break from the constant chatter and amateur second-guessing... Oh, yeah - I'd kind of wish that everybody who's trying to start up the political discussion about the disaster at this point would kindly shut the f**k up and do something useful...like write a check to the Red Cross or the Salvation Army. Those two organizations are putting people on the ground with amazing efficiency, and are getting 100% of their available assets to the point of delivery just as fast as anybody could expect. There's a good reason we're bending the rules out here and shipping their supplies on our rail stock. On more thing - don't fool yourself that "this couldn't happen to me". One of the other top natural disaster scenarios is a major seismic event along the New Madrid fault in southern Missouri (significantly damaging both St. Louis and Memphis). Do yourself a favour - learn a bit about disaster preparedness. Get your family involved in that. Get your workplace ready to respond or act as a shelter. It ain't that hard - you'd be amazed at how much of it is simply stocking some basic supplies. Sign up with your local Red Cross to help out or just to learn about what to do. Or sign up with FEMA's C.E.R.T. (Civilian Emergency Response Team) program and be prepared to help when the disaster comes to your town. Thanks for letting me rant....I'm going to bed. =20 =20 Michael Finney Thinkwell Design & Production mfinney [at] thinkwelldesign.com www.thinkwelldesign.com =20 =20 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 17:04:04 -0400 Subject: Re: Katrina From: Steve Larson Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Thank you for all your hard work. Steve > From: "Michael Finney" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 18:05:32 -0400 Subject: Re: on a serious note (long and grouchy and obviously OT) From: Herrick Goldman Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Hey Finney! Thanks! Not for the words but also for the work! Get some sleep, the beer is on me at LDI. -H -- Herrick Goldman Lighting Designer, NYC www.HGLightingDesign.com 917-797-3624 "To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS ------------------------------ From: "Sam Fisher" Subject: Press Release - Grand Opening Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:15:12 -0400 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Fisher Theatrical, LLC. Grand Opening Celebration and Open House September 8th and 9th, 10am-6pm 7476 New Ridge Road Suite C Hanover, MD 21076 800-599-2180 Your Source For: Setwear Gear, Ben Nye Makeup, LeMaitre Special Effects, J.R. Clancy, Production Intercom, The Light Source, Entertainment Power Systems, ADC, GAM Products, LEE Filters, Rosco, Sculptural Arts Coatings, and much, much, more... Sales : Service : Rentals : Design : Production : Consultation : Installations Sam Fisher General Manager / VP Fisher Theatrical, LLC. 410-487-0100 office 410-487-0090 fax ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "C. Andrew Dunning" Subject: RE: on a serious note (long and grouchy and obviously OT) Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:30:31 -0500 Organization: Landru Design In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Michael - >- I've spent the last two nights working on the transshipment >of somewhere around 35,000 tons of equipment and food stocks... Please forgive me. I may have missed this along the way somewhere, but what is your role in this? Keep up the great work! C. Andrew Dunning Landru Design - Nashville, TN - cad [at] landrudesign.com www.landrudesign.com ------------------------------ From: IAEG [at] aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:32:11 EDT Subject: Re: on a serious note In a message dated 9/2/05 3:40:49 PM, jdurand [at] interstellar.com writes: << Hard to get the ship to Orlando. :) >> but there is dock space to spare here in Tampa I assure you, , , , very best, Keith Arsenault IAEG - International Arts & Entertainment Group Tampa, Florida ------------------------------ From: "Tony Deeming" Subject: RE: on a serious note Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:02:58 +0100 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: > -----Original Message----- > From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net]On Behalf Of > IAEG [at] aol.com > Sent: 02 September 2005 23:32 > To: Stagecraft > Subject: Re: on a serious note > > > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > > In a message dated 9/2/05 3:40:49 PM, jdurand [at] interstellar.com writes: > > << Hard to get the ship to Orlando. :) >> > > but there is dock space to spare here in Tampa I assure you, , , , > > very best, > > Keith Arsenault > Having watched the rather unpredictable path of Charley last year as it suddenly changed course from the prediction of hitting Tampa to missing the bay completely and heading inland much earlier, would it really have been the sensible thing to put a hospital ship in the potential path of the storm? I know that the actual path missed Tampa BUT there could well have been a change in direction..... TD ------------------------------ From: IAEG [at] aol.com Message-ID: <12c.65562b76.304a397a [at] aol.com> Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:25:46 EDT Subject: Re: on a serious note In a message dated 9/2/05 7:03:53 PM, deeming.tony [at] btinternet.com writes: << I know that the actual path missed Tampa BUT there could well have been a change in direction..... TD >> and boy do I know that, believe me! As I said on this list last year, my house is a mile from Tampa Bay in one direction and a mile and a half from Tampa Bay in another and only 11 feet above sea level Charley was on the same path as the Great Hurricane of 1921 which believe it or not is the last major storm to hit Tampa directly ( they all seem to go north or south of us ) That storm cause a 17' storm surge flooding all of Tampa south of a line between what is now Tampa International Airport and Downtown. My neighborhood was 6 feet under water then ( way before my house was built ) and now in all honesty I am seriously considering moving, just because eventually, we will get the Great Hurricane of 20XX and this time, , there is a house here, , and it's mine. very best, Keith Arsenault IAEG - International Arts & Entertainment Group Tampa, Florida ------------------------------ From: "Tony Deeming" Subject: RE: on a serious note Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:41:45 +0100 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: > -----Original Message----- > From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net]On Behalf Of > IAEG [at] aol.com > Sent: 03 September 2005 00:26 > To: Stagecraft > Subject: Re: on a serious note > > > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > > In a message dated 9/2/05 7:03:53 PM, deeming.tony [at] btinternet.com writes: > > << I know that the actual path missed Tampa BUT there could well have > been a change in direction..... > > TD >> > > and boy do I know that, believe me! > > As I said on this list last year, my house is a mile from Tampa > Bay in one > direction and a mile and a half from Tampa Bay in another and > only 11 feet > above sea level > > Charley was on the same path as the Great Hurricane of 1921 which > believe it > or not is the last major storm to hit Tampa directly ( they all > seem to go > north or south of us ) > > That storm cause a 17' storm surge flooding all of Tampa south of a line > between what is now Tampa International Airport and Downtown. > > My neighborhood was 6 feet under water then ( way before my house > was built ) > > and now in all honesty I am seriously considering moving, just because > eventually, we will get the Great Hurricane of 20XX and this > time, , there is a > house here, , and it's mine. > > very best, > > Keith Arsenault > As a Brit holidaying in Orlando, I was humbled by the force of Charley, even after it lost some of it's force overland, though I had to chuckle a little at the evacuees from Tampa area that were evac'd to central FLA only to find themselves in the midst o the storm they'd fled!!! TD ------------------------------ From: "ladesigners [at] juno.com" Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:27:56 GMT Subject: Re: Pepsi at the Coke show Message-Id: <20050902.173325.997.263816 [at] webmail18.lax.untd.com> When Pepsi owned Columbia Pix, Coke products were banned on screen. /s/ Richard Every-time I worked a Pepsi show there was only Pepsi in the hotel, or venue. Mark O'Brien ------------------------------ From: "ladesigners [at] juno.com" Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:38:17 GMT Cc: ladesigners [at] juno.com Subject: Re: Pepsi at the Coke show Message-Id: <20050902.174310.997.263881 [at] webmail18.lax.untd.com> Reverse that. /s/Richard When Pepsi owned Columbia Pix, Coke products were banned on screen. ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20050902174429.011d6ff0 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 17:44:29 From: CB Subject: Ethics >I'm wondering if this was bad ethics, bad planning or what... And am I the >only one who feels like having taken a show, you finish it. Ethics are what happens when you take personal benefit out of the equation. I passed on a $1500 night to fulfill the promise I'd made to a $150 customer, because the buck fitty client called me first. I use these opportunities to send the customer to my competition. I usually get them back. If someone doesn't understand, "I'd love to do your show, however I've made a previous commitment, and I'm the kinda guy that will do what I tell you I will do, can you wait?", then they'll be just as happy to screw you over in the same manner when the time comes. Hey, if you're only in it for the money, follow the nimbers. If you're in it because you love this line of work, and you want to maek things great in this industry, work for who you like, and what you like, and the money will come. If you're in it for the money, go get the MBA and learn to swap stocks. Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20050902175313.011d6ff0 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 17:53:13 From: CB Subject: Re: on a serious note (and additional comments) "ahhh, , gee , , , these ougth to be on there way NOW !!!! " Ehm, a hospital ship is a *HUGE* undertaking. Those supplies that have to be loaded, and the personaell (that aren't going to be where they normally are) and just moving a dang boat that big is a logistical nightmare. The process was probably started when NO was thought to be threatened, and it just getting done and ready. Imagine if you were called to mount the largest production of some theatrical anomolie that had hundreds of thousands of dollars of expendables, most of them somewhat perishable, a cast of a thousand or so, and oh, yeah, the set is in a theatre somewhere and it has to be taken down and put back up somewhere else, all the perishables have to be shopped for, the actors and crew have to be rounded up, and we need you on the other side of this edge of the continent by Tuesday. Yes, next Tuesday. It really *is* a big production. My sadness comes from the, even if you just look at in financially and ignore everything else, incredible savings that could have been had had FEMA and the other agencies involved taken steps to prevent this. Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20050902180630.011d6ff0 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 18:06:30 From: CB Subject: RE: OSHA lifting limitations >Ahh you assume, I haven't been working as a designer, in this area, Nope, I assumed you haven't been working as *crew*, since you preferred to haul the new batt over the pulley instead of having the weight of the old, dead batt do most of the work. Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ Message-ID: From: "Occy" References: Subject: Re: Pepsi at the Coke show Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:29:15 -0700 Didn't Coke own Paramount for a while? ----- Original Message ----- From: > When Pepsi owned Columbia Pix, Coke products were banned on screen. > /s/ Richard > > Every-time I worked a Pepsi show there was only Pepsi in the hotel, or > venue. > Mark O'Brien > > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 21:35:07 -0400 Subject: Re: on a serious note (long and grouchy and obviously OT) From: John McKernon Message-ID: In-Reply-To: > kindly shut > the f**k up and do something useful...like write a check to the Red > Cross or the Salvation Army. Thanks Michael, for both your lucid explanation and amazing work in a difficult situation. I sent some serious money to the Red Cross yesterday, and am encouraging everyone I know to do the same. - John ------------------------------ From: MissWisc [at] aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:03:01 EDT Subject: Doing something - student opportunity The University of Wisconsin - Oshkosh is opening their doors to students who are displaced by Katrina guaranteeing admission and dorm space. Mic Alderson (famed as the author of the IASTE 470 Stagehands Primer and world-known for his knowledge of knots) teaches technical theatre there and I can help with logistics. There's a good chance for permit-worker gigs with the IA here too. http://www.uwosh.edu/news_bureau/releases/sept05/admission.php for more info. Kristi R-C IATSE 470 I can not do everything, but still I can do something. And because I can not do everything, I will not refuse to do something I can do." -Helen Keller ------------------------------ Message-ID: <006c01c5b02b$ad6077f0$0b00a8c0 [at] CHRISLAPTOP> Reply-To: "chrisharris25" From: "chrisharris25" Subject: Fw: on a serious note (long and grouchy and obviously OT) Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:03:28 -0400 Thanks, Michael! Thanks for all your hard work in helping to provide some relief after this catastrophe!!! And thanks for the words that needed to be spoken here. Monday morning armchair quarterbacks are a true detriment to rational thinking in times like these, especially from people who think they have everything thought through in advance, though not really, and with an agenda to boot! To concentrate on "Who's RESPONSIBLE for this??" is buffoonery and we should all just be trying to lend a hand. Here's to people like you in the trenches, and all the money I can afford to give the Red Cross to help. To you and your colleagues, keep up the good work! Chris Christopher Harris Sapsis Rigging, Inc. www.sapsis-rigging.com ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael Finney" > To: "Stagecraft" > Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 5:05 PM > Subject: Re: on a serious note (long and grouchy and obviously OT) > > > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > ------------------------------ From: "Chris Warner" Subject: RE: OSHA lifting limitations Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:49:43 -0700 Message-ID: <000701c5b032$235da440$6401a8c0 [at] chris> In-Reply-To: I have crewed a number of times before, the problem is that this battery was in an Emergency back up unit, couldn't take a chance of the inverter not running. Next time, a block and fall will be used, probably 1:2, or 2:3. Cheers. Chris -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of CB Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 6:07 PM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: OSHA lifting limitations For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- >Ahh you assume, I haven't been working as a designer, in this area, Nope, I assumed you haven't been working as *crew*, since you preferred to haul the new batt over the pulley instead of having the weight of the old, dead batt do most of the work. Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.18/89 - Release Date: 9/2/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.18/89 - Release Date: 9/2/2005 ------------------------------ End of Stagecraft Digest #508 *****************************