Return-Path: X-Real-To: stagecraftlist [at] theatrical.net Received: by prxy.net (CommuniGate Pro PIPE 4.2.10) with PIPE id 30699848; Wed, 31 May 2006 03:01:29 -0700 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.1 (2006-03-10) on localhost X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,NO_RECEIVED, NO_RELAYS autolearn=unavailable version=3.1.1 X-ListServer: CommuniGate Pro LIST 4.2.10 List-Unsubscribe: List-ID: Message-ID: From: "Stagecraft" Sender: "Stagecraft" To: "Stagecraft" Precedence: list Subject: Stagecraft Digest #827 Date: Wed, 31 May 2006 03:00:23 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline X-TFF-CGPSA-Version: 1.4 X-prxy-Spam-Filter: Scanned For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- Stagecraft Digest, Issue #827 1. Re: Subject: Re: ABTT Engineering Conf. by Scott Spidell 2. SPL levels by Paul Marsland 3. Re: SPL levels by rwhitco [at] comcast.net (Randy Whitcomb) 4. Old LMI dimmer packs by "David Fox" 5. Union Dealings by b Ricie 6. Re: SPL levels by "Salvatori, Jason" 7. Re: jobs and wages (sort of an annual rant) by CB 8. American Flag by "Joe Golden" 9. Re: Old LMI dimmer packs by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com 10. Re: Old LMI dimmer packs by Jerry Durand 11. ETC L-86 Dimmer Rack for Sale by "Chris Walters" 12. Next generation control surface? by Dale Farmer 13. Re: Clear-Com replacement by "Andy Leviss" 14. Re: Next generation control surface? by Tony Kambic 15. Re: Next generation control surface? by Herrick Goldman 16. Re: Bulldozer, was Re: Lightning bolt effect by "Michael Powers" 17. Re: Next generation control surface? by Clive Mitchell 18. Re: Next generation control surface? by Charlie Richmond *** Please update the subject line of your reply to use the subject *** line of the message you are replying to! Please only reply to *** one message subject in each reply. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.0.20060530085433.01a35308 [at] uwaterloo.ca> Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 08:56:23 -0400 From: Scott Spidell Subject: Re: Subject: Re: ABTT Engineering Conf. In-Reply-To: References: At 06:00 AM 5/30/2006,Bill Sapsis wrote: >I'd love too but I'm afraid I'm on a very tight schedule. Are you coming >over for ABTT and the TEA or just ABTT? > >Bill S. I'm there for both - arrive Saturday, leave Friday morning. Scott ------------------------------ Message-ID: <20060530140138.75038.qmail [at] web52210.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 07:01:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Paul Marsland Subject: SPL levels In-Reply-To: So on the broadcast of the Hurricanes/Sabres hockey game on Saturday, we periodically got to see an SPL meter reading of the noise level in the RBC center in Raleigh (90-110dB though I could not discern if it was reading "A" or "C" settings :p ). Do you think the managers there put up signs warning of intense sound levels and offered free earplugs to the patrons? Paul __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: rwhitco [at] comcast.net (Randy Whitcomb) Subject: Re: SPL levels Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 14:51:53 +0000 Message-Id: <053020061451.26892.447C5C090001E8540000690C2200750744010C9B0708999D [at] comcast.net> -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Paul Marsland > Do you think the managers there put up signs warning > of intense sound levels and offered free earplugs to > the patrons? A civic aud. in the city where I live has boxes of ear plugs at the main doors into the hall. I've considered it at my place, but since I do 99% of the sound in my facility and I can count on one hand the number of times in 9 years we've had concerts even approaching harmful levels it isn't really an issue. Randy Whitcomb Manager/TD Price Civic Aud. Loveland, CO ------------------------------ Subject: Old LMI dimmer packs Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 09:53:28 -0500 Message-ID: From: "David Fox" >=20 > Hi all! >=20 > I have a couple of old analogue LMI portable dimmer racks (6 - 3.6k > dimmers each) (Red boxes). Each dimmer has two trim adjustment screws. >=20 > I naively assumed that they were simply "Low setting" and "High > setting", but apparently they are not - they interact together in some way. > Does anyone have a user manual or instruction sheet or personal experience > with these units that will help me understand how to set these adjustments? >=20 > LMI is now handled by ETC, but unfortunately ETC's excellent technical > service was unable to help me (They are too old I guess). >=20 > Bruce Bruce; We do indeed still support these packs. I am sorry if someone you talked to led you astray. There were 2 red LMI dimmer packs the PD pack and the SD pack. You will be receiving a user manual and schematics in a separate email. For the curious among you on the list I thought I would explain how to trim the SD pack as several other manufacturers used a similar trim pot system on their packs. There are 2 trim pots on the card. On the front of the pack there is a "Tune" Knob which controls the high end of the curve and inside the unit on the dimmer card is another trim pot that controls the middle trim. This was done with 2 post for a number of reasons one of which is these packs are designed to accept either 5vdc-40vdc analog or pulse width modulated wave form as a control input.=20 This process can take a bit of tweaking and requires both a meter and a visual of the dimmer. The pots are single turn so they are a bit sensitive. Smaller movements are better than larger movements. In your situation where the lights are in the lobby and the packs are not, I would bring a light to the dimmer room and plug it in locally.=20 These 2 pots work with each other to even out your dimmer curve. To adjust the trim you will need the following items: - An RMS voltage Meter - A Small Screwdriver - A Light to attach to the pack, I like a S4 (but I might be biased) - Some time 1. Meter incoming voltage as this will be your max output 2. Turn dimmer to full and using the Tune pot turn the pot until the light does not get any brighter and then turn back a small distance.=20 3. Meter voltage at this point as this is your full output voltage 4. Turn light to 50% and meter voltage. Adjust trim pot inside so displayed voltage is approx 50% of full level. 5. Return to step 2 and repeat until you are happy with your dimmer curve. Once you do a few of them you will get the rhythm for the adjustment. I find the high end trim is really more of a visual and the middle is more of a metered adjustment. In a perfect world high would be 120vac and middle would be 77vac as metered with an RMS meter, but In my experience trying to get both the voltages perfect on the meter and the curve looking perfect to the eye can be neigh impossible. Let the visual be your final answer. I hope this helps. If anyone has further questions please feel free to contact me through the list or privately David Fox Electronic Theatre Controls Technical Support Supervisor Direct Toll Free 888-908-2193 Direct 608-824-5056=20 ------------------------------ Message-ID: <20060530154153.52871.qmail [at] web50610.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 08:41:53 -0700 (PDT) From: b Ricie Subject: Union Dealings In-Reply-To: I am not IA, However I have played with the IA folk all over this land. I agree, everywhere, you will Run into the good, the bad , and the ugly, tis a crap shoot out there. What I have noticed playing with the IA is nothing is standard, except breaks. IMHO, Unions are in there sunset years, unless they step up to the plate. Look at the UAW. Even with all the College Resident Assistants and other organizations being represented, auto plants are still closing and lots-o-people are getting laid off. Not much help from their union there. Smart Unions want new blood. Some realize that with new blood comes new ambition, work ethic, and that new hyper dude who can work circles around "tiny". Perhaps "Tiny" will take the hint and get off his ass. Some unions understand a larger gene pool is a better gene pool for a swim. Then there are the Unions that have outgrown their own usefulness. Complacency has set in, and they are indeed (in their view) the best thing since sliced bread. I call these the "clubs". Boston is indeed a club. When I meet a person with 20 years of experience, my first thought is not " gosh this person is still trying to get it right." but rather, "if their still at it, they have to be doing something right." How can that be denied? Awhile back we were discussing the rift between cast and crew. It seems the same rift is in place between Union and non union people. Brian Rice 508-685-0716 b_ricie [at] yahoo.com "Blessed are the cracked: For it is they who let in the light." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Subject: RE: SPL levels Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 13:25:33 -0400 Message-ID: From: "Salvatori, Jason" >So on the broadcast of the Hurricanes/Sabres hockey >game on Saturday, we periodically got to see an SPL >meter reading of the noise level in the RBC center in >Raleigh (90-110dB though I could not discern if it was >reading "A" or "C" settings :p ). =20 The problem in this situation is that, besides not knowing the weighting, or the response time of the meter, is we also don't know where the measurement=20 is being taken - On ice level? a mic in the rafters? Due to the shape of arena's and the number of hard surfaces in them, you can have some very loud places in the building - The people in the first rows near the ice and in the nose-bleed seats at the top would be hearing much more of that noise than the ones in the middle seats. I bet the spot ops in the rafters had some sort of hearing protection (plugs or good isolating com headsets) Jason _________________________________________________________________________= _ This e-mail, including any attachment(s), may be confidential and is = intended solely for the attention and information of the named = addressee(s). If you are not the intended recipient or have received = this message in error, please notify me immediately by return e-mail and = permanently delete the original transmission from your computer, = including any attachment(s). Any unauthorized distribution, disclosure = or copying of this message and attachment(s) by anyone other than the = recipient is strictly prohibited. ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20060530123924.00d45660 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 12:39:24 From: CB Subject: Re: jobs and wages (sort of an annual rant) >C'mon, the Union does not exist to look out for *our* best interests, >but the Union members' best interests. There is no advantage for the IA for any stagehand of merit to be working outside the IA. The best chance we have as a collective is if there is no alternative. If they can find great hands and pay them less than a living wage, they will. Great hands that don't have the weight of the collective behind them will tend to work for what they can get. And the IA, as a whole, doesn't have *that* great a reputation that they we can afford to get all miffed at anyone pointing a finger at us. As I said earlier, there are locals that are exemplary, and those that I'd rather eat ground glass than to do a show with, and until we can get them all up to a decent standard, we need to accept the merits as well detriments. Hopefully so that we can work on making them better. I think that this guy labled his piece a rant, and that he was pointing out that there were faults in the system, and we could take advantage of that. Whether the faults exist or not, the appearance is there, and even that should get looked at. Remember, every stagehand that isn't a member weakens the union. Every local that drives a stagehand from the union is a cancer. Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ From: "Joe Golden" Subject: American Flag Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 13:40:39 -0700 Message-ID: I am looking to rent an American Flag with grommets on the top (for Kabuki drop) that is 30' x 20'. Any ideas? I am in Southern California. TIA Joe ------------------------------ From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com Message-ID: <46a.22a77e7.31ae0940 [at] aol.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 16:46:56 EDT Subject: Re: Old LMI dimmer packs In a message dated 5/30/06 1:09:25 AM W. Europe Daylight Time, billn [at] peak.org writes: << Make a SMALL change on the low set pot and see how it affects the lobby lights. If you don't see any difference, try making a small change in the other direction from the starting point. If still no change, set the low pot back at your starting point and make a small change in the high set. That is about the best that can be done without an RMS voltmeter and test load. >> A lot of electronic equipment involves this 'chasing your own tail' procedure. It is easier to design, but very tiresome. Some doesn't. I remember an extremely precise motor drive system, which took up a whole 19" rack, and controlled a 2HP two-phase motor with sufficient accuracy to ensure that the shutter of the 35mm film camera it was driving opened on line 37 of an incoming TV signal. Not on line 35 or 39, it being an interlaced signal. There were just three alignment controls, marked 'first differential, second differential, and integral'. It was designed and made by the Lancashire Dynamo Company, and, if they still exist and if anyone is listening, I should like them to know that they did a very good job. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 13:57:32 -0700 From: Jerry Durand Subject: Re: Old LMI dimmer packs In-reply-to: Message-id: <7.0.1.0.0.20060530135206.01f40c60 [at] interstellar.com> References: At 01:46 PM 5/30/2006, FrankWood95 [at] aol.com wrote: >A lot of electronic equipment involves this 'chasing your own tail' >procedure. It is easier to design, but very tiresome. > >Some doesn't. The first system I saw that did a very good job was a Keithly automated analog tester (big, automated, super-sensitive multimeter). It had a plug-in module with a precision resistor in it. The system would calibrate every other reading against the module. Every few months we received a new plugin from Keithly (sealed with a calibration sticker) and we sent the old one in for a new sticker. I always try to design devices with 1 or fewer manual adjustments and no sockets, I hate trim pots and I hate sockets. It's amazing how many people WANT manual adjustments on things. -- Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc. www.interstellar.com 219 Oak Wood Way, Los Gatos, California 95032-2523 USA tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886 Skype: jerrydurand ------------------------------ From: "Chris Walters" Subject: ETC L-86 Dimmer Rack for Sale Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 17:07:11 -0400 Message-ID: <001401c6842d$0506e310$8900a8c0 [at] riversidetheatre.com> Hello everyone. Please pardon the commercial nature of this post, but we are in the process of replacing our L-86 dimming system due to renovations, and are looking to sell all or parts of it. It is a 192-circuit installation rack, which we have 164 dimmers (82 dual 2.4Kw modules) for, plus all necessary DMX control modules. If interested or for more info, please contact me off-list. Thanks. Chris Walters Supervisor of Sound Riverside Theatre 772-231-5860 sound [at] riversidetheatre.com ------------------------------ Message-ID: <447CEFCD.1060107 [at] cybercom.net> Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 21:22:21 -0400 From: Dale Farmer Organization: I'm working on that.... Subject: Next generation control surface? It's like something right out of Star Trek. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6379146923853181774&q=touchscreen --Dale ------------------------------ From: "Andy Leviss" Subject: Re: Clear-Com replacement Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 21:19:13 -0400 Organization: Duck's Echo Sound Message-ID: <02c401c68450$3ac336c0$2802a8c0 [at] Andy> In-Reply-To: Regarding ClearCom grounding/a statement that ClearCom systems should not have the shield grounded, Frank Wood wrote: > With this, I take issue. If it's not grounded, it's not a > shield, screen, or > whatever. It's simply a third signal conductor. That said, > how it is grounded > is important. At the system power supply is probably best, > but it depends on > the wiring detail. But, in one place, and one place only. > Multiple grounds are > a recipe for trouble. Both of y'all are essentially correct. In ClearCom systems, grounding takes place in the main station. What Rich was trying to get across is that NOWHERE in a ClearCom system should ANY cable have the SHELL connected to the SHIELD. The shield should ONLY connect to PIN 1. The quickest way to get hum into a ClearCom system is to tie the Pin 1 to the shell in one of the interconnects. If you're not scared of a multi-meter, go to ClearCom's site and download the PDF of their generic "Party-Line System" manual. Towards the back, there's a writeup of how to do a system checkup that will identify the vast majority of ClearCom system troubles with a few simple measurements. I've also got a condensed version on my website in an article I wrote on exorcising ClearCom demons...use the search box on the right hand side to search for "clearcom" and it'll come up, along with a few other related pieces. --Andy http://OneFromTheRoad.com Tools, Toys, and Tales for Theatrical Technicians -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.7.4/351 - Release Date: 5/29/2006 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 21:32:24 -0400 From: Tony Kambic Subject: RE: Next generation control surface? In-reply-to: Message-id: <000101c68452$14f9fcb0$7a88c744 [at] tony> Wow. It looks like the computer that Tom Cruise uses in Minority Report. Imagine using THAT to control your show; virtually grabbing fixtures and pointing them without using buttons. You would rival some orchestra conductors. Tony M Kambic Electronics Technician - City Theatrical Freelance lighting technician, NY, NY > -----Original Message----- > From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Dale > Farmer > Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2006 9:22 PM > To: Stagecraft > Subject: Next generation control surface? > > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > It's like something right out of Star Trek. > > http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6379146923853181774&q=touchscreen > > > > --Dale ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 23:41:41 -0400 Subject: Re: Next generation control surface? From: Herrick Goldman Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Our entire lives are out of star trek. Without Rodenberry (the great bird of the galaxy) we wouldn't have anything. My Star Tac cell phone worked like Kirk's communicator. My current Blue-Tooth Speaker phone works like Picards's Seen a microwave lately? Does it look like The enterprise's food replicator? I've got a roomba vaccuum that has convinced my wife that I don't have to clean anymore....."these are not the droids you're looking for" (ok wrong universe) Don't even get me started on the whole talking to whales thing....if only we had listened sooner.....sigh... On 5/30/06 9:22 PM, "Dale Farmer" wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > It's like something right out of Star Trek. > > http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6379146923853181774&q=touchscreen > > > > --Dale > -- Herrick Goldman Lighting Designer, NYC www.HGLightingDesign.com 917-797-3624 "To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS ------------------------------ Message-ID: <58f67b0f0605310003ue9593f8h66db28459722845a [at] mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2006 02:03:26 -0500 From: "Michael Powers" Subject: Re: Bulldozer, was Re: Lightning bolt effect > Idaho Scenic & Rigging wrote: > I've seen one level a theater, but never push scenery > around. I suspect that I'm one of the very few who can say I've actually used a backhoe and a front end loader to build a set. As part of my training in USMC Wing Engineers I learned to operate most heavy equipment. I never thought my military training would apply to my career in theatre, but in 1980 I was the TD for the inaugural season of an outdoor drama in the West Virginia mountains called "Young Washington". The set included an area with a cave large enough for a mounted rider to enter and pass through and for a group of 6 mounted riders to ride over the top of the opening, pausing directly above the mouth of the cave. We had a general contractor construct a reinforced concrete tunnel 8' wide, 10' inside height and about 30' long with a 45 degree bend in the middle. The side walls were about 6" thick(IIRCC) and had 6' angled buttresses about every 4'. The roof was basicly an 8" slab laid on top of the walls. My job was to, first, back fill around the tunnel with earth to provide a 60' long approach from off right and a (rather steep) 25' slope down onto the "stage". The next step was to gather boulders and rocks (from park approved areas) to build up the face of the slopes to resemble a rocky mountainous area. The largest boulders were about 4' to 6' across and about 10' or so long. If you ever think you've had an experience with a "designer moment" trying to arrange dressing or furniture, wait until you have one while moving big rocks with a loader and a back hoe!!!!!! The finish was a 25' tall wall with 6x6 beams as the vertical columns backing the slope and cave. We then planted about 30 trees up to 20' tall, a lot of bushes, grass, cover and wild flowers to complete the scene. After the set was built I became (again due to my military training, in weapons and demolition) the weapons wrangler and pyro technician, although I doubt that either title existed then in live theatre. Each night I had 8 flintlock weapons firing, 180 rounds of black powder blanks and 6 cannon shots of about 1-1/2 cups of black powder each. The "about" part of the cannon loads was because the cloud cover over the plateau we were on, greatly affected the perceived volume level the audience experienced. As a result, the cannon loads were calculated/guessed each night and loaded at the last possible moment. The drama had a lot of birthing pains and financial problems and I don't know if it survived for a second or more seasons. Michael Michael Powers Director of Operations Central Lighting & Equipment 1720 Fuller Rd. Suite 150 West Des Moines Iowa 50265 515-277-4190 877-977-4190 Fax 515-277-2295 515-557-0178 cell michael [at] clelights.com ------------------------------ Message-ID: Date: Wed, 31 May 2006 08:33:48 +0100 From: Clive Mitchell Subject: Re: Next generation control surface? References:

In-Reply-To: In message , Herrick Goldman writes >Our entire lives are out of star trek. Closer than you might think. It just happens so slowly that we don't notice the changes. Many technical tradesperson's carry small computers or laptops with them on site to set parameters in equipment. They use mobile phones that have surprising features and they use cordless power tools that have the capability of corded tools. If they need further data on a piece of equipment they simply log onto a global network of data and experts. -- Clive Mitchell http://www.bigclive.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 May 2006 10:54:14 +0100 (BST) From: Charlie Richmond Subject: Re: Next generation control surface? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: On Tue, 30 May 2006, Tony Kambic wrote: > Wow. It looks like the computer that Tom Cruise uses in Minority Report. > Imagine using THAT to control your show; virtually grabbing fixtures and > pointing them without using buttons. You would rival some orchestra > conductors. We have been discussing this for some time on the Show Control list - see my sig for more info and to look at the archives. Charlie | Charlie Richmond - Richmond Sound Design - Skype: charlierichmond | | http://www.RichmondSoundDesign.com "Performance for the Long Run" | | Show Control List: http://www.RichmondSoundDesign.com/sclist.html | | ShowMan List: http://www.RichmondSoundDesign.com/smlist.html | | "Let distribution undo excess - And each man have enough" | | - King Lear | ------------------------------ End of Stagecraft Digest #827 *****************************