Return-Path: X-Real-To: stagecraftlist [at] theatrical.net Received: by prxy.net (CommuniGate Pro PIPE 4.2.10) with PIPE id 30765530; Fri, 02 Jun 2006 03:03:46 -0700 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.1 (2006-03-10) on localhost X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,NO_RECEIVED, NO_RELAYS autolearn=unavailable version=3.1.1 X-ListServer: CommuniGate Pro LIST 4.2.10 List-Unsubscribe: List-ID: Message-ID: From: "Stagecraft" Sender: "Stagecraft" To: "Stagecraft" Precedence: list Subject: Stagecraft Digest #829 Date: Fri, 02 Jun 2006 03:01:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline X-TFF-CGPSA-Version: 1.4 X-prxy-Spam-Filter: Scanned For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- Stagecraft Digest, Issue #829 1. Re: power question by Clive Mitchell 2. Re: American Flag by Jim Hyslop 3. Re: Gluing Plexi by 4. Re: Gluing Plexi by "Paul Schreiner" 5. Re: Gluing Plexi by 6. Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) by tomgrab [at] utpa.edu 7. Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) by 8. Re: American Flag by Jeff Grams 9. Re: American Flag (meaning) by MissWisc [at] aol.com 10. Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) by Jo Vandver 11. Re: American Flag (meaning) by "Paul Schreiner" 12. Re: American Flag by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com 13. Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) by "Hentschel, Randy" 14. Re: American Flag by "Paul Schreiner" 15. Re: American Flag by "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" 16. Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) by "Paul Schreiner" 17. Re: American Flag by "Paul Schreiner" 18. Re: American Flag by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com 19. Re: American Flag by CB 20. Re: American Flag by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com 21. Re: American Flag by "Don Taco" 22. Re: American Flag by CB 23. Re: American Flag by "chrisharris25" 24. American Flag RESET, , Original post? by IAEG [at] aol.com 25. Re: Next generation control surface? by CB 26. Re: American Flag by Stephen Litterst 27. Re: American Flag by CB 28. Re: American Flag by "Josh Ratty" 29. Re: American Flag (meaning) by "Bill Nelson" 30. Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) by SS 31. Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) by "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" 32. Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) by "Paul Schreiner" 33. Re: American Flag by "Paul Schreiner" 34. Re: American Flag by "Don Taco" 35. Re: American Flag by "Josh Ratty" 36. Re: American Flag by Jerry Durand 37. Re: American Flag by Stephen Litterst 38. Re: power question by "Bill Nelson" 39. Re: power question by Jerry Durand 40. Re: power question by Greg Persinger 41. Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) by "ladesigners [at] juno.com" 42. Re: American Flag by Bill Sapsis 43. Re: American Flag by "chip.a.wood" 44. Re: American Flag by Kevin Lee Allen 45. Re: American Flag (meaning) by Kevin Lee Allen 46. Re: Next generation control surface? by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com 47. Re: American Flag by "Ken Romaine" 48. Re: American Flag by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com 49. Re: American Flag by "chip.a.wood" 50. Re: American Flag by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com 51. Re: Next generation control surface? by "Shawn King" 52. Re: Next generation control surface? by "Idaho Scenic & Rigging" 53. Re: Next generation control surface? by "Idaho Scenic & Rigging" 54. Re: American Flag by "Joe Golden" 55. Multi touch Interaction Research by "Idaho Scenic & Rigging" 56. Re: American Flag by "Paul Schreiner" 57. Re: Next generation control surface? by "Don Taco" 58. Re: American Flag by "Don Taco" 59. Re: American Flag by Jim Hyslop 60. Re: American Flag by "Paul Schreiner" 61. Re: American Flag by Bill Sapsis 62. textbooks by Kevin Lee Allen 63. Re: American Flag by Bruce Purdy 64. Re: Next generation control surface? by "Bill Nelson" 65. Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) by Noah Price 66. Re: American Flag by "Bill Nelson" *** Please update the subject line of your reply to use the subject *** line of the message you are replying to! Please only reply to *** one message subject in each reply. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message-ID: Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 11:00:11 +0100 From: Clive Mitchell Subject: Re: power question References:

In-Reply-To: In message , Bill Nelson writes >The generator described is for "emergency power" and provides about >enough power to power a average household, assuming they do not have >such "watt guzzlers" as radiant electric heating. One really important thing to avoid with these home power generators is the deathtrap arrangement of a plug on the output of the generator so you can power the whole house via your dryer socket. This has resulted in the death of several linemen who have been killed by backfeed onto the power lines feeding the house while they were trying to repair them, or worse it can result in powering a pole-pig (pole mounted transformer) in reverse and put thousands of volts at potentially fatal current on lines that were supposedly disconnected. You just can't assume that people are going to be clever enough not to switch the incoming mains isolator on while the generator is connected. Any scenario involving powering of an installation with a generator as an alternative to the normal supply should be done via a proper changeover switch that only allows one or the other to be connected to the installations wiring. -- Clive Mitchell http://www.bigclive.com ------------------------------ Message-ID: <447EEAF6.6010906 [at] dreampossible.ca> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 09:26:14 -0400 From: Jim Hyslop Organization: Dreampossible Inc. Subject: Re: American Flag References: In-Reply-To: Steve Larson wrote: > I can't believe that you are so ignorant to make a > statement like that. As a decorated war veteran, > I could give you a myriad of reasons. As a person > who lost seven dear, close friends in Vietnam, oh > crap, why bother. You would never understand anyway. I don't know about Frank, but I would like to understand. For most non-Americans, a flag is simply a (sometimes) pretty piece of coloured cloth that waves in the breeze. Please try to explain your passion. Not right this moment when your emotions are strong, but at some point in the future, take some time to write down exactly why the flag is so important to Americans, and to you in particular. Then publish your thoughts. Not necessarily on this list, since the current thread may have died out, and it may not be "on-topic" any longer (not that it is now). I think aiming to have your piece written and published 33 days from now would be quite appropriate :=) FWIW I think Frank's question could have been phrased much more diplomatically, but if you can answer the basic question - what makes the flag so important - it will go a long way to helping us non-Americans understand your passion. I also think his observation about the American flag being a national symbol deserves some consideration. -- Jim Hyslop ------------------------------ Subject: RE: Gluing Plexi Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 09:31:51 -0400 Message-ID: From: Yes, what Paul said! These are very good instructions and quite accurate. Making sure you have excellent edge contact is important because the adhesive is not a void filler. Taping the components securely together is a good idea as well. Steve Rees=20 -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Paul Schreiner Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 4:20 PM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: Gluing Plexi I *think* I used methyl methacrylate. =20 ------------------------------ Subject: RE: Gluing Plexi Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 09:50:57 -0400 Message-ID: <6E497ADB607656479C24E6D7BF6B505A042A9C90 [at] exchange.rmwc.edu> From: "Paul Schreiner" > Yes, what Paul said! These are very good instructions and=20 > quite accurate. Making sure you have excellent edge contact=20 > is important because the adhesive is not a void filler.=20 > Taping the components securely together is a good idea as=20 > well.=20 Thanks for the confirmation...nice to know I haven't completely lost my mind! ------------------------------ Subject: RE: Gluing Plexi Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 10:09:22 -0400 Message-ID: From: No problem.=20 Go Sabres S=20 -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Paul Schreiner Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 9:51 AM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: Gluing Plexi Thanks for the confirmation...nice to know I haven't completely lost my mind! ------------------------------ From: tomgrab [at] utpa.edu Subject: RE: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 09:29:45 -0500 In-Reply-To: <1149171956blank [at] panam.edu> Message-ID: <20060601092946077.00000003776 [at] TGRABOWSKI> > -----Original Message----- > From: blank [at] panam.edu [mailto:blank [at] panam.edu] = > Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 8:08 AM > To: tomgrab [at] utpa.edu > Subject: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) > = > = > This is an automated message from the theatrical.net list manager. > = > Somebody (hopefully you!) has requested the subscribe(digest) = > operation for your address to the = > "Stagecraft" mailing list. > = > You must send confirmation to complete this operation. Please = > use the reply command in your mail program to write back to = > the list server. > = > Check that the Subject of the reply message contains > the confirmation ID: 2268188065, > the reply is directed to , > and the 'From' address of your reply is . > = > If you do not want to perform this operation, simply do nothing. > = > The above message will automatically be processed by the list = > server. To reach a human, please send administrative queries = > to > = > For further information about this mailing list, please see = > our web site: > . > ------------------------------ Subject: RE: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 10:31:46 -0400 Message-ID: From: =20 -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of tomgrab [at] utpa.edu Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 10:30 AM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- > -----Original Message----- > From: blank [at] panam.edu [mailto:blank [at] panam.edu] > Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 8:08 AM > To: tomgrab [at] utpa.edu > Subject: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) >=20 >=20 > This is an automated message from the theatrical.net list manager. >=20 > Somebody (hopefully you!) has requested the subscribe(digest)=20 > operation for your address to the "Stagecraft"=20 > mailing list. >=20 > You must send confirmation to complete this operation. Please use the=20 > reply command in your mail program to write back to the list server. >=20 > Check that the Subject of the reply message contains > the confirmation ID: 2268188065, > the reply is directed to , > and the 'From' address of your reply is . >=20 > If you do not want to perform this operation, simply do nothing. >=20 > The above message will automatically be processed by the list server.=20 > To reach a human, please send administrative queries to=20 > >=20 > For further information about this mailing list, please see our web=20 > site: > . >=20 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 10:49:28 -0500 From: Jeff Grams Subject: Re: American Flag In-reply-to: Message-id: References:

Gee Jim I think he already did. j. > >Steve Larson wrote: > As a decorated war veteran... As a person who lost seven dear, >close friends in Vietnam,... > > > Please try to explain your passion. ... > >-- >Jim Hyslop ------------------------------ From: MissWisc [at] aol.com Message-ID: <445.2957f03.31b063ff [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 11:38:39 EDT Subject: Re: American Flag (meaning) theatre [at] dreampossible.ca writes: << Please try to explain your passion. Not right this moment when your emotions are strong, but at some point in the future, take some time to write down exactly why the flag is so important to Americans, and to you in particular. >> It's not the object itself, it's what it represents. It represents the thousands of men and women who died so we may have the right to fly it freely for over 200 years. It represents the dreams of a small group of men who wouldn't let a British kin boss them around anymore. (For a fairly accurate depiction, see the Broadway musical "1776".) It represents achievement over what looked like insurmountable odds. (No right minded person would have bet on the colonists to win... they were out manned, out supplied and out trained - but when someone has that BURNING desire to achieve, nothing can stop them.) It represents the responsibility of people to care for themselves, to work hard for the right achieve whatever their minds can dream. It represents my right to work in a "man's" job, to have as many or as few children as I wish and to worship the God of my choice... or not. It represents my right to voice disagrement with my government without fear of retaliation. It represents my right to publish what I believe to be true, TO CREATE AND ENJOY ART as it pleases me, to experiment and to learn about what I wish. It represents an amalgamation of so many people from every possible ethnic and racial background all working together for the common good. It represents freedom. I live in a city that has a two hour, 100+ unit flag day parade each June. It's the only place I've ever been where the whole crowd of parade watchers stand hand over heart/cap off when the first color guard walks past then burst into applause. When our neighbor left his flag flying at full mast after 9/11, someone else went over and lowered it to half-mast. He was so embarrassed that he didn't fly it for months. My son has been well-trained in flag etiquette thanks to the American Legion (who will properly dispose of flags by respectfully burning them. The ceremony is next week.) The USA is far from perfect, but I'll stand shoulder to shoulder with Trey to defend it. In most countries of the world, I could never be more than a lowly woman. Here... I'm a proud American. The flag has meaning for us because WE give it that meaning. We're a young enough country that most of us have lost a family member in the fight to defend the freedom of the USA and it's free allies. My dear British friends - I'm not surprised in the least that you don't "get it." You don't HAVE what we do. The pomp and ceremony surrounding your government belongs to the monarchy; here it belongs to the people. And it's not a "better or worse" it's just different. Thanks for asking. Kristi ------------------------------ Message-ID: <20060601161936.70571.qmail [at] web37209.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 09:19:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Jo Vandver Subject: Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) In-Reply-To: --- tomgrab [at] utpa.edu wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > > --------------------------------------------------- > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: blank [at] panam.edu [mailto:blank [at] panam.edu] > > Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 8:08 AM > > To: tomgrab [at] utpa.edu > > Subject: stagecraft List Confirmation Request > (2268188065) > > > > > > This is an automated message from the > theatrical.net list manager. > > > > Somebody (hopefully you!) has requested the > subscribe(digest) > > operation for your address to > the > > "Stagecraft" mailing > list. > > > > You must send confirmation to complete this > operation. Please > > use the reply command in your mail program to > write back to > > the list server. > > > > Check that the Subject of the reply message > contains > > the confirmation ID: 2268188065, > > the reply is directed to > , > > and the 'From' address of your reply is > . > > > > If you do not want to perform this operation, > simply do nothing. > > > > The above message will automatically be processed > by the list > > server. To reach a human, please send > administrative queries > > to > > > > For further information about this mailing list, > please see > > our web site: > > . > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Subject: RE: American Flag (meaning) Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 12:22:26 -0400 Message-ID: <6E497ADB607656479C24E6D7BF6B505A042A9C91 [at] exchange.rmwc.edu> From: "Paul Schreiner" > It's not the object itself, it's what it represents. At the same time, there's another side of it all which Kristi didn't explain--at least not overtly. From the earliest ages, schoolchildren are somewhat, well, "indoctrinated" (for lack of a better word) into something which (IMHO) goes a bit beyond developing a healthy respect for the flag (and what it represents), but borders on worship. All of the buzzwords we connect with it--patriotism, freedom, democracy, etc.--are hammered into us as our "divine mandate" as Americans. We're taught in schools that this is the "greatest democracy/military/free country" the world has ever known, and we begin to identify ourselves at our own individual cores as "Americans" through that emblem, with all the emotional baggage that those buzzwords entail. (I'll refrain from cynical comments about the calculated use of those buzzwords these days, though.) Our (relative) isolation from differing viewpoints about the "rightfulness" of our dominant position in the global economy, culture, and politics continues the cycle of reinforcing this identification. For better or worse, for many in this country the flag stands for all they've been taught is good and right with us as a people, and it becomes our surrogate selves abroad. "Attacks" on this flag, then, are felt and taken personally, because the identification with it is so powerful. And when there is any sort of insecurity about that "rightful" place on the world's totem pole, the natural inclination for just about everyone is to practically deify the symbol, to say, "look at this and think about it, and you'll see we really are all about goodness and freedom and so forth." And at that point, it's no longer rational, but completely and utterly emotional (and, to a certain extent, genetic...as a "tribal" or group identity). One of the first things kids learn in school is the "Pledge of Allegiance", written around the turn of the last century. At the beginning of the Cold War, the words "under God" were added to it to distinguish us from those "godless commies", and it's been recited on a daily basis by practically every schoolchild since. With that level of repetitive programming, it's far too understandable to see where this depth of emotional connection comes from. For what might be a pretty good indicator of some of the unspoken qualities connected with flag images, check out the famous pic of the US Marines hoisting the flag on the top of Mt. Suribachi (Iwo Jima) during WWII. It's one of a very small handful of images that I can think of which practically every single person who's lived in this country for even a small time has ingrained in their unconscious. Again, all this is meant to be a somewhat dispassionate commentary as seen "from the inside". Make of it what you will, but I hope it helps. ------------------------------ From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com Message-ID: <3fa.3227ca1.31b07b9d [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 13:19:25 EDT Subject: Re: American Flag In a message dated 6/1/06 1:56:13 AM W. Europe Daylight Time, bill [at] sapsis-rigging.com writes: >Why, just why, does any one think that the American Flag is of the slightest >interest or importance to anyone? Because, *** ****, people have been discussing it in a heated but civilized manner. A hint, as Tony mentioned. You are on very thin ice here. If you have an opinion about it that's one thing, but to assume that no one should give a damn is just wrong. Well, why? Any national flag says:" here are citizens of this country". No more, and no less. Flown on official buildings, it suggests that the local administration lives here, at any rate in France. It is much the same in the army, with regimental colours, but not quite. Not only do these declare which regiment it is, they also carry their battle honours. I knew that I was on thin ice when I made the original post, and that there would be some flak. It's just that it's an attitude of mind that I cannot understand. After 9/11, the President and most of his government have been wearing the Stars and Stripes as lapel badges. In there any doubt that they are US citizens? ------------------------------ Subject: RE: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 12:26:29 -0500 Message-ID: <4F82471BF334634A99A1E1C6334D67A76361F6 [at] uhs-exchng1.uhs.wisc.edu> From: "Hentschel, Randy" -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Jo Vandver Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 11:20 AM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- --- tomgrab [at] utpa.edu wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > > --------------------------------------------------- >=20 >=20 >=20 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: blank [at] panam.edu [mailto:blank [at] panam.edu]=20 > > Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 8:08 AM > > To: tomgrab [at] utpa.edu > > Subject: stagecraft List Confirmation Request > (2268188065) > >=20 > >=20 > > This is an automated message from the > theatrical.net list manager. > >=20 > > Somebody (hopefully you!) has requested the > subscribe(digest)=20 > > operation for your address to > the=20 > > "Stagecraft" mailing > list. > >=20 > > You must send confirmation to complete this > operation. Please=20 > > use the reply command in your mail program to > write back to=20 > > the list server. > >=20 > > Check that the Subject of the reply message > contains > > the confirmation ID: 2268188065, > > the reply is directed to > , > > and the 'From' address of your reply is > . > >=20 > > If you do not want to perform this operation, > simply do nothing. > >=20 > > The above message will automatically be processed > by the list=20 > > server. To reach a human, please send > administrative queries=20 > > to > >=20 > > For further information about this mailing list, > please see=20 > > our web site: > > . > > >=20 >=20 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around=20 http://mail.yahoo.com=20 ------------------------------ Subject: RE: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 13:28:02 -0400 Message-ID: <6E497ADB607656479C24E6D7BF6B505A042A9C92 [at] exchange.rmwc.edu> From: "Paul Schreiner" > I knew that I was on thin ice when I made the original post,=20 > and that there=20 > would be some flak. It's just that it's an attitude of mind=20 > that I cannot=20 > understand.=20 Frank, it *might* be a good idea to read *all* the posts in a thread before you start replying. Your question has been answered a couple of times since then... ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" Subject: RE: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 13:28:27 -0400 Message-ID: <00f301c685a0$cb55b090$6501a8c0 [at] Dell> In-Reply-To: > It's just that it's an attitude of mind=20 > that I cannot=20 > understand. ...Just as many of us cannot understand the reference that some British = have for the monarchy; to us, it's a symbol of repression; to you, it's = something else. Unfortunately, some Americans resort to flag-waving "patriotism" as an alternative to really thinking; the *real* patriots love their country = not because it's where they happen to have been born, but because of the = ideals for which it stands. ------------------------------ Subject: RE: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 13:29:40 -0400 Message-ID: <6E497ADB607656479C24E6D7BF6B505A042A9C93 [at] exchange.rmwc.edu> From: "Paul Schreiner" Whoa, Nelly! How many more iterations of this are the digesters gonna have to wade through? I've seen three replies that have quoted the whole thing without adding anything so far...is something weird going on? ------------------------------ Subject: RE: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 13:32:23 -0400 Message-ID: <6E497ADB607656479C24E6D7BF6B505A042A9C94 [at] exchange.rmwc.edu> From: "Paul Schreiner" Cc: stagecraft [at] jeffsalzberg.com > Unfortunately, some Americans resort to flag-waving=20 > "patriotism" as an alternative to really thinking; the *real*=20 > patriots love their country not because it's where they=20 > happen to have been born, but because of the ideals for which=20 > it stands. And then some of us love the ideals primarily. There's enough other progressive nations today that we don't need to be so territorial about it, especially when a lot of those ideals are being sacrificed these days by our corporately-elected "representatives". Oh, wait...did I say that out loud? Sorry... ------------------------------ From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com Message-ID: <467.26a5009.31b07f08 [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 13:34:00 EDT Subject: Re: American Flag In a message dated 6/1/06 7:29:02 PM W. Europe Daylight Time, pschreiner [at] rmwc.edu writes: << Frank, it *might* be a good idea to read *all* the posts in a thread before you start replying. Your question has been answered a couple of times since then... >> Sorry. I've just transferred my base to France for the summer, and I may have missed a few messages. ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20060601104638.00d49868 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 10:46:38 From: CB Subject: Re: American Flag >The simple fact of burning a flag is no big deal. It's just a piece of >fabric being destroyed. But the tone of voice makes all the difference. And the tone of voice in which you do it should be protected by what that flag stands for. I'd rather not have a flag than have one that was more important than the freedoms that those that spilled their blood to secure them fought for. If you do not wish to make a political statement, make sure that the flag is treated with the respect that it deserves. If you *do* wish to make a political statement, be prepared, as there are quite a few people (as will be evidenced by the responses to this thread) that are completely irrational about the preotection of teh cotton drop while fully willing to soil what the symbol actually stands for. And they tend to be armed. Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com Message-ID: <4ab.b4e72c.31b08198 [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 13:44:56 EDT Subject: Re: American Flag In a message dated 6/1/06 7:29:07 PM W. Europe Daylight Time, stagecraft [at] jeffsalzberg.com writes: << ...Just as many of us cannot understand the reference that some British have for the monarchy; to us, it's a symbol of repression; to you, it's something else. >> Fair enough, although I think you mean 'reverence'. But the Monarch is the last line of defence against an elected tyranny. Any law enacted needs the consent of the House of Commons, the House of Lords, and of the Monarch. The last can always be refused. It would provoke a first-class constitutional crisis, and has never been done. But the option is there. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <01c901c685a4$2993a330$e28aaa43 [at] DonTaco> From: "Don Taco" References: Subject: Re: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 10:52:27 -0700 From: "Paul Schreiner" And then some of us love the ideals primarily. There's enough other progressive nations today that we don't need to be so territorial about it, especially when a lot of those ideals are being sacrificed these days by our corporately-elected "representatives". Oh, wait...did I say that out loud? Sorry... Just be careful of saying it over the telephone... ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20060601105724.00d49868 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 10:57:24 From: CB Subject: Re: American Flag >Proving once again that we are an industry separated by a common language. Technically, you are correct, Bill. He was just citing common mis-usage of the term. I think that this is why I will always get a lectern three times when I ask for a podium, and only get an actual podium thre fourth time if I am lucky and loud. Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ Message-ID: <005e01c685a4$2ebbd3f0$1401a8c0 [at] chris> Reply-To: "chrisharris25" From: "chrisharris25" References: Subject: Re: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 13:52:42 -0400 Chris "Chris" Babbie wrote >If you *do* wish to make a political statement, be prepared, as there are >quite a few people (as will > be evidenced by the responses to this thread) that are completely > irrational about the preotection of teh cotton drop while fully willing to > soil what the symbol actually stands for. And they tend to be armed. > (Peering through the scope) "I can still SEE YOU!!!!" ;-)))) Chris Harris Sapsis Rigging, Inc. ------------------------------ From: IAEG [at] aol.com Message-ID: <24c.b94a87f.31b08381 [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 13:53:05 EDT Subject: American Flag RESET, , Original post? getting back to the ORIGINAL subject, , I can't figure out who did the original posting, If you still need a flag, I have a 38 x 20 available for rent, with a sleeve sewn in the top of the 38' width (done at the factory) it's available for rent contact me off list best regards, Keith Arsenault International Arts & Entertainment Group Tampa, FL iaeg [at] aol.com ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20060601110113.00d49868 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 11:01:13 From: CB Subject: Re: Next generation control surface? >Just what is a 'control surface'? By me, it's a panel with a lot of faders, >and, for sound, al lot of ancilliary controls. Ehm, its pretty straight-forward, Frank. It's a surface, to which controls are attached. In this case, the controls would be virtual, and controlled by a touch sesitive screen, or IR cross-hatch, or both. It would work in a very similar way to knobs and faders, just accessed differently. Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 13:56:34 -0400 From: Stephen Litterst Subject: Re: American Flag In-reply-to: Message-id: <447F2A52.9050405 [at] ithaca.edu> References: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com wrote: > --------------------------------------------------- > > In a message dated 6/1/06 7:29:07 PM W. Europe Daylight Time, > stagecraft [at] jeffsalzberg.com writes: > > << ...Just as many of us cannot understand the reference that some British > have > for the monarchy; to us, it's a symbol of repression; to you, it's something > else. >> > > Fair enough, although I think you mean 'reverence'. Not to speak for Jeff, but I will anyway. Repression is the appropriate word. In the 1700s, the rights and privileges of the colonists were slowly eroded by a monarchy that was trying to figure out how to pay for an ever expanding colonial system in North America. Had George III relaxed his grip and offered the Colonies some autonomy, things would have proceeded differently. To Americans, the monarchy is a symbol of repression. To some Britons, and other members of the Empire, it is a symbol of reverence. To others, it is a symbol of irrelevance. Likewise, to many Americans the flag is a symbol of reverence, while to many others (internal and external) it is a symbol of repression, imperialism, irrelevance, etc. YMMV Steve L. -- Stephen Litterst Technical Supervisor Ithaca College, Theatre Arts 607.274.3947 slitterst [at] ithaca.edu ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20060601110725.00d49868 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 11:07:25 From: CB Subject: Re: American Flag >I haven't seen or heard anyone from this list criticize the Monarchy, the >Union Jack or warm beer, for that matter. That's not fair, Bill! The beer is only warm because Lucas makes their 'fridgers! >And then he said... >>Why, just why, does any one think that the American Flag is of the slightest >>interest or importance to anyone? OOoohh! Frank, we have an old saying here inb the US about how to keep yourself healthy and mobile, it's, "Don't poke the bear, old son". Folks'll get all kinds of irrationally dangerous here if you start in on old Bets' handiwork. Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "Josh Ratty" Subject: RE: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 14:04:29 -0400 Message-ID: <007001c685a5$d4c4e790$b00b0a0a [at] Rattys> In-reply-to: Not to speak for Frank but I think he was referring to the word reference. Reference = reverence. Now to speak for myself, repression is indeed the right word. Now where were those nomex suits again? Josh Ratty -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Stephen Litterst Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 12:57 PM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: American Flag For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- FrankWood95 [at] aol.com wrote: > --------------------------------------------------- > > In a message dated 6/1/06 7:29:07 PM W. Europe Daylight Time, > stagecraft [at] jeffsalzberg.com writes: > > << ...Just as many of us cannot understand the reference that some British > have > for the monarchy; to us, it's a symbol of repression; to you, it's something > else. >> > > Fair enough, although I think you mean 'reverence'. Not to speak for Jeff, but I will anyway. Repression is the appropriate word. In the 1700s, the rights and privileges of the colonists were slowly eroded by a monarchy that was trying to figure out how to pay for an ever expanding colonial system in North America. Had George III relaxed his grip and offered the Colonies some autonomy, things would have proceeded differently. To Americans, the monarchy is a symbol of repression. To some Britons, and other members of the Empire, it is a symbol of reverence. To others, it is a symbol of irrelevance. Likewise, to many Americans the flag is a symbol of reverence, while to many others (internal and external) it is a symbol of repression, imperialism, irrelevance, etc. YMMV Steve L. -- Stephen Litterst Technical Supervisor Ithaca College, Theatre Arts 607.274.3947 slitterst [at] ithaca.edu ------------------------------ Message-ID: <1225.205.215.253.118.1149185480.squirrel [at] webmail.peak.org> In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 11:11:20 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: American Flag (meaning) From: "Bill Nelson" > It's not the object itself, it's what it represents. Or what it used to represent. > It represents the responsibility of people to care for themselves, to work > hard for the right achieve whatever their minds can dream. Unless their jobs are exported overseas. > It represents my right to work in a "man's" job, to have as many or as few > children as I wish and to worship the God of my choice... or not. This is changing. > It represents my right to voice disagrement with my government without > fear of retaliation. Not any more. > It represents freedom. Not nearly as much as about 6 years or so ago. > The USA is far from perfect, but I'll stand shoulder to shoulder with Trey > to defend it. In most countries of the world, I could never be more than > a lowly woman. Here... I'm a proud American. As I did in the 60's, and would again, if necessary. > The flag has meaning for us because WE give it that meaning. We're a young > enough country that most of us have lost a family member in the fight to > defend the freedom of the USA and it's free allies. The ideals on which our country was founded have meaning to me. To some, the flag is just a symbol (reminder) of those ideals. To others, it is to be revered. To even others, it is an item that is worshiped like a deity. Then there are the outlyers who either have no feeling about the flag at all - or use it as a convenient blindfold/distraction. Bill ------------------------------ Message-ID: <8231e7ea0606011124k54ddec17h235e1ab90f187632 [at] mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 14:24:46 -0400 From: SS Subject: Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) In-Reply-To: References: > Whoa, Nelly! > > How many more iterations of this are the digesters gonna have to wade > through? I've seen three replies that have quoted the whole thing > without adding anything so far...is something weird going on? You are not alone. I am a non-digester and those suckers keep popping up on me. Noah, you the man!!! -Nelly (formerly SS-TTS-EKU) "Diplomacy is the art of saying "good doggie" until you find a suitable rock. " ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "Jeffrey E. Salzberg" Subject: RE: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 14:26:59 -0400 Message-ID: <010901c685a8$f8f2a7d0$6501a8c0 [at] Dell> In-Reply-To: > is something weird going on? At any time in the history of the stagecraft list, that would be a given. ------------------------------ Subject: RE: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 14:30:09 -0400 Message-ID: <6E497ADB607656479C24E6D7BF6B505A042A9C95 [at] exchange.rmwc.edu> From: "Paul Schreiner" Cc: stagecraft [at] jeffsalzberg.com > > is something weird going on? >=20 > At any time in the history of the stagecraft list, that would=20 > be a given. Point taken. I shoulda phrased it "unusually weird" or "weirder than normal" or "some heretofore-undocumented weirdness". ------------------------------ Subject: RE: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 14:31:54 -0400 Message-ID: <6E497ADB607656479C24E6D7BF6B505A042A9C96 [at] exchange.rmwc.edu> From: "Paul Schreiner" > Oh, wait...did I say that out loud? Sorry... >=20 > Just be careful of saying it over the telephone... Why's that? I ain't got nuthin' to be afeared over. I'm a Merrikan, not some danged terrist! ------------------------------ Message-ID: <01eb01c685aa$cbb689b0$e28aaa43 [at] DonTaco> From: "Don Taco" References: Subject: Re: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 11:39:50 -0700 > Now to speak for myself, repression is > indeed the right word. Now where were those nomex suits again? > > Josh Ratty > For yourself? You were there? You experienced the repression? I suspect you are relaying what you've read or were told. And the people who win the battles write the history books. ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "Josh Ratty" Subject: RE: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 14:40:24 -0400 Message-ID: <007101c685aa$dad16b90$b00b0a0a [at] Rattys> In-reply-to: Point taken -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Don Taco Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 1:40 PM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: American Flag For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- > Now to speak for myself, repression is > indeed the right word. Now where were those nomex suits again? > > Josh Ratty > For yourself? You were there? You experienced the repression? I suspect you are relaying what you've read or were told. And the people who win the battles write the history books. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 11:46:50 -0700 From: Jerry Durand Subject: Re: American Flag In-reply-to: Message-id: <7.0.1.0.0.20060601114554.01f12800 [at] interstellar.com> References:

At 11:39 AM 6/1/2006, Don Taco wrote: > And the people who win the battles write the history books. I think that's changing somewhat with the current wave of bloggers. At least until they're all shut down for "national security" reasons (like they are in China). -- Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc. www.interstellar.com 219 Oak Wood Way, Los Gatos, California 95032-2523 USA tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886 Skype: jerrydurand ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 14:48:06 -0400 From: Stephen Litterst Subject: Re: American Flag In-reply-to: Message-id: <447F3666.6040504 [at] ithaca.edu> References:

Don Taco wrote: > --------------------------------------------------- > And the people who win the battles write the history books. Not to take us further afield, but this is an interesting point to explore on some historical events. I had a conversation about the war of 1812 with our TD, who is the Canadian born/raised son of an English national. What his father taught him about the War of 1812 was different from the Canadian books which was different from my knowledge of the War. Steve L. -- Stephen Litterst Technical Supervisor Ithaca College, Theatre Arts 607.274.3947 slitterst [at] ithaca.edu ------------------------------ Message-ID: <1326.205.215.253.118.1149189004.squirrel [at] webmail.peak.org> In-Reply-To: References:

Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 12:10:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: power question From: "Bill Nelson" > Any scenario involving powering of an installation with a generator as > an alternative to the normal supply should be done via a proper > changeover switch that only allows one or the other to be connected to > the installations wiring. Yep. I left all that out as unnecessarily complicating the discussion. A Break Before Make transfer switch is certainly necessary in such installations. As supplemental power, there is also the concern about having two independent power sources operating at the same time - resulting in different reference ground potentials, frequencies, phases etc. Bill ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 12:21:42 -0700 From: Jerry Durand Subject: Re: power question In-reply-to: Message-id: <7.0.1.0.0.20060601121958.01f193f0 [at] interstellar.com> References:

At 12:10 PM 6/1/2006, Bill Nelson wrote: >As supplemental power, there is also the concern about having two >independent power sources operating at the same time - resulting in >different reference ground potentials, frequencies, phases etc. For his lighting rig, this could be handled by having one set of dimmers COMPLETELY powered off the generator and the other set COMPLETELY powered off the house power. Just make sure there is an isolator (optical, magnetic, radio, etc.) in the DMX cable so there is NO electrical connection (besides Earth Safety Ground) between the systems. -- Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc. www.interstellar.com 219 Oak Wood Way, Los Gatos, California 95032-2523 USA tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886 Skype: jerrydurand ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 15:19:19 -0500 Subject: Re: power question From: Greg Persinger Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Bill and Jerry, Re-read Mike's post. on 5/31/06 7:17 AM, Mike Burnett at mburnett [at] huntington.edu wrote: > The generator is going to be used in this system on campus at locations > where there isn't power...i.e. on the quad, outside the dining commons, > etc. Connection of this generator to utility power or any utility fed breaker panel doesn't sound like it is an issue. Mike wants to know how to connect a four wire (two hot legs, a neutral, and a ground) to a three wire (two hot legs and a ground ??????) distro box that his house electrician put together. The unknown is how exactly his electrician wired the distro as it doesn't sound like it is wired correctly to support 120 Volt devices (which the AS40 dimmers are). Instead it sounds as though it is wired to support 208/220 Volt devices. It may be wired to support 120 Volt devices but not be done to any normal standard and as such it definitely doesn't meet code. Might it work? Yes. Is it correctly and safely done? In my opinion no. At a minimum it needs new approved portable cable to go from the generator to the distro. Beyond that there isn't enough information to give a good answer. The distro may need rewired, it may need appropriate breakers, etc. This http://www.lexproducts.com/catalog/distBoxes/DBS100FP-B4B2.htm Or this http://www.lexproducts.com/catalog/distBoxes/DB60A-C03320.htm Except in a 40Amp single phase, two hot leg version with the appropriate connector for his generator is what Mike needs. Greg Persinger ------------------------------ From: "ladesigners [at] juno.com" Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 21:10:30 GMT Subject: Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) Message-Id: <20060601.141121.28846.23217 [at] webmail31.lax.untd.com> Always, but remember that we create weirdness; other folk are only an au= dience for the weirdness that we create. This is our sacred responsibili= ty and must not be taken lightly. It could be argued that "All that is R= EAL is onstage, and everything else is FAKE." /s/ Richard ________________________ is something weird going on? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 17:13:47 -0400 Subject: Re: American Flag From: Bill Sapsis Message-ID: In-Reply-To: To add yet another possible reason or two or three to this discussion. I'm really enjoying this, BTW. There are some very well thought out and passionate responses here. That's great.) Our ancestors came from all over the place. We don't have that many symbols to call our own so I think we're pretty protective of the ones we do have. Think of all those folks that came here in the 1800's and came through Ellis island. The first things they saw were the Statue of Liberty and the flag. The statue they couldn't move around so well, but the flag they could. I don't think a lot of people in those days cared what others thought but I do think they cared about what they thought. The flag was their way of telling themselves that they had made it. (For sure there were damn few other ways.) And we are a passionate people. We get all riled up over the damndest things. Back in the 60's (what I remember of them) the flag was a wonderful way to display your passion about what was going on in the world at the time. During two World Wars that flag came to symbolize freedom for a lot of people all over the world. A lot of people lost a lot of family and friends in those wars and they weren't always sure what it was all about. But they knew that those deaths were for something right. The flag helped make that tangible for them. And yes, we have indeed been indoctrinated. But that's not always a bad thing. As I tell my rigging classes, you're going to break the rules, that's a given. But you need to know the basics, you need that foundation so that you know when you are breaking the rules and how best to break them to achieve what you attempting to do. That indoctrination gave me the foundation to go out in the 60's and 70's and protest what I thought was wrong at the time. And I broke some rules. There are things I absolutely hate about this country these days and would love to find a way to change them. But I still proudly fly the flag at my shop and my home every day. Double standard? Nah. It's just us exercising the freedom to be as diverse and happy and quarrelsome as you want all at the same time. By the way, the best parade I have ever seen was the Fourth of July parade in Truckee, CA back in the mid 80's. Small town USA showing what they were proud of. Boy scout troops. Girl scout troops. (not marching together, mind you). The local VFW and even the day care all got into the act. The route was all of 1/4 mile long and it was over in 15 minutes. But it was very, very cool. If you want to see something really oddball, when I'm in town for the local parade here I can usually be found on my rollerblades with a couple of flags sticking out of my boots. Now there's an image. Later Bill S. ETCP Certified Rigger - Theatre www.sapsis-rigging.com 800.727.7471 267.278.4561 mobile Join the Long Reach Long Riders on their 3rd annual cross country charity motorcycle ride. On 6/1/06 1:19 PM, "FrankWood95 [at] aol.com" wrote: > Well, why? Any national flag says:" here are citizens of this country". No > more, and no less. Flown on official buildings, it suggests that the local > administration lives here, at any rate in France. It is much the same in the > army, > with regimental colours, but not quite. Not only do these declare which > regiment it is, they also carry their battle honours. > > I knew that I was on thin ice when I made the original post, and that there > would be some flak. It's just that it's an attitude of mind that I cannot > understand. After 9/11, the President and most of his government have been > wearing > the Stars and Stripes as lapel badges. In there any doubt that they are US > citizens? ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "chip.a.wood" Subject: RE: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 14:19:15 -0700 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Wandering through a London used book store, I happened upon a middle-school British history book. Curious, I looked up the American Revolution, it got a scant 1/2 page and basically said that the Colonies weren't worth much, England had bigger fish to fry, and the Colonists were let go to wander in the wilderness. It is true that England has a much longer history to cover, but 1/2 page! Chip > -----Original Message----- > From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net]On Behalf Of Stephen > Litterst > > And the people who win the battles write the history books. > > Not to take us further afield, but this is an interesting point to > explore on some historical events. I had a conversation about the war > of 1812 with our TD, who is the Canadian born/raised son of an English > national. What his father taught him about the War of 1812 was > different from the Canadian books which was different from my knowledge > of the War. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 17:28:25 -0400 From: Kevin Lee Allen Subject: Re: American Flag In-reply-to: Message-id: References:

the small town of Hudson, NY has an annual Flag Day Parade. I =20 recommend it to all. This is a city of about 20,00, just south of Albany and right on the =20 river. The main drag is about a mile long and the flag day parade is =20 about 2 miles long. There is a decorating contest and the many =20 antique dealers go hog wild. Victorian mansions and storefronts =20 literally covered in red, white and blue bunting. Flags everywhere. =20 It seems like they have 50,000 volunteer fire companies in the parade. We have watched the parade near the starting point and then cruised =20 along a side street to our favorite watering hole and seen most of it =20= go by again. That might be considered the starting pint. The parade is followed by a barbecue and fireworks over the river. I think that is great. I also think it is great that someone can burn =20= that flag in protest. Thanks to all for their heartfelt ideas about the flag. On Jun 1, 2006, at 5:13 PM, Bill Sapsis wrote: > By the way, the best parade I have ever seen was the Fourth of July =20= > parade > in Truckee, CA back in the mid 80's. Small town USA showing what =20 > they were > proud of. Boy scout troops. Girl scout troops. (not marching =20 > together, > mind you). The local VFW and even the day care all got into the =20 > act. The > route was all of 1/4 mile long and it was over in 15 minutes. But =20 > it was > very, very cool. ----- Kevin Lee Allen Architect of Dreams http://www.klad.com 973.744.6352.voice 201.280.3841.mobile klad [at] klad.com =F0 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 17:35:10 -0400 From: Kevin Lee Allen Subject: Re: American Flag (meaning) In-reply-to: Message-id: <5208A779-4F67-4E5E-BB91-9B42C12C1B12 [at] klad.com> References: On Flag Day, correct? On Jun 1, 2006, at 11:38 AM, MissWisc [at] aol.com wrote: > My son has been well-trained in flag etiquette thanks to the =20 > American Legion > (who will properly dispose of flags by respectfully burning them. The > ceremony is next week.) ----- Kevin Lee Allen Architect of Dreams http://www.klad.com 973.744.6352.voice 201.280.3841.mobile klad [at] klad.com =F0 ------------------------------ From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com Message-ID: <3c4.3378dc8.31b0b9f1 [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 17:45:21 EDT Subject: Re: Next generation control surface? In a message dated 6/1/06 7:54:36 PM W. Europe Daylight Time, psyd [at] cox.net writes: << Ehm, its pretty straight-forward, Frank. It's a surface, to which controls are attached. In this case, the controls would be virtual, and controlled by a touch sesitive screen, or IR cross-hatch, or both. It would work in a very similar way to knobs and faders, just accessed differently. >> I had a horrid feeling that that was what was meant. I just hoped that I was wrong. How anyone can presume to control any aspect of a performance without 'hands-on' faders is beyond me. ------------------------------ Message-ID: Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 17:47:40 -0400 From: "Ken Romaine" Subject: Re: American Flag In-Reply-To: References:

On 6/1/06, Bill Sapsis wrote: > > By the way, the best parade I have ever seen was the Fourth of July parade > in Truckee, CA back in the mid 80's. Small town USA showing what they were > proud of. Boy scout troops. Girl scout troops. (not marching together, > mind you). The local VFW and even the day care all got into the act. The > route was all of 1/4 mile long and it was over in 15 minutes. But it was > very, very cool. As it turns out, the July 4th Parade in my town sounds very like that - add in the fire departments from several surrounding towns, a collection of antique and classic cars, and (sometimes) a local Harley owners association. To quote an astute person, "very, very cool." > If you want to see something really oddball, when I'm in town for the local > parade here I can usually be found on my rollerblades with a couple of flags > sticking out of my boots. > > Now there's an image. Except that I won't get to see this year's parade, due to the fact that I've gouged out my eyes. -- Ken Romaine Business Development Manager Barco Media & Entertainment The opinions expressed here are mine - all mine - no matter how much I want to impose them on the rest of the world. ------------------------------ From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com Message-ID: <3b7.3cae5a1.31b0bab0 [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 17:48:32 EDT Subject: Re: American Flag In a message dated 6/1/06 8:01:28 PM W. Europe Daylight Time, psyd [at] cox.net writes: << >I haven't seen or heard anyone from this list criticize the Monarchy, the >Union Jack or warm beer, for that matter. That's not fair, Bill! The beer is only warm because Lucas makes their 'fridgers! >> Not true. It's because we prefer our beer without all the flavour frozen out of it. ------------------------------ Reply-To: From: "chip.a.wood" Subject: RE: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 14:48:41 -0700 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Bill I have a half written reply to this thread about my hippy-dippy 60's and protest and passion and patriotism, but you said it better. Thanks. I would have thought this group would be conservative leaning but I guess I was wrong. The whole world is no longer watching, but the spirit lives on. Maybe we did change the world, if only slightly. Peace! Chip > -----Original Message----- > From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net]On Behalf Of Bill > Sapsis > > And we are a passionate people. We get all riled up over the damndest > things. Back in the 60's (what I remember of them) the flag was > a wonderful > way to display your passion about what was going on in the world at the > time. > ------------------------------ From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com Message-ID: <4ae.bc1a96.31b0bd26 [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 17:59:02 EDT Subject: Re: American Flag In a message dated 6/1/06 8:48:48 PM W. Europe Daylight Time, slitterst [at] ithaca.edu writes: << I had a conversation about the war of 1812 with our TD, who is the Canadian born/raised son of an English national. What his father taught him about the War of 1812 was different from the Canadian books which was different from my knowledge of the War. >> I don't think that you were actually in it, but I know what you mean. History is written by historians, most of whom have an axe to grind, and some a political axe. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <84c790f30606011501q15b4fd7cq916b0d580be51d39 [at] mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 18:01:26 -0400 From: "Shawn King" Subject: Re: Next generation control surface? In-Reply-To: References: You should watch the video that was referred to in the OP. Then you can see the possibilities! I would love to see this technology... the photo montage was my favorite part. SK On 6/1/06, FrankWood95 [at] aol.com wrote: > > How anyone can presume to control any aspect of a performance without > 'hands-on' faders is beyond me. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <008201c685cc$2065c180$6401a8c0 [at] amd2200> From: "Idaho Scenic & Rigging" References: Subject: Re: Next generation control surface? Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 16:38:31 -0600 between robotic lighting fixtures, twelve truck one day shows, and now virtual control panels, I fear Frank, that the world, hasn't necessarily passed you by, but is just barely with in reach. Keep learning the technology, unless, in (less than) ten years you plan on only lighting dinosaurs. Rob't ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Stagecraft" Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 3:45 PM Subject: Re: Next generation control surface? > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > In a message dated 6/1/06 7:54:36 PM W. Europe Daylight Time, psyd [at] cox.net > writes: > > << > Ehm, its pretty straight-forward, Frank. It's a surface, to which controls > are attached. In this case, the controls would be virtual, and controlled > by a touch sesitive screen, or IR cross-hatch, or both. It would work in a > very similar way to knobs and faders, just accessed differently. >> > > I had a horrid feeling that that was what was meant. I just hoped that I was > wrong. > > How anyone can presume to control any aspect of a performance without > 'hands-on' faders is beyond me. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <009101c685cd$b2c40ae0$6401a8c0 [at] amd2200> From: "Idaho Scenic & Rigging" References:

Subject: Re: Next generation control surface? Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 16:49:40 -0600 The possibilities... just about endless. from a virtual etch a sketch for my grand son to infinitesimal "slider" adjustment for a NASA rocket burn. Puts da whoop ass on my Wacom Tablet. again the link http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6379146923853181774&q=touchscreen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shawn King" > > You should watch the video that was referred to in the OP. Then you > can see the possibilities! I would love to see this technology... the > photo montage was my favorite part. > > SK > > How anyone can presume to control any aspect of a performance without > > 'hands-on' faders is beyond me. ------------------------------ From: "Joe Golden" Subject: RE: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 16:17:43 -0700 Message-ID: In-reply-to: verses the ones made at 3AM... -----Original Message----- There are some very well thought out and passionate responses here. That's great.) ------------------------------ Message-ID: <00b501c685dd$ece6e7a0$6401a8c0 [at] amd2200> From: "Idaho Scenic & Rigging" Subject: Multi touch Interaction Research Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 18:45:55 -0600 This is Jeff Han's website re: the touchscreen video http://mrl.nyu.edu/~jhan/ftirtouch/index.html ------------------------------ Message-ID: Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 20:49:26 -0400 From: "Paul Schreiner" Cc: chip.wood [at] ieee.org Subject: Re: American Flag In-Reply-To: References:

> I would have thought this group would be conservative leaning Ack! Heavens forfend! C'mon, you've read enough of Unka Bill (thanks for the "Alice's Restaurant" mention a few years ago, BTW) and CB and others here to know otherwise. Besides, we work in the arts. We're artsy types. Conservatives tend not to gravitate towards this as a profession, I've found. I have a theory (and it's not about the brontosaurus)...artsy types and educating types tend to be more progressive/liberal than business types, because (IMO) the root of liberalism/conservatism tends to be where on the scale of "self" vs. "others" one's concerns tend to lie--especially financially. There was a big deal a year or two ago about how there are more liberals than conservatives on the faculties of colleges/universities...a so-called "liberal bias". But I think rather that all the conservatives went into the private sector jobs that pay more... ------------------------------ Message-ID: <022a01c685df$dd8c79d0$e28aaa43 [at] DonTaco> From: "Don Taco" References: Subject: Re: Next generation control surface? Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 17:59:46 -0700 From: >> are attached. In this case, the controls would be virtual, and >> controlled >> very similar way to knobs and faders, just accessed differently. >> > > I had a horrid feeling that that was what was meant. I just hoped that I > was > wrong. > > How anyone can presume to control any aspect of a performance without > 'hands-on' faders is beyond me. > I will pass that wisdom on to the orchestra conductor. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <023101c685e0$6954a000$e28aaa43 [at] DonTaco> From: "Don Taco" References: Subject: Re: American Flag Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 18:03:40 -0700 From: <> << >I haven't seen or heard anyone from this list criticize the Monarchy, the <> >Union Jack or warm beer, for that matter. <> <> That's not fair, Bill! The beer is only warm because Lucas makes their <> 'fridgers! >> > > Not true. It's because we prefer our beer without all the flavour frozen > out > of it. > If you are insinuating that the cold takes the flavor out of typical American beer, you are dead wrong. There is no flavor when it's warm, either.. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <447F96BD.1040504 [at] dreampossible.ca> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 21:39:09 -0400 From: Jim Hyslop Organization: Dreampossible Inc. Subject: Re: American Flag References:

In-Reply-To: Jeff Grams wrote: > Gee Jim I think he already did. j. Not really. Steve made several passionate and stirring comments about his battle experience, from which I can infer a strong sense of patriotism and pride in doing what he feels is right. However, there is still a missing link from that to such a strong feeling for, almost a worship of, the flag. Having been in the militia myself, I understand why military people are passionate about their colours, but being Canadian I have not experienced nor understood the level of respect that the general American population gives to the flag. Until now. Thank you to all who responded for supplying valuable insights into the American psyche (or at least, as represented by the members of this list :=) -- Jim Hyslop ------------------------------ Message-ID: Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 21:44:19 -0400 From: "Paul Schreiner" Subject: Re: American Flag In-Reply-To: References:

> If you are insinuating that the cold takes the flavor out of typical > American beer, you are dead wrong. There is no flavor when it's warm, > either.. Ah, but what about the horse p1ss that masquerades as American macrobrew? That most certainly does have a taste when warm... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 21:55:31 -0400 Subject: Re: American Flag From: Bill Sapsis Message-ID: In-Reply-To: I have got to stop drinking when reading these posts. Now I have tea all over the rug (missed the keyboard by inches). Not only is it funny, but it's accurate too! Thanks! Bill S ETCP Certified Rigger - Theatre www.sapsis-rigging.com 800.727.7471 267.278.4561 mobile Join the Long Reach Long Riders on their 3rd annual cross country charity motorcycle ride. On 6/1/06 9:03 PM, "Don Taco" wrote: > If you are insinuating that the cold takes the flavor out of typical > American beer, you are dead wrong. There is no flavor when it's warm, > either.. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 22:17:02 -0400 From: Kevin Lee Allen Subject: textbooks Message-id: I have been asked to teach an intro level scenic design class and a =20 drafting 2 class (intro to CAD via Vectorworks) class next semester. =20 I know there are many folks here in an academic environment and it =20 has been a long time since I thought about textbooks. I am looking for some suggestions. Is there a CAD textbook? Lynn Pecktal's first book is long out of print. I would like to =20 suggest "The Dramatic Imagination" by RE Jones, but that too seems =20 OOP. I am considering the concept part of Linda Essig's lighting text =20= for the scenic designers. Is it all online? I hope there might be some thoughts, ideas and/or =20 suggestions. Are review copies available? TIA ----- Kevin Lee Allen Architect of Dreams http://www.klad.com 973.744.6352.voice 201.280.3841.mobile klad [at] klad.com =F0 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Jan 1904 01:40:56 -0400 Subject: Re: American Flag From: Bruce Purdy Message-ID: <17A8.1195C%bpurdy [at] rochester.rr.com> In-Reply-To: > I would have thought this group would be conservative leaning but I guess I > was wrong. Speaking only for myself, I always considered myself strictly "middle of the road independent" (Until the establishment re-labelled me a "Centrist") Then a strange thing happened: First Newt Gingritch, then George W. moved the dialogue so far to the right, that I suddenly discovered that without moving my own position, I was now on the Left fringe! Thank goodness I believe that things are starting to move back in the right (correct) direction. (Not the administration, but the press and the people) Bruce -- Bruce Purdy Technical Director Smith Opera House ------------------------------ Message-ID: <1229.205.215.254.87.1149231168.squirrel [at] webmail.peak.org> In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 23:52:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: Next generation control surface? From: "Bill Nelson" > I had a horrid feeling that that was what was meant. I just hoped that I > was wrong. > > How anyone can presume to control any aspect of a performance without > 'hands-on' faders is beyond me. They ARE "hands-on", just not the type of hands-on with which you are familiar. That does not make them any less precise or less useful. Bill ------------------------------ In-Reply-To: References: Message-Id: From: Noah Price Subject: Re: stagecraft List Confirmation Request (2268188065) Date: Fri, 2 Jun 2006 00:06:05 -0700 This is why it's important to read the instructions :-) This was started when someone sent their confirmation to the list (stagecraft [at] theatrical.net) rather than to the administrative address as instructed (and as an email reply would have done). I assume after the first person did this, others saw the confirmation and just replied thinking the list server needed their response. I'm working on blocking these at the server, but please be sure you never send administrative messages to stagecraft [at] theatrical.net and we can avoid this problem entirely -- don't worry that you need to remember this, just read the instructions in any message you get from the list server, in particular the part that looks like this: > Check that the Subject of the reply message contains > the confirmation ID: (large number here), > the reply is directed to , > and the 'From' address of your reply is . Most email clients will do the right thing if you simply hit "reply" to any list confirmation or warning message. If in doubt, don't hesitate to write to me at stagecraft- web [at] theprices.net Thanks, Noahb ------------------------------ Message-ID: <1286.205.215.254.87.1149233220.squirrel [at] webmail.peak.org> In-Reply-To: References:

Date: Fri, 2 Jun 2006 00:27:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: American Flag From: "Bill Nelson" >> Not true. It's because we prefer our beer without all the flavour frozen >> out of it. >> > If you are insinuating that the cold takes the flavor out of typical > American beer, you are dead wrong. There is no flavor when it's warm, > either.. Not quite. There is usually the overwhelming bite/bitterness and aroma of heavily hopped brew - about the only flavor present. Bill ------------------------------ End of Stagecraft Digest #829 *****************************