Return-Path: X-Processed-By: Virex 7 on prxy.net X-Real-To: stagecraftlist [at] theatrical.net X-ListServer: CommuniGate Pro LIST 4.1.8 List-Unsubscribe: List-ID: Message-ID: From: "Stagecraft" Sender: "Stagecraft" To: "Stagecraft" Precedence: list Subject: Stagecraft Digest #6 Date: Fri, 14 May 2004 03:00:58 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ --------------------------------------------------- Stagecraft Digest, Issue #6 1. Re: AutoCad 3D plotting by "F. Randy deCelle" 2. Stagehand killed in fall by Michael Powers 3. Re: turntable help by Kevin Lee Allen 4. Re: AutoCad 3D plotting by "Fred Schoening, Jr." 5. Turntable Fotos, etc by "Stephen E. Rees" 6. Re: Cincinnatti Playhouse In The Park/LBLR by "Stephen E. Rees" 7. Re: Sent a message and didn't see it. Wassup? by Loren Schreiber 8. Re: Wal*Mart (Well off topic) by "Immel,Patrick" 9. Re: AutoCad 3D plotting by "Booth, Dennis" 10. Re: Wal*Mart (Well off topic) by b Ricie 11. Re: Stagehand killed in fall by "MARK OBRIEN" 12. Re: Sent a message and didn't see it. Wassup? by "Clare Adams" 13. Re: "Well off topic"? by James Kosmatka 14. respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall by kim.hartshorn [at] plattsburgh.edu 15. numbering messages? by kupfer [at] post.tau.ac.il 16. Re: respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall by "MARK OBRIEN" 17. Miami Hearald Article regarding Thomas accident by kim.hartshorn [at] plattsburgh.edu 18. Re: numbering messages? by ken [at] kenholyoak.com (Ken Holyoak) 19. Re: Miami Herald Article regarding Thomas accident by ken [at] kenholyoak.com (Ken Holyoak) 20. Re: respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall by Howard Ires 21. Re: Jamming inside Theatres by Bruce Purdy 22. Re: Miami Hearald Article regarding Thomas accident by "Tony Deeming" 23. Re: Sent a message and didn't see it. Wassup? by Bsapsis [at] aol.com 24. Re: respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall by Bsapsis [at] aol.com 25. Re: Sent a message and didn't see it. Wassup? by "Stephen E. Rees" 26. Re: respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall by kim.hartshorn [at] plattsburgh.edu 27. Re: "Well off topic"? by Rigger 28. Re: respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall by Bsapsis [at] aol.com 29. USITT NY Area Section - General Meeting - May 24 by "Scott C. Parker" 30. * Re: Stagehand falls to his death by "Sandra Hunter" 31. Re: * Re: Stagehand falls to his death by Bsapsis [at] aol.com 32. OT: OT (was RE: Wal*Mart (Well off topic)) by "Andy Leviss" 33. Re: OT: OT (was RE: Wal*Mart (Well off topic)) by Rigger 34. Re: OT (was RE: Wal*Mart (Well off topic)) by "OneOccy" 35. Re: OT (was RE: Wal*Mart (Well off topic)) by "Joe Meils" *** Please update the subject line of your reply to use the subject *** line of the message you are replying to! Please only reply to *** one message subject in each reply. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "F. Randy deCelle" Subject: Re: AutoCad 3D plotting Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 06:19:32 -0500 Message-ID: X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: Michael, I might be missing something with Patrick's suggestion, but the only thing I could get the MVIEW command to do was produce new Viewports. Maybe it's something with a newer version, as I am working in 2002 also. I do a modification of what Scott suggested. I set up my view, render to a file, and then load that image back into AutoCAD using Insert Raster. I'm going to keep working with MVIEW to see if I'm missing something and check with a newer version. Randy _________________________________________________________________ F. Randy deCelle, Assistant Professor, Chair of Scenic Technology Department of Theatre - University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 08:05:56 -0400 From: Michael Powers Subject: Stagehand killed in fall Cc: mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu (Michael Powers) Message-id: <1084449956.40a364a4bba25 [at] mail-www3.oit.umass.edu> User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2 The following excerpts are from the May 12 web issue of Lighting Demensions ED-wire. While I hesitate to speak ill of the dead, it seems as though the victim & the venue might have had some culpulbility in the event. "... Walter "Wally" Thomas, a 20 year veteran of the concert lighting industry, apparently fell to his death after not attaching his safety harness into the guide wire. ....." There seems to be a problem with the venue's working conditions or accepted procedure as the next paragraph states: "Two other spotlight operators were also working the concert and were wearing the OSHA-approved full-body harness required for such occations, but they were not using the accompanying tether as it was too dark." The article went on to point out: "Thomas previously had another fall that kept him off the job for 6 months in 1989 and paid him over $400,000 in workman's comp." Michael Michael Powers, Technical Director UMass Theatre Department 112 FAC West 151 Presidents Drive, Ofc.2 Amherst, Ma. 01003-9331 413-545-6821 voice 413-577-0025 fax mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu ------------------------------ In-Reply-To: References: Message-Id: <184B4266-A4D7-11D8-BC78-003065D2C502 [at] klad.com> From: Kevin Lee Allen Subject: Re: turntable help Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 08:14:33 -0400 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.613) http://www.yale.edu/drama/publications/tech_brief/ On May 12, 2004, at 8:52 PM, Patrick McCreary wrote: >> Yale Tech Brief ----- Kevin Lee Allen Production Designer http://www.klad.com 973.744.6352.voice 201.280.3841.cell klad [at] klad.com =F0 ------------------------------ Message-ID: <10740081.1084452784756.JavaMail.root [at] wamui07.slb.atl.earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 07:53:04 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: "Fred Schoening, Jr." Subject: Re: AutoCad 3D plotting X-Mailer: Earthlink Zoo Mail 1.0 It's true, you're missing something. Type in the "MVIEW" command. Take a close look at the options presented to you: one of them is "Hideplot." Select that (type "H", enter,) select "ON," and then it will prompt you to select which objects you want to do this to. Select which viewports you want to hide the lines in, and hit enter. You can also just double-click the viewport in question, which brings up the object properties window. There, you can just look for the "Hide plot" option and select "ON." HTH, Fred "Big Fred" Schoening Technical Director Dallas Theater Center Dallas, Texas, USA -----Original Message----- I might be missing something with Patrick's suggestion, but the only thing I could get the MVIEW command to do was produce new Viewports. Maybe it's something with a newer version, as I am working in 2002 also. I do a modification of what Scott suggested. I set up my view, render to a file, and then load that image back into AutoCAD using Insert Raster. I'm going to keep working with MVIEW to see if I'm missing something and check with a newer version. Randy ------------------------------ Message-ID: <40A37207.9000308 [at] fredonia.edu> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 09:03:03 -0400 From: "Stephen E. Rees" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 Subject: Turntable Fotos, etc References: <002a01c43873$22c6b9a0$6ec10281 [at] moscowcalling> All, I got a note from Noah saying he will put the fotos up on the Stagecraft Gallery. I'll do this and and will also do the USITT Stagecraft Reception as well. Just have to find the time. Should be pretty soon. Best, Steve Rees, TD SUNY-Fredonia Daniel Hoffman wrote: > Sounds very interesting...I'd like to see 'em too, if you get a chance to > put 'em together. 8) > Thanks,[snipped] ------------------------------ Message-ID: <40A37392.8010000 [at] fredonia.edu> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 09:09:38 -0400 From: "Stephen E. Rees" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 Subject: Re: Cincinnatti Playhouse In The Park/LBLR References: As are we all!! Steve Bsapsis [at] aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 5/12/04 5:13:28 PM, Rees [at] fredonia.edu writes: > > << What a scruffy bunch!! :) >> > > yup. And proud of it. > > Bill ------------------------------ Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.2.20040513065313.024231b0 [at] mail.sdsu.edu> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 06:56:44 -0700 From: Loren Schreiber Subject: Re: Sent a message and didn't see it. Wassup? In-Reply-To: I'm just checking to see if I am getting my messages through on this list. It's very nice to have it back. I haven't seen the Long Beach Long Riders picture in the PLASMA rag, but I'll bet it's the one that features my 24 year old Yamaha front and center. Loren Schreiber Director of Technology and Production School of Theatre, Television and Film San Diego State University ------------------------------ Message-ID: <147CF8DFB9C5D41187300001FA7EE39011EDC4EC [at] mail.nwmissouri.edu> From: "Immel,Patrick" Subject: Re: Wal*Mart (Well off topic) Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 09:02:18 -0500 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) 1. What is a "bo**cks"? 2. I kinda like the banter, 'specially in the summer! Pat Immel Northwest Missouri State University Yankee -----Original Message----- From: Dorian Kelly To: Stagecraft Sent: 5/13/2004 2:57 AM Subject: Re: Wal*Mart (Well off topic) For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ --------------------------------------------------- One of the great problems with the Stagecraft list was the sheer volume of off topic bo**cks. The ABTT site was particularly prone to this, to the point where all the pros left in in droves., thats why its now much more controlled. Can we please stick to stage or theatre topics, and give your opinions on other matters to someone else? Dorian Kelly Illuminati Creative Technology Colchester UK Salon [at] illuminatarts.demon.co.uk. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <659CC0547BC6D3118B9200508BC270EA035BB597 [at] ncsamail.ncarts.edu> From: "Booth, Dennis" Subject: Re: AutoCad 3D plotting Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 10:07:29 -0400 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Nicely stated, Fred. Thanks! DGB -----Original Message----- From: Fred Schoening, Jr. [mailto:bigfred [at] mindspring.com] Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2004 8:53 AM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: AutoCad 3D plotting For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ --------------------------------------------------- It's true, you're missing something. Type in the "MVIEW" command. Take a close look at the options presented to you: one of them is "Hideplot." Select that (type "H", enter,) select "ON," and then it will prompt you to select which objects you want to do this to. Select which viewports you want to hide the lines in, and hit enter. You can also just double-click the viewport in question, which brings up the object properties window. There, you can just look for the "Hide plot" option and select "ON." HTH, Fred "Big Fred" Schoening Technical Director Dallas Theater Center Dallas, Texas, USA -----Original Message----- I might be missing something with Patrick's suggestion, but the only thing I could get the MVIEW command to do was produce new Viewports. Maybe it's something with a newer version, as I am working in 2002 also. I do a modification of what Scott suggested. I set up my view, render to a file, and then load that image back into AutoCAD using Insert Raster. I'm going to keep working with MVIEW to see if I'm missing something and check with a newer version. Randy ---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content and is believed to be clean. ---------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Message-ID: <20040513142133.58354.qmail [at] web50606.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 07:21:33 -0700 (PDT) From: b Ricie Subject: Re: Wal*Mart (Well off topic) In-Reply-To: As people who often need to purchase alto of whatever I don't think this is that off topic. Often times it was easier to get wares donated from a small mom and pop store for a program note in exchange. If our voice is too quiet then we should vote with our feet and be sure to let the proprietor know why. ===== Brian Rice b_ricie [at] yahoo.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Movies - Buy advance tickets for 'Shrek 2' http://movies.yahoo.com/showtimes/movie?mid=1808405861 ------------------------------ From: "MARK OBRIEN" Subject: Re: Stagehand killed in fall Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 07:23:27 -0700 Message-ID: Uhh Darwin? Mark O'Brien > >The following excerpts are from the May 12 web issue of Lighting >Demensions ED-wire. While I hesitate to speak ill of the dead, it >seems as though the victim & the venue might have had some >culpulbility in the event. > >"... Walter "Wally" Thomas, a 20 year veteran of the concert lighting >industry, apparently fell to his death after not attaching his safety >harness into the guide wire. ....." > >There seems to be a problem with the venue's working conditions or >accepted procedure as the next paragraph states: > >"Two other spotlight operators were also working the concert and were >wearing the OSHA-approved full-body harness required for such >occations, but they were not using the accompanying tether as it was >too dark." > >The article went on to point out: > >"Thomas previously had another fall that kept him off the job for 6 >months in 1989 and paid him over $400,000 in workman's comp." > > >Michael > >Michael Powers, Technical Director >UMass Theatre Department >112 FAC West >151 Presidents Drive, Ofc.2 >Amherst, Ma. 01003-9331 > >413-545-6821 voice >413-577-0025 fax > >mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu _________________________________________________________________ Best Restaurant Giveaway Ever! Vote for your favorites for a chance to win $1 million! http://local.msn.com/special/giveaway.asp ------------------------------ From: "Clare Adams" Subject: Re: Sent a message and didn't see it. Wassup? Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 08:37:41 -0600 Message-ID: X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: > -----Original Message----- > It's very nice to have it back. Amen! > > I haven't seen the Long Beach Long Riders picture in the PLASMA rag, but > I'll bet it's the one that features my 24 year old Yamaha front > and center. > That would be the one, Loren! ------------------------------ Message-ID: <20040513143817.37517.qmail [at] web50502.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 07:38:17 -0700 (PDT) From: James Kosmatka Subject: Re: "Well off topic"? In-Reply-To: > 1. What is a "bo**cks"? b**cks : The English :: b.s. : Americans Am I correct? (But wouldn't it be b****cks? > 2. I kinda like the banter, 'specially in the > summer! I think a good analogy for the e-mail list would be to a production meeting: there are those that want to come in, take care of business, and leave. And there are those who like to chat for the first five minutes of the meeting, gossip, go off on tangents, and generally mix the socializing with the business. That's not to say that either of those are wrong, but I think that each way of conducting the Stagecraft Discussion is more suited to one of the two suggested forums, e-mail list or bulletin board system. If you look at the Theatre Sound mailing list, you'll very rarely see a thread that doesn't have at least a tenuous connection to both subjects, theatre and audio. Every so often there's an "OT: Home audio question" or a thread of general interest to anyone in theatre. But regardless, the e-mail list is perfect for that use; you know what to expect from it. I kind of resent, though, my mail box being filled with economic/political diatribes. In the case of this list, maybe a bulletin board system might be more appropriate. I don't want to tell anyone that the way business is conducted here is bad, I'm just suggesting that we make the medium appropriate to the message. Take care all, -james kosmatka ------------------------------ Message-ID: <1084459723.40a38acb445ca [at] webmail.plattsburgh.edu> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 10:48:43 -0400 From: kim.hartshorn [at] plattsburgh.edu Subject: respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall References: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 This quoted remark is in incredibly poor taste and indicates a lack of understanding on the various conditions that could have affected this tragic situation. My technical director and I have already speculated on dozens of situations we have witnessed personally that could have contributed to this accident...none of them excusable...all of them perfectly plausible starting with someone forgetting to drop pull-lines for the hooks before they flew the truss. The newspaper article in the Miami Hearald titled 'Harness is Focus in Fatal Fall' is extremely illuminating especially the remark by the local OSHA inspector stating that he had never seen this type of ladder before. It was apparently a standard issue steel rope ladder most of us have used many many times. Does OSHA really know anything at all about our industry? or does it seem to anyone else that we are constantly trying to adapt our practices to OSHA guidelines created for different industries. What about our equipment suppliers? Does Genie have to work with OSHA guidelines for man-lifts that assume that the primary use is going to be replacing lightbulbs in airport terminals? Would specific 'theatre industry' guidelines result in a different solution to man-lifts that was both safe and convenenient? I wonder, and I feel for the friends and family of Wally Thomas. In Solidarity Kim Hartshorn IA local 749 > For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending > your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: > http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ > --------------------------------------------------- > > > Uhh Darwin? > > ------------------------------ Message-ID: <1084460620.40a38e4cde6fb [at] webmail.tau.ac.il> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 18:03:40 +0300 From: kupfer [at] post.tau.ac.il Subject: numbering messages? User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.3 I see that in the new list heading (digest form) the messages are numbere= d, but as I scroll through them the numbers don't appear with the actual messag= es. So if I want to hurry down to message no. 26 I can't do that without countin= g the 25 before that. Any way of going back to the way it used to be, with the message number appearing in the message heading itself? Judy ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. ------------------------------ From: "MARK OBRIEN" Subject: Re: respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 08:05:06 -0700 Message-ID: Agreed, I admit my comment was in poor taste, and for that I am sorry. However, it alwalys seems that on many calls there are but a few Gonzo Stagehands. People who because of their work habits, intimidate the younger, less experienced hands into ignoring safe practice, or create an atmosphere that does not allow them to question safety practices without ridicule. If indeed, all of the equipment was available for this stagehands use, and he chose not to use it, then I feel sorry for his family. We must take responsibility for ourselves. I spoke without knowing the facts, and I should not have. Mark O'Brien _________________________________________________________________ Best Restaurant Giveaway Ever! Vote for your favorites for a chance to win $1 million! http://local.msn.com/special/giveaway.asp ------------------------------ Message-ID: <1084461043.40a38ff377a34 [at] webmail.plattsburgh.edu> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 11:10:43 -0400 From: kim.hartshorn [at] plattsburgh.edu Subject: Miami Hearald Article regarding Thomas accident References: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 the article is pasted below...it is pretty long Kim Hartshorn Posted on Sat, May. 08, 2004 MIAMI Harness is focus in fatal fall The veteran stagehand who fell to his death at the David Bowie concert was wearing a safety harness but had not hooked it to a safety line, officials said. BY DAVID KIDWELL, EVELYN MCDONNELL AND KEVIN DEUTSCH dkidwell [at] herald.com A Pembroke Pines stagehand who fell to his death Thursday within sight of David Bowie fans rarely worked at heights since suffering a near-fatal fall at the 1989 Super Bowl, friends said Friday. Investigators also said Friday that the fatal plunge onto the stage at the James L. Knight Center in downtown Miami was probably caused by Walter ''Wally'' Thomas' failing to clip on a ''fall arrest'' safety harness he was wearing. Some friends and fellow stagehands said they aren't willing to concede that the fall was entirely Thomas' fault. ''First, I was stunned he was on a truss spot to begin with; he didn't usually go high anymore,'' said Frank Townsend, who said he has worked with Thomas since 1978. ``And second, I'm very upset he was allowed to get on that ladder without his fall arrest. ''Ultimately, it was the lighting company's responsibility to make sure all the local roadies follow the rules,'' Townsend said. ``They are supposed to stand at the bottom of that ladder and not let anyone get on it without the proper gear.'' A spokesman for the lighting company on the Bowie Tour -- Light & Sound Design Fourth Phase -- said Friday that his company is investigating whether it had any involvement in the accident. ''Right now, I don't even know if it was our equipment he was using,'' said Bob Manners, the California company's senior vice president of business affairs. ``I can tell you we are investigating it.'' The federal Occupational Safety and Health Administration also is investigating to see whether safety rules were violated. Thomas -- described by friends as a 25-year stage veteran, professional and safety conscious -- fell to his death about 8:25 p.m. Thursday amid the usual flurry of activity between the warm-up act and the main event. The fall occurred at the rear of the stage and was witnessed by some concertgoers. Other stagehands immediately lowered a concert banner to obscure the scene while others rushed to his side. Thomas was dead at the scene. The Miami-Dade medical examiner's office said Friday that the cause of death was ''blunt trauma'' and all but ruled out speculation that Thomas may have died from a heart attack before the fall. Larry Cameron, operations director at the medical examiner's office, said doctors were awaiting lab and blood results. Thursday was the second time Thomas suffered severe head injuries in a work- related fall. On Jan. 22, 1989, Thomas was part of a crew working on a Bangles concert in the parking lot at Joe Robbie Stadium during the Super Bowl when a hand-operated hydraulic lift malfunctioned and sent him plunging 30 feet, police reports say. ''A gust of wind started blowing causing the lift to topple over,'' a Dade County police report stated. ``The victim fell and hit his head on the asphalt.'' Thomas missed months of work and received workman's compensation benefits totaling $408,244. ''He still has all the scars on his neck from all the tubes and stuff,'' said fellow stagehand and friend Armando Coronel. ``He didn't like to work up high very much after that. ''I don't know what he was doing up there [Thursday],'' Coronel said. ``But what happened to Wally happens once every 50 years. It's nobody's fault. Sometimes this stuff just happens.'' Tom Coll, the local boss of the International Alliance of Theater & Stage Employees, said Thomas was among about 75 local union members working at the Bowie concert. ''I don't know why he wasn't attached,'' Coll said. ``I was standing there when one of the guys on the road crew helped them get into their harnesses. I heard the guy talk to them about how they were supposed to use it. And I heard him tell all the guys to make sure to clip off. ''This was a tragedy,'' Coll said. ``Wally was more than well-liked around here, and we want to know as much as anyone what happened. There's no way he could have fallen if he was using that fall arrest.'' According to Miami homicide Detective Ed Avila, Thomas and two others working on the spotlights were each wearing devices called a ''full body harness'' -- an OSHA-approved device specifically designed to prevent such falls. The harness is supposed to clip to a safety line that dangles from the truss above. As the stagehand climbs the ladder, a pulley system loosely takes up the slack in the tether. ''It's supposed to act sort of like a seat belt,'' Avila said. ``When a sudden jerk of a fall hits the tether, it engages and stops the fall.'' Avila said the two other workers wearing the harnesses reported that they were not using the tether because the stage was too dark and they couldn't find it. Coll, who was there, disagreed. He said Thomas, a union member for nine years, had enough experience to know how to clip on the tether and climb that ladder even if he were blindfolded. ''Plus, it was intermission,'' Coll said. ``The lights were up and it wasn't that dark.'' OSHA'S INQUIRY Luis Santiago, regional director of OSHA, said investigators from his office could take as long as two months to determine whether any safety rules were violated but that the ultimate responsibility rests with the company that hired him. A review of OSHA records shows that workplace falls account for about 13 percent of all work-related deaths. In 2002, 714 of 5,524 work deaths resulted from falls. Of that, 126 were falls from ladders. Santiago also said his office has questions about the ladder used at the concert. ''Frankly, I've never heard of this type of ladder before,'' he said. ``Within our standards there is no ladder of this kind envisioned. I think that's something we really need to look at.'' Santiago referred to a somewhat flexible and collapsible ladder constructed from heavy steel cable and rungs made of steel rods. The ladder is designed to be rolled up. It is portable and easily retractable during theatrical events. Santiago said it is unclear whether the movement of the ladder could have contributed to the fall. Stagehands interviewed said the ladder is standard issue at concert events. Friends said Thomas was obsessive about safety, always carrying safety equipment. ''He was always on the safe side, and he always carried around everything he needed. I can't imagine how this happened,'' said Don DeRosa, 45, who described himself as Thomas' best friend. ''He loved life and lived it large,'' DeRosa said of his single friend, with whom he graduated from McArthur High School in 1977. ``You just can't believe it until you actually see him laying there in a coffin. He'll never die as long as the people who knew him keep him close in their hearts.'' LOVED THE JOB DeRosa said Thomas loved his line of work. Even after his near-fatal Super Bowl fall and generous compensation, he refused to stop working. ''He had a brush with death once. He already beat death that time. He cheated it. He cracked his head like an egg,'' the friend said. ``You think that would have been enough to deter him from going back to the job. ''He said, `I'll never have to worry about finances again,'' DeRosa said of Thomas' financial settlements after the 1989 accident. ``He was set for life. ``What kept him in the business was the excitement of being behind the scenes at the concerts. He loved being in the middle of the action.'' Herald staff writer Karl Ross, database editor Tim Henderson and researcher Elisabeth Donovan contributed to this report. ------------------------------ From: ken [at] kenholyoak.com (Ken Holyoak) Subject: Re: numbering messages? Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 10:17:44 -0500 Message-ID: <00c701c438fd$714d01d0$0200a8c0 [at] COMPAQ> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: Amen - Judy - I asked for that when I joined years ago Kenneth. H. Holyoak Information + Insight =3D Profit POB 68633 Indianapolis, IN 46268-0633 =20 ken [at] kenholyoak.com 317-253-7000 -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of kupfer [at] post.tau.ac.il Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2004 10:04 AM To: Stagecraft Subject: numbering messages? For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ --------------------------------------------------- I see that in the new list heading (digest form) the messages are = numbered, but as I scroll through them the numbers don't appear with the actual = messages. So if I want to hurry down to message no. 26 I can't do that without = counting the 25 before that. Any way of going back to the way it used to be, with the message number appearing in the message heading itself? Judy ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. ------------------------------ From: ken [at] kenholyoak.com (Ken Holyoak) Subject: Re: Miami Herald Article regarding Thomas accident Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 10:22:09 -0500 Message-ID: <00c801c438fe$0f2db980$0200a8c0 [at] COMPAQ> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: How quickly everyone is scurrying behind lawyers and placing the blame = on someone else. It's sad, when we should all be praying for Wally's family, the = discussion is about placing the blame on someone else.=20 =20 Kenneth. H. Holyoak Information + Insight =3D Profit POB 68633 Indianapolis, IN 46268-0633 =20 ken [at] kenholyoak.com 317-253-7000 -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of kim.hartshorn [at] plattsburgh.edu Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2004 10:11 AM To: Stagecraft Subject: Miami Hearald Article regarding Thomas accident For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ --------------------------------------------------- the article is pasted below...it is pretty long Kim Hartshorn Posted on Sat, May. 08, 2004=20 MIAMI =20 Harness is focus in fatal fall =20 The veteran stagehand who fell to his death at the David Bowie concert = was=20 wearing a safety harness but had not hooked it to a safety line, = officials said. =20 BY DAVID KIDWELL, EVELYN MCDONNELL AND KEVIN DEUTSCH =20 dkidwell [at] herald.com =20 A Pembroke Pines stagehand who fell to his death Thursday within sight = of David=20 Bowie fans rarely worked at heights since suffering a near-fatal fall at = the 1989 Super Bowl, friends said Friday. Investigators also said Friday that the fatal plunge onto the stage at = the=20 James L. Knight Center in downtown Miami was probably caused by=20 Walter ''Wally'' Thomas' failing to clip on a ''fall arrest'' safety = harness he=20 was wearing. Some friends and fellow stagehands said they aren't willing to concede = that the=20 fall was entirely Thomas' fault. ''First, I was stunned he was on a truss spot to begin with; he didn't usually=20 go high anymore,'' said Frank Townsend, who said he has worked with = Thomas=20 since 1978. ``And second, I'm very upset he was allowed to get on that ladder=20 without his fall arrest. ''Ultimately, it was the lighting company's responsibility to make sure = all the=20 local roadies follow the rules,'' Townsend said. ``They are supposed to stand=20 at the bottom of that ladder and not let anyone get on it without the = proper gear.'' A spokesman for the lighting company on the Bowie Tour -- Light & Sound Design=20 Fourth Phase -- said Friday that his company is investigating whether it = had any involvement in the accident. ''Right now, I don't even know if it was our equipment he was using,'' = said Bob=20 Manners, the California company's senior vice president of business = affairs. ``I can tell you we are investigating it.'' The federal Occupational Safety and Health Administration also is investigating=20 to see whether safety rules were violated. Thomas -- described by friends as a 25-year stage veteran, professional = and=20 safety conscious -- fell to his death about 8:25 p.m. Thursday amid the usual=20 flurry of activity between the warm-up act and the main event. The fall occurred at the rear of the stage and was witnessed by some=20 concertgoers. Other stagehands immediately lowered a concert banner to obscure=20 the scene while others rushed to his side. Thomas was dead at the scene. The Miami-Dade medical examiner's office = said=20 Friday that the cause of death was ''blunt trauma'' and all but ruled = out=20 speculation that Thomas may have died from a heart attack before the = fall. Larry Cameron, operations director at the medical examiner's office, = said=20 doctors were awaiting lab and blood results. Thursday was the second time Thomas suffered severe head injuries in a = work- related fall. On Jan. 22, 1989, Thomas was part of a crew working on a Bangles concert = in the=20 parking lot at Joe Robbie Stadium during the Super Bowl when a = hand-operated hydraulic lift malfunctioned and sent him plunging 30 feet, police = reports say. ''A gust of wind started blowing causing the lift to topple over,'' a = Dade=20 County police report stated. ``The victim fell and hit his head on the=20 asphalt.'' Thomas missed months of work and received workman's compensation = benefits=20 totaling $408,244. ''He still has all the scars on his neck from all the tubes and stuff,'' said=20 fellow stagehand and friend Armando Coronel. ``He didn't like to work up high=20 very much after that. ''I don't know what he was doing up there [Thursday],'' Coronel said. = ``But=20 what happened to Wally happens once every 50 years. It's nobody's fault. = Sometimes this stuff just happens.'' Tom Coll, the local boss of the International Alliance of Theater & = Stage=20 Employees, said Thomas was among about 75 local union members working at = the Bowie concert. ''I don't know why he wasn't attached,'' Coll said. ``I was standing = there when=20 one of the guys on the road crew helped them get into their harnesses. I heard=20 the guy talk to them about how they were supposed to use it. And I heard = him tell all the guys to make sure to clip off. ''This was a tragedy,'' Coll said. ``Wally was more than well-liked = around=20 here, and we want to know as much as anyone what happened. There's no = way he could have fallen if he was using that fall arrest.'' According to Miami homicide Detective Ed Avila, Thomas and two others working=20 on the spotlights were each wearing devices called a ''full body = harness'' --=20 an OSHA-approved device specifically designed to prevent such falls. The harness is supposed to clip to a safety line that dangles from the = truss above. As the stagehand climbs the ladder, a pulley system loosely takes = up the=20 slack in the tether. ''It's supposed to act sort of like a seat belt,'' Avila said. ``When a sudden=20 jerk of a fall hits the tether, it engages and stops the fall.'' Avila said the two other workers wearing the harnesses reported that = they were=20 not using the tether because the stage was too dark and they couldn't = find it. Coll, who was there, disagreed. He said Thomas, a union member for nine years,=20 had enough experience to know how to clip on the tether and climb that ladder=20 even if he were blindfolded. ''Plus, it was intermission,'' Coll said. ``The lights were up and it = wasn't that dark.'' OSHA'S INQUIRY Luis Santiago, regional director of OSHA, said investigators from his = office could take as long as two months to determine whether any safety rules = were=20 violated but that the ultimate responsibility rests with the company = that hired=20 him. A review of OSHA records shows that workplace falls account for about 13 = percent of all work-related deaths. In 2002, 714 of 5,524 work deaths resulted=20 from falls. Of that, 126 were falls from ladders. Santiago also said his office has questions about the ladder used at the = concert. ''Frankly, I've never heard of this type of ladder before,'' he said. ``Within=20 our standards there is no ladder of this kind envisioned. I think that's = something we really need to look at.'' Santiago referred to a somewhat flexible and collapsible ladder = constructed=20 from heavy steel cable and rungs made of steel rods. The ladder is = designed to=20 be rolled up. It is portable and easily retractable during theatrical events. Santiago said it is unclear whether the movement of the ladder could = have=20 contributed to the fall. Stagehands interviewed said the ladder is standard issue at concert = events. Friends said Thomas was obsessive about safety, always carrying safety=20 equipment. ''He was always on the safe side, and he always carried around = everything he needed. I can't imagine how this happened,'' said Don DeRosa, 45, who described=20 himself as Thomas' best friend. ''He loved life and lived it large,'' DeRosa said of his single friend, = with whom he graduated from McArthur High School in 1977. ``You just can't believe=20 it until you actually see him laying there in a coffin. He'll never die = as long=20 as the people who knew him keep him close in their hearts.'' LOVED THE JOB DeRosa said Thomas loved his line of work. Even after his near-fatal = Super Bowl=20 fall and generous compensation, he refused to stop working. ''He had a brush with death once. He already beat death that time. He cheated=20 it. He cracked his head like an egg,'' the friend said. ``You think that would=20 have been enough to deter him from going back to the job. ''He said, `I'll never have to worry about finances again,'' DeRosa said = of=20 Thomas' financial settlements after the 1989 accident. ``He was set for life. ``What kept him in the business was the excitement of being behind the scenes=20 at the concerts. He loved being in the middle of the action.'' Herald staff writer Karl Ross, database editor Tim Henderson and = researcher=20 Elisabeth Donovan contributed to this report. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <40A39791.5040605 [at] hillinteractive.net> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 11:43:13 -0400 From: Howard Ires User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 Subject: Re: respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall References: In-Reply-To: i don't know the facts either, but according to the news article that was just posted the brother who fell was VERY safety oriented after having taken a bad fall 10 years ago. I wonder if he was depending on safety equipment that failed him somehow? I wonder if we will ever know. may he rest in peace... -----------------howie ------------------------------ User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.0.6 Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 11:45:53 -0400 Subject: Re: Jamming inside Theatres From: Bruce Purdy Message-ID: In-Reply-To: >> I'm no technophobe, but I hate it when yesterday's >> convenience becomes today's necessity. > The convenience of accurate, > pre-recorded lighting cues that was afforded us with the advent of > computerized LX boards is a necessity now; can you imagine trying to go back > to doing shows with today's requirements on a 2-scene preset? Um, Yeah! That's what I do all the time. Sure I'm pressing for a new computerised board, and there's much more can be done with one, but we mustn't lose the ability to survive without the "Latest technology". OK, you did use the qualifier "shows with today's requirements". The show doesn't have these requirements, the design does, and the design can / must be adapted to the available technology. To illustrate what I mean by reliance on "Today's technology", I had a friend on tour a few years back that went into a grocery store to pick up a local paper. The only clerk at the register was a young kid and was completely lost as to how to ring up the newspaper because it didn't have a UPC barcode on it. Not wanting to bother the manager who was talking to someone at the time, the clerk said "Just take it" and didn't charge for the paper. People are taught to scan merchandise, but not the basics of pushing buttons the "Old fashioned way" More than once, I've stopped by a fast food joint and given the cashier a five dollar bill along with a nickel and a penny for a tab of $4.31 and the cashier was totally lost as to how much change to give unless he could punch the "Amount tendered" into the computerised register and let the computer tell him how much change to give. He should have been able to do this in his head, but basic math skills and money handling skills are being lost due to reliance on computers. Back to my original point, if you think you can't live without your cell phone - that it's a necessity for your survival, it's time to re-evaluate your life. It can certainly be a convenience, but don't let it become more than that. Please forgive the ramblings of this madman. : ) Bruce -- Bruce Purdy Technical Director Smith Opera House ------------------------------ Message-ID: <113601c43901$a25b00c0$0a01a8c0 [at] Tony> From: "Tony Deeming" References: Subject: Re: Miami Hearald Article regarding Thomas accident Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 16:47:45 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 Interesting comment I read was that he reason he was there was he was a Bowie fan and couldn't get tickets, so he volunteered for the spot job to see the show. I've no idea how true that is, but it does sound extremely plausible, and something I know is done all over. Nothing at all wrong with it, as long as the rules is followed..... ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Stagecraft" Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2004 4:10 PM Subject: Miami Hearald Article regarding Thomas accident > For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending > your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: > http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ > --------------------------------------------------- > > > the article is pasted below...it is pretty long > > Kim Hartshorn > > Posted on Sat, May. 08, 2004 > MIAMI > > Harness is focus in fatal fall > > The veteran stagehand who fell to his death at the David Bowie concert was > wearing a safety harness but had not hooked it to a safety line, officials said. > > BY DAVID KIDWELL, EVELYN MCDONNELL AND KEVIN DEUTSCH > > dkidwell [at] herald.com > > A Pembroke Pines stagehand who fell to his death Thursday within sight of David > Bowie fans rarely worked at heights since suffering a near-fatal fall at the > 1989 Super Bowl, friends said Friday. > Investigators also said Friday that the fatal plunge onto the stage at the > James L. Knight Center in downtown Miami was probably caused by > Walter ''Wally'' Thomas' failing to clip on a ''fall arrest'' safety harness he > was wearing. > Some friends and fellow stagehands said they aren't willing to concede that the > fall was entirely Thomas' fault. > ''First, I was stunned he was on a truss spot to begin with; he didn't usually > go high anymore,'' said Frank Townsend, who said he has worked with Thomas > since 1978. ``And second, I'm very upset he was allowed to get on that ladder > without his fall arrest. > ''Ultimately, it was the lighting company's responsibility to make sure all the > local roadies follow the rules,'' Townsend said. ``They are supposed to stand > at the bottom of that ladder and not let anyone get on it without the proper > gear.'' > A spokesman for the lighting company on the Bowie Tour -- Light & Sound Design > Fourth Phase -- said Friday that his company is investigating whether it had > any involvement in the accident. > ''Right now, I don't even know if it was our equipment he was using,'' said Bob > Manners, the California company's senior vice president of business affairs. > ``I can tell you we are investigating it.'' > The federal Occupational Safety and Health Administration also is investigating > to see whether safety rules were violated. > Thomas -- described by friends as a 25-year stage veteran, professional and > safety conscious -- fell to his death about 8:25 p.m. Thursday amid the usual > flurry of activity between the warm-up act and the main event. > The fall occurred at the rear of the stage and was witnessed by some > concertgoers. Other stagehands immediately lowered a concert banner to obscure > the scene while others rushed to his side. > Thomas was dead at the scene. The Miami-Dade medical examiner's office said > Friday that the cause of death was ''blunt trauma'' and all but ruled out > speculation that Thomas may have died from a heart attack before the fall. > Larry Cameron, operations director at the medical examiner's office, said > doctors were awaiting lab and blood results. > Thursday was the second time Thomas suffered severe head injuries in a work- > related fall. > On Jan. 22, 1989, Thomas was part of a crew working on a Bangles concert in the > parking lot at Joe Robbie Stadium during the Super Bowl when a hand-operated > hydraulic lift malfunctioned and sent him plunging 30 feet, police reports say. > ''A gust of wind started blowing causing the lift to topple over,'' a Dade > County police report stated. ``The victim fell and hit his head on the > asphalt.'' > Thomas missed months of work and received workman's compensation benefits > totaling $408,244. > ''He still has all the scars on his neck from all the tubes and stuff,'' said > fellow stagehand and friend Armando Coronel. ``He didn't like to work up high > very much after that. > ''I don't know what he was doing up there [Thursday],'' Coronel said. ``But > what happened to Wally happens once every 50 years. It's nobody's fault. > Sometimes this stuff just happens.'' > Tom Coll, the local boss of the International Alliance of Theater & Stage > Employees, said Thomas was among about 75 local union members working at the > Bowie concert. > ''I don't know why he wasn't attached,'' Coll said. ``I was standing there when > one of the guys on the road crew helped them get into their harnesses. I heard > the guy talk to them about how they were supposed to use it. And I heard him > tell all the guys to make sure to clip off. > ''This was a tragedy,'' Coll said. ``Wally was more than well-liked around > here, and we want to know as much as anyone what happened. There's no way he > could have fallen if he was using that fall arrest.'' > According to Miami homicide Detective Ed Avila, Thomas and two others working > on the spotlights were each wearing devices called a ''full body harness'' -- > an OSHA-approved device specifically designed to prevent such falls. > The harness is supposed to clip to a safety line that dangles from the truss > above. As the stagehand climbs the ladder, a pulley system loosely takes up the > slack in the tether. > ''It's supposed to act sort of like a seat belt,'' Avila said. ``When a sudden > jerk of a fall hits the tether, it engages and stops the fall.'' > Avila said the two other workers wearing the harnesses reported that they were > not using the tether because the stage was too dark and they couldn't find it. > Coll, who was there, disagreed. He said Thomas, a union member for nine years, > had enough experience to know how to clip on the tether and climb that ladder > even if he were blindfolded. > ''Plus, it was intermission,'' Coll said. ``The lights were up and it wasn't > that dark.'' > OSHA'S INQUIRY > Luis Santiago, regional director of OSHA, said investigators from his office > could take as long as two months to determine whether any safety rules were > violated but that the ultimate responsibility rests with the company that hired > him. > A review of OSHA records shows that workplace falls account for about 13 > percent of all work-related deaths. In 2002, 714 of 5,524 work deaths resulted > from falls. Of that, 126 were falls from ladders. > Santiago also said his office has questions about the ladder used at the > concert. > ''Frankly, I've never heard of this type of ladder before,'' he said. ``Within > our standards there is no ladder of this kind envisioned. I think that's > something we really need to look at.'' > Santiago referred to a somewhat flexible and collapsible ladder constructed > from heavy steel cable and rungs made of steel rods. The ladder is designed to > be rolled up. It is portable and easily retractable during theatrical events. > Santiago said it is unclear whether the movement of the ladder could have > contributed to the fall. > Stagehands interviewed said the ladder is standard issue at concert events. > Friends said Thomas was obsessive about safety, always carrying safety > equipment. > ''He was always on the safe side, and he always carried around everything he > needed. I can't imagine how this happened,'' said Don DeRosa, 45, who described > himself as Thomas' best friend. > ''He loved life and lived it large,'' DeRosa said of his single friend, with > whom he graduated from McArthur High School in 1977. ``You just can't believe > it until you actually see him laying there in a coffin. He'll never die as long > as the people who knew him keep him close in their hearts.'' > LOVED THE JOB > DeRosa said Thomas loved his line of work. Even after his near-fatal Super Bowl > fall and generous compensation, he refused to stop working. > ''He had a brush with death once. He already beat death that time. He cheated > it. He cracked his head like an egg,'' the friend said. ``You think that would > have been enough to deter him from going back to the job. > ''He said, `I'll never have to worry about finances again,'' DeRosa said of > Thomas' financial settlements after the 1989 accident. ``He was set for life. > ``What kept him in the business was the excitement of being behind the scenes > at the concerts. He loved being in the middle of the action.'' > Herald staff writer Karl Ross, database editor Tim Henderson and researcher > Elisabeth Donovan contributed to this report. > > ------------------------------ From: Bsapsis [at] aol.com Message-ID: <138.2ef56b7b.2dd4f535 [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 11:58:45 EDT Subject: Re: Sent a message and didn't see it. Wassup? X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Mac sub 7 In a message dated 5/13/04 9:54:59 AM, lschreib [at] mail.sdsu.edu writes: << I haven't seen the Long Beach Long Riders picture in the PLASMA rag, but I'll bet it's the one that features my 24 year old Yamaha front and center. >> Yeah and the two 50 something guys standing behind it! Bill S. ------------------------------ From: Bsapsis [at] aol.com Message-ID: <162.2f7c5d96.2dd4f8bc [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 12:13:48 EDT Subject: Re: respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Mac sub 7 In a message dated 5/13/04 10:52:06 AM, kim.hartshorn [at] plattsburgh.edu writes: << This quoted remark is in incredibly poor taste and indicates a lack of understanding on the various conditions that could have affected this tragic situation. My technical director and I have already speculated on dozens of situations we have witnessed personally that could have contributed to this accident...none of them excusable...all of them perfectly plausible starting with someone forgetting to drop pull-lines for the hooks before they flew the truss. The newspaper article in the Miami Hearald titled 'Harness is Focus in Fatal Fall' is extremely illuminating especially the remark by the local OSHA inspector stating that he had never seen this type of ladder before. It was apparently a standard issue steel rope ladder most of us have used many many times. Does OSHA really know anything at all about our industry? or does it seem to anyone else that we are constantly trying to adapt our practices to OSHA guidelines created for different industries. What about our equipment suppliers? Does Genie have to work with OSHA guidelines for man-lifts that assume that the primary use is going to be replacing lightbulbs in airport terminals? Would specific 'theatre industry' guidelines result in a different solution to man-lifts that was both safe and convenenient? >> The OSHA regulations for Fall Arrest are clear, concise and practical. It is one of the very few times we're a federal agency actually accomplished what it set out to do. Fall Arrest equipment, when used in accordance with the regulations, will prevent death or serious injury in the event of a fall. ESTA is, and has been, in the business of writing standards for over five years now. The wire rope standard E1.1-1991 has been available for over 5 years now. It was the first one we wrote. If you feel that a standard is needed in any particular area of our business, you can approach ESTA for assistance in getting one written. I do not know what happened exactly in Miami and I know better than to take the newspaper reports as gospel. I also don't think speculation, especially when a fatality is involved, is appropriate. Bill S. Sapsis Rigging, Inc. www.sapsis-rigging.com 800.727.7471 800.292.3851 fax We stand behind, and under, our work. Check out the Long Beach Long Riders cross country fund raiser for BC/EFA at http://sapsis-rigging.com/LBLR.html ------------------------------ Message-ID: <40A3A723.6030706 [at] fredonia.edu> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 12:49:39 -0400 From: "Stephen E. Rees" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 Subject: Re: Sent a message and didn't see it. Wassup? References: Loren, It is indeed. Steve Loren Schreiber wrote: > I'll bet it's the one that features my 24 year old Yamaha front and center. [snipped] ------------------------------ Message-ID: <1084472393.40a3bc4972c0f [at] webmail.plattsburgh.edu> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 14:19:53 -0400 From: kim.hartshorn [at] plattsburgh.edu Subject: Re: respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall References: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 Bill could you explain ESTA? does it set voluntary standards for equipment manufacturers, does it set standards for safe practice in the entertainment industry. I have often seen it referred to but realized as I was reading your post that in fact I have no clear idea of exactly what it is...other than it sounds like it is a good thing. In terms of OSHA, although it was a few years back, when I contacted OSHA to get further information on the 6' rule the officer I talked to had great difficulty determining where our industry fit. The best he could do was that since it didn't fit any specific definition it was considered 'general construction' although this classification worked for me at the time in regards to our function as a college theatre it doesnt seem like it would be an adequate description of what happens at a typical stop on a concert tour. It seems to me for instance that if OSHA were to watch a typical put in they would wonder where the hard hats were yet as far as I know...the use of hard hats by stage workers is a rare practice...and yet we all have stories about dropped shackles and pins. Safety conciousness has changed radically in just a few years really, 12 years ago I saw many an outdoor stage go 6 bays tall with half the crew without any harness at all and the rest in sit harnesses...and they were the sissies! Today, such a sight would sicken the average stagehand in my aquaintance. As an industry I have been quite surprised at our willingness to adopt safe practice. But it is my impression that this has happened largely in spite of OSHA and not because of it. I would be interested in your opinion Bill Kim Hartshorn Quoting Bsapsis [at] aol.com: > > The OSHA regulations for Fall Arrest are clear, concise and practical. It is > > one of the very few times we're a federal agency actually accomplished what > it set out to do. Fall Arrest equipment, when used in accordance with the > regulations, will prevent death or serious injury in the event of a fall. > > ESTA is, and has been, in the business of writing standards for over five > years now. The wire rope standard E1.1-1991 has been available for over 5 > years > now. It was the first one we wrote. If you feel that a standard is needed > in any particular area of our business, you can approach ESTA for assistance > in > getting one written. > > I do not know what happened exactly in Miami and I know better than to take > the newspaper reports as gospel. I also don't think speculation, especially > > when a fatality is involved, is appropriate. > > Bill S. > > Sapsis Rigging, Inc. > www.sapsis-rigging.com > 800.727.7471 > 800.292.3851 fax > We stand behind, and under, our work. > > Check out the Long Beach Long Riders cross country fund raiser for BC/EFA at > > http://sapsis-rigging.com/LBLR.html > ------------------------------ Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 14:41:38 -0400 From: Rigger Subject: Re: "Well off topic"? At 7:38 AM -0700 5/13/04, James Kosmatka wrote: > I think a good analogy for the e-mail list would be to > a production meeting: there are those that want to > come in, take care of business, and leave. And there > are those who like to chat for the first five minutes > of the meeting, gossip, go off on tangents, and > generally mix the socializing with the business. Is it time for my Modified Paddlefoot Rant again (i.e. the list is like the local stagehands' bar here)?? -- Dave Vick, IATSE #274 Head Electrician, The Wharton Center for Performing Arts at Michigan State University Carpe Per Diem ------------------------------ From: Bsapsis [at] aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 14:44:44 EDT Subject: Re: respect and reality Re: Stagehand killed in fall X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Mac sub 7 In a message dated 5/13/04 2:23:29 PM, kim.hartshorn [at] plattsburgh.edu writes: << could you explain ESTA? does it set voluntary standards for equipment manufacturers, does it set standards for safe practice in the entertainment industry. I have often seen it referred to but realized as I was reading your post that in fact I have no clear idea of exactly what it is...other than it sounds like it is a good thing. >> www.ESTA.org << In terms of OSHA, although it was a few years back, when I contacted OSHA to get further information on the 6' rule the officer I talked to had great difficulty determining where our industry fit. The best he could do was that since it didn't fit any specific definition it was considered 'general construction' although this classification worked for me at the time in regards to our function as a college theatre it doesnt seem like it would be an adequate description of what happens at a typical stop on a concert tour. It seems to me for instance that if OSHA were to watch a typical put in they would wonder where the hard hats were yet as far as I know...the use of hard hats by stage workers is a rare practice...and yet we all have stories about dropped shackles and pins. Safety conciousness has changed radically in just a few years really, 12 years ago I saw many an outdoor stage go 6 bays tall with half the crew without any harness at all and the rest in sit harnesses...and they were the sissies! Today, such a sight would sicken the average stagehand in my aquaintance. As an industry I have been quite surprised at our willingness to adopt safe practice. But it is my impression that this has happened largely in spite of OSHA and not because of it. I would be interested in your opinion Bill >> It's not an opinion. Gravity works everywhere. The OSHA regs cover every worker be they brain surgeons or stagehands. Students are not covered as they are not employees. This holds for theatre students and med students alike. Hard hat rules exist. Whether they are enforced or not is a different matter. Safety awareness was a long time coming to this industry, mainly because the industry didn't think of itself as an industry. More like a group. Many know better now and have some sense of safety but there are still many who are willing to risk themselves at work. I'm not one of them. This awareness came about not because of or in spite of OSHA but because people like myself kept hammering away at the need for it and people like the Miami stagehand kept dying. Bill S. Sapsis Rigging, Inc. www.sapsis-rigging.com 800.727.7471 800.292.3851 fax We stand behind, and under, our work. Check out the Long Beach Long Riders cross country fund raiser for BC/EFA at http://sapsis-rigging.com/LBLR.html ------------------------------ Message-Id: <6.0.3.0.2.20040513143445.042ada38 [at] mail.hstech.org> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.3.0 Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 14:43:28 -0400 From: "Scott C. Parker" Subject: USITT NY Area Section - General Meeting - May 24 In-Reply-To: References: Just as the StageCraft list was going into the Internet void, I tried to announce the resurrection of the NY Area Section of USITT. Well, we did it and we're having a meeting... I am very happy to be serving as the Vice Chair. Below is the announcement of the meeting from our new Chair, Rich Wolpert. NEW YORK AREA SECTION - USITT GENERAL MEETING Monday, MAY 24th 6- 8 PM Rose Brand has graciously offered it's offices for a Executive Board and General meeting of the newly revived New York Area Section. Their offices are located at 75 Ninth Ave., NY. A map is available on their website - www.rosebrand.com . The Executive Board will be meeting at 4:30, with the General meeting to be held from 6 to 8 PM. Food and drink will be catered by a local deli. The purpose of this meeting is to introduce the new Board and give the membership input into the direction this Section should go. We'll need: volunteers for the various committees; suggetions for symposiums, programs and meetings; nominations for at-large Board members; and all the usual housekeeeping things that a growing organization needs. The Section needs people to put in the time needed to make it work and grow. If you are at all interested in seeing this organization succeed, then come to this meeting and lend a hand. We need people interested in working on committees such as: Architecture, Engineering, Presentation, Membership, Communications, etc. Or perhaps you have an interest and an idea for something this Section can do help/educate/represent the membership. We welcome your suggestions. And now the catch.... Membership in the New York Section is separate from membership in the national USITT organization. We are an independent corporation operating under the umbrella of the national Institute. A fee structure for membership dues will be finalized at the Executive Board meeting, and collected during the General Meeting. Student Membership will be $10, Individual/Professional - $25, Sustaining/Contributing - T.B.D. So come to the meeting with ideas and suggestions and be prepared to spend a couple of hours with others of us that share an interest in Technical Theatre. Schmooze with old friends and new. Hear the latest gossip. Come hungry and enjoy a free lunch! Oh, and by the way, bring your checkbook to pay for dues ( there is no free lunch! ). RSVP to richw [at] unionconnector.com Richard Wolpert Chairman PH: 631-753-9550 FX: 631-753-9560 Scott C. Parker Vice Chair, NY Area Section of The United States Institute of Theatre Technology scott [at] usittny.org www.usitt.org ------------------------------ From: "Sandra Hunter" Subject: * Re: Stagehand falls to his death Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 15:57:59 -0500 Message-ID: <0BBE1CD9BA96CA45B034A0963BB494F707ED75 [at] server.Ghosheh.local> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: So sorry to hear about this. What can we do to make sure it doesn't = happen again? -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Bsapsis [at] aol.com Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2004 9:49 PM To: Stagecraft Subject: **SPAM****SPAM****SPAM** Re: Stagehand falls to his death For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ --------------------------------------------------- In a message dated 5/12/04 1:00:31 PM, halld [at] etsu.edu writes: <<=20 "A stagehand working on a David Bowie concert in Miami died after a fall = on Thursday. Wally Thomas, 44, was climbing a ladder at the James L. = Knight Center when he lost his grip and fell 50 feet to his death. Emergency personnel tried to revive him, but he was pronounced dead after being = taken to the hospital. The concert was canceled and will not be rescheduled." Anyone know any more about this accident? >> He was climbing a wire rope ladder to his follow spot position. He was = not=20 connected to a Fall Arrest system. He fell and died. Bill S. ------------------------------ From: Bsapsis [at] aol.com Message-ID: <7d.4dfa51fb.2dd57e78 [at] aol.com> Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 21:44:24 EDT Subject: Re: * Re: Stagehand falls to his death X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Mac sub 7 In a message dated 5/13/04 4:58:25 PM, sandraghosheh [at] kc.rr.com writes: << So sorry to hear about this. What can we do to make sure it doesn't happen again? >> Training is a good start. But it takes more than training. It takes everyone, and I do mean everyone, paying attention all the time. It takes people willing to say no when asked to do something dangerous or illegal. It takes people willing to say no when there isn't enough time left to do the job properly and safely. In an industry where we all pride ourselves on not growing up, and I'm right at the top of that list, we have to mature in certain ways. Safety is one of them. As has been said, it's waaaaaaay better than it used to be, but it's gonna take more effort. Be well Bill s. Sapsis Rigging, Inc. www.sapsis-rigging.com 800.727.7471 800.292.3851 fax We stand behind, and under, our work. Check out the Long Beach Long Riders cross country fund raiser for BC/EFA at http://sapsis-rigging.com/LBLR.html ------------------------------ From: "Andy Leviss" Subject: OT: OT (was RE: Wal*Mart (Well off topic)) Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 23:35:50 -0400 Message-ID: <001f01c43964$8e658ff0$4fdc92ac [at] AndyLeviss> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: Dorian Kelly wrote: > One of the great problems with the Stagecraft list was the > sheer volume of off topic bo**cks. --snip-- > Can we please stick to stage or theatre topics, and give your > opinions on other matters to someone else? Actually, I think I'm not alone when I say that part of what makes this list so fun is the fact that we don't just talk about theatre, we talk about other things that interest us, too. I know I've enjoyed getting to know what makes the posters here tick, aside from our work in this field. As long as when an OT discussion carries on more than a post or two, it's flagged with an "OT:" subject header, I'm cool with it. --Andy, who survived his first tour (as asst. sound engineer for "The Full Monty") thanks in part to all y'alls advice, and is back in NJ and hunting for work again :o) P.S.-Wow, I just said, "all y'alls"...I think it was those last two weeks in Texas before I came off the road this Monday! --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.682 / Virus Database: 444 - Release Date: 5/11/2004 ------------------------------ Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Fri, 14 May 2004 00:03:35 -0400 From: Rigger Subject: Re: OT: OT (was RE: Wal*Mart (Well off topic)) At 11:35 PM -0400 5/13/04, Andy Leviss wrote: > I see you survived Foat Wuth. -- Dave Vick, IATSE #274 Head Electrician, The Wharton Center for Performing Arts at Michigan State University Carpe Per Diem ------------------------------ From: "OneOccy" References: Subject: Re: OT (was RE: Wal*Mart (Well off topic)) Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 23:49:30 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 Message-ID: Its some times our bar napkin... and our thoughts ------------------------------ Message-ID: <000701c43987$ae7cd000$1cecbed0 [at] hppav> From: "Joe Meils" References: Subject: Re: OT (was RE: Wal*Mart (Well off topic)) Date: Fri, 14 May 2004 02:47:17 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 You know, she's right... we should talk about issues important to the creation of theatre! So, keeping that in mind, let's talk about beer and wine! (I prefer either a good stout, or Guiness.) Joe > > Dorian Kelly wrote: > > Can we please stick to stage or theatre topics, and give your > > opinions on other matters to someone else? ------------------------------ End of Stagecraft Digest #6 ***************************