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Subject: Stagecraft Digest #27
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 16:16:19 -0700
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For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending
your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at:
   http://stagecraft.theprices.net/
---------------------------------------------------

Stagecraft Digest, Issue #27

 1. Re: Counterweight Rigging
    by "Delbert Hall" <halld [at] etsu.edu>
 2. Re: Counterweight Rigging
    by IAEG [at] aol.com
 3. Re: Counterweight Rigging
    by usctd [at] columbia.sc
 4. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
 5. MicroVision Disks
    by "Nikel, Andrew" <ANikel [at] vlps.com>
 6. Re: Source for Super B Size Paper 13x19
    by Steve Larson <tiptd [at] theatreinthepark.com>
 7. Re: MicroVision Disks
    by Steve Larson <tiptd [at] theatreinthepark.com>
 8. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
 9. Re: Ring Cycle
    by "Stephen E. Rees" <Rees [at] fredonia.edu>
10. Re: MicroVision Disks
    by Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
11. Re: MicroVision Disks
    by Herrick <Herrick [at] hglightingdesign.com>
12. Re: Counterweight Rigging
    by schreinerpd [at] longwood.edu
13. Re: Counterweight Rigging
    by Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
14. Doonesbury (Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please.)
    by Michael Powers <mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu>
15. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
16. Re: Michael Moore
    by "Rob Carovillano" <rcarovil [at] sju.edu>
17. 
    by Michael Powers <mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu>
18. Re: I went to Home Depot today
    by "MARK OBRIEN" <omark4 [at] msn.com>
19. Re: Food for thought
    by "Hofmann, Christopher" <chofmann [at] capecod.edu>
20. Re: Michael Moore
    by Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
21. Re: Michael Moore
    by Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
22. Re: 
    by "Matthew Breton" <theatricalmatt [at] hotmail.com>
23. Re: Automation Grenade
    by Jason Tollefson <jason [at] tollefsondesigns.com>
24. Re: Counterweight Rigging
    by Michael Powers <mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu>
25. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;) and Dave Vick
    by ken [at] kenholyoak.com (Ken Holyoak)
26. Re: counterweight rigging
    by "MARK OBRIEN" <omark4 [at] msn.com>
27. Re: Counterweight Rigging
    by Michael Powers <mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu>
28. Power quality, electrical system specs
    by "Steven Haworth" <sjh [at] idm.com>
29. Re: Ring Cycle
    by "Jon Ares" <jonares [at] hevanet.com>
30. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by Fred Fisher <fwfisher [at] wisc.edu>
31. Re: Sex drugs and Opera/ food for thought
    by Fred Fisher <fwfisher [at] wisc.edu>
32. Re: Microvision disks? 
    by Brian Aldous <brian [at] tany.com>
33. Re: Automated Rigging (was Re: Automation Grenade ... careful ..)
    by Bruce Purdy <bpurdy [at] rochester.rr.com>
34. Guinness Arbor
    by b Ricie <b_ricie [at] yahoo.com>
35. Re: Counterweight Rigging - terminations
    by Bruce Purdy <bpurdy [at] rochester.rr.com>
36. Re: MicroVision Disks
    by Steve Bailey <sbmtbike [at] optonline.net>
37. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;) 
    by Brian Aldous <brian [at] tany.com>
38. Re: Microvision disks?  (boy what a fun list)
    by Herrick <Herrick [at] hglightingdesign.com>
39. Re: Microvision disks?  (boy what a fun list)
    by IAEG [at] aol.com
40. Re: Counterweight Rigging - terminations
    by Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
41. Re: Food for thought
    by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
42. Re: Counterweight Rigging - terminations
    by "Sam Fisher" <Sam [at] FisherTheatrical.com>
43. Re: Counterweight Rigging - terminations
    by Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
44. Re: Rings (was: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;) )
    by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
45. Overhead, overlong
    by "William Knapp" <will [at] thebase.com>
46. Re: Totally OT: Starship Troopers II (Was: Ring)
    by "Michael Finney" <mfinney [at] thinkwelldesign.com>
47. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
48. Re: Sex drugs and Opera/ food for thought
    by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
49. Re: Microvision disks?  (boy what a fun list)
    by Steve Larson <tiptd [at] theatreinthepark.com>
50. Re: Welcome back Frank
    by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
51. Re: Counterweight Rigging
    by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
52. Re: Counterweight Rigging - terminations
    by doran [at] bard.edu
53. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by doran [at] bard.edu
54. Rings
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
55. Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
56. Re: Power quality, electrical system specs
    by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
57. Totally OT:  Starship Troopers II (Was: Ring)
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
58. Wal-mart
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
59. Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
60. Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)
    by Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
61. Re: Powerpoint Background
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
62. Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)
    by Herrick <Herrick [at] hglightingdesign.com>
63. Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)
    by Herrick <Herrick [at] hglightingdesign.com>
64. Re: Counterweight Rigging
    by doran [at] bard.edu
65. Re: Automation Grenade
    by usctd [at] columbia.sc
66. Re: Powerpoint Background
    by "Jon Ares" <jonares [at] hevanet.com>
67. Re: Food for thought
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
68. Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)
    by Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
69. Re: Totally OT:  Starship Troopers II (Was: Ring)
    by "Storms, Randy" <rstorms [at] bham.wednet.edu>
70. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
71. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
72. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
73. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by Jerry Durand <jdurand [at] interstellar.com>
74. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
75. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
76. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
77. Re: Guinness Arbor
    by Jerry Durand <jdurand [at] interstellar.com>
78. Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
    by Jerry Durand <jdurand [at] interstellar.com>

*** Please update the subject line of your reply to use the subject
*** line of the message you are replying to! Please only reply to
*** one message subject in each reply.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Delbert Hall" <halld [at] etsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 06:38:18 -0400
Organization: ETSU
Message-ID: <000001c4488d$b8b0a730$6400a8c0 [at] delbert>
In-Reply-To: <list-3543072 [at] prxy.net>

Here is a simple idea for making counterweight systems safer.  Keep your
counterweight system the same as it is now, except make your arbor well
as deep as your grid is high (half that for double purchase systems).
Make your lift lines and purchase lines long enough so that when the
batten is at low trim, the arbor will be at the locking rail.  You can
then load weight at stage level (no worries about dropping weights).  As
the batten goes up, the arbor sinks into the well. If there is a runaway
and the arbor crashes, it is in the well, where no humans are,
protecting them from falling weights.  This will add more cost to the
construction of the theatre, but probably not near as much as a bunch of
winches.   This idea is for new construction since it would be
impractical for most existing theatres. OK, what do you think?

-Delbert


------------------------------

From: IAEG [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <1d9.22d4f9a0.2def1027 [at] aol.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 07:12:39 EDT
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging


In a message dated 6/2/04 3:40:10 AM, halld [at] etsu.edu writes:

<< This will add more cost to the
construction of the theatre, but probably not near as much as a bunch of
winches.   This idea is for new construction since it would be
impractical for most existing theatres. OK, what do you think? >>

sounds interstesting, , here in Florida you would definately need mucho SUMP 
PUMPS for that well to keep it dry ! 

very best,

Keith Arsenault

IAEG -  International Arts & Entertainment Group 
Tampa, Florida

------------------------------

Message-ID: <1200.207.201.197.39.1086181961.squirrel [at] webmail.columbia.sc>
In-Reply-To: <list-3544471 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3543072 [at] prxy.net> <list-3544471 [at] prxy.net>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 09:12:41 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging
From: usctd [at] columbia.sc

Wing space is premium real estate.  The only advantage of the weight rail
is that the pigs are out of the way.  I find the idea interesting, though.

We are all thinking about solving the problem with weight.  What about
resistance?  What if you had a cable reel that atached to the bottom of an
"arbor"?  The reel would be at deck level pulling down acting as weight. 
The technician would be able to adjust the tension on the reel thus adding
or removing weight.  An immediate problem here is there is no safety if
the reel craps out.  You could have a second reel that would activate in
an overspeed situation?...Yeah, that sounds inexpensive....Oh well, just
thought of it.
-- 
Eric Rouse
TD-University of SC, Columbia
Freelance Foyboy

> For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending
> your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at:
>    http://stagecraft.theprices.net/
> ---------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Here is a simple idea for making counterweight systems safer.  Keep your
> counterweight system the same as it is now, except make your arbor well
> as deep as your grid is high (half that for double purchase systems).
> Make your lift lines and purchase lines long enough so that when the
> batten is at low trim, the arbor will be at the locking rail.  You can
> then load weight at stage level (no worries about dropping weights).  As
> the batten goes up, the arbor sinks into the well. If there is a runaway
> and the arbor crashes, it is in the well, where no humans are,
> protecting them from falling weights.  This will add more cost to the
> construction of the theatre, but probably not near as much as a bunch of
> winches.   This idea is for new construction since it would be
> impractical for most existing theatres. OK, what do you think?
>
> -Delbert
>
>


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 13:36:04 +0100 (BST)
From: Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
In-Reply-To: <list-3543517 [at] prxy.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.50.0406021334440.5873-100000 [at] midi>
References: <list-3543517 [at] prxy.net>

Michael Moore's newsletter of May 5, 2004:

Disney Has Blocked the Distribution of My New Film... by Michael Moore

May 5, 2004

Friends,

I would have hoped by now that I would be able to put my work out to the public
without having to experience the profound censorship obstacles I often seem to
encounter.

Yesterday I was told that Disney, the studio that owns Miramax, has officially
decided to prohibit our producer, Miramax, from distributing my new film,
"Fahrenheit 911." The reason? According to today's (May 5) New York Times, it
might "endanger" millions of dollars of tax breaks Disney receives from the
state of Florida because the film will "anger" the Governor of Florida, Jeb
Bush. The story is on page one of the Times and you can read it here ("Disney
Forbidding Distribution of Film That Criticizes
Bush"--http://www.nytimes.com/2004/05/05/national/05DISN.html?ex=1084334400&en=89983012bdce5ec0&ei=5062&partner=GOOGLE
).

The whole story behind this (and other attempts) to kill our movie will be told
in more detail as the days and weeks go on. For nearly a year, this struggle has
been a lesson in just how difficult it is in this country to create a piece of
art that might upset those in charge (well, OK, sorry -- it WILL upset
them...big time.  Did I mention it's a comedy?). All I can say is, thank God for
Harvey Weinstein and Miramax who have stood by me during the entire production
of this movie.

There is much more to tell, but right now I am in the lab working on the print
to take to the Cannes Film Festival next week (we have been chosen as one of the
18 films in competition). I will tell you this: Some people may be afraid of
this movie because of what it will show. But there's nothing they can do about
it now because it's done, it's awesome, and if I have anything to say about it,
you'll see it this summer -- because, after all, it is a free country.

Yours,

Michael Moore
mmflint [at] aol.com
www.michaelmoore.com


------------------------------

Subject: MicroVision Disks
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 07:46:48 -0500
Message-ID: <93FE13C1F8D37D4D89A28A78F975D669F3300A [at] stagepost.vari-lite.corp>
From: "Nikel, Andrew" <ANikel [at] vlps.com>

I also vote for the 3.5" Double Sided Double Density disks but as I =
recall, it depended on the disk drive. Some could take the HD and worked =
fine, others could not. The drives were sourced from different =
manufacturers over the life of the product, I believe.

Andrew

<< Ok for the record we're at 3 experts that  say double density and 3=20
experts that say HD is fine. seeing as how I can't find any single=20
sided DD's I'm hoping the latter 3 are correct. >>



------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 08:46:33 -0400
Subject: Re: Source for Super B Size Paper 13x19
From: Steve Larson <tiptd [at] theatreinthepark.com>
Message-ID: <BCE34469.4253%tiptd [at] theatreinthepark.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3541990 [at] prxy.net>

You can go to CompUSA and pay twice what you can buy
it for on the web.  I use Epson #041143 for a nice
photo paper and #S041069 for a xerox type paper.

Go to one of the PriceGrabber or PriceNet type
of sites and search for the cheapest.  Watch the
shipping.  Some will ship as inexpensively as $4.95
for up to 3 20-sheet pkgs of the nice stuff.  Some
places lice TheNerd.com wanted $22 to ship the
same order.  Last time I believe I paid $22 a
20-sheet pkg for the nice stuff.  Ordered three
pkgs and paid $4.95 shipping.  I got it in 3 days.

Steve

on 6/1/04 9:56 PM, Mason, Richard at rmason [at] richmond.edu wrote:

> For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending
> your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at:
> http://stagecraft.theprices.net/
> ---------------------------------------------------
> 
> 
> Anyone have a source(s) for what HP calls SuperB size paper 13x19, other
> than taking paper to a paper cutter?
> 
> 


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 08:58:24 -0400
Subject: Re: MicroVision Disks
From: Steve Larson <tiptd [at] theatreinthepark.com>
Message-ID: <BCE34730.4256%tiptd [at] theatreinthepark.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3544991 [at] prxy.net>

This thread has gone on long enough, already.  Can't
someone just dig into the old box in storage and pull
out a half dozen of the DSDD disks and send them to
whomever wants it.  I know I've got a box of old disks
that I've never thrown away.  If you want some email
me off list with your address and I'll send them.

Too many people on this list thrive on trying to
make something work by spending hours talking about
it on the list and trying to "rig" this or "rig"
that when they can solve it much more efficiently
just by asking if anyone has a spare disk or making
one phone call to the computer lab or calling
geeks, incorporated.

Save bandwidth,  quit beating a dead horse.

Steve

on 6/2/04 8:46 AM, Nikel, Andrew at ANikel [at] vlps.com wrote:

> For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending
> your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at:
> http://stagecraft.theprices.net/
> ---------------------------------------------------
> 
> 
> I also vote for the 3.5" Double Sided Double Density disks but as I recall, it
> depended on the disk drive. Some could take the HD and worked fine, others
> could not. The drives were sourced from different manufacturers over the life
> of the product, I believe.
> 
> Andrew
> 
> << Ok for the record we're at 3 experts that  say double density and 3
> experts that say HD is fine. seeing as how I can't find any single
> sided DD's I'm hoping the latter 3 are correct. >>
> 
> 
> 
> 


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 14:08:20 +0100 (BST)
From: Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
In-Reply-To: <list-3543464 [at] prxy.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.50.0406021338230.5873-100000 [at] midi>
References: <list-3543464 [at] prxy.net>

Devil's advocate, eh?  hmmmm...

On Tue, 1 Jun 2004, Steeve Vajk wrote:

> Free speech rights are individual. They LET you say what you want, they
> do NOT require someone else to pay for it.

Disney had the right to deny distribution of a film that would make them a lot
of money for a short period of time but jeopardize their long-term financial
benefits in Florida, in their estimation.  How long the Bush dynasty will be
around is a calculated risk though ;-)  Some people think they put their money
in the wrong place, including the board to whom Eisner tendered his resignation
;-)

> responsive to market demands. They don't dictate what you need to buy,
> they have to *forecast* what you need. Pretty tough job, if you ask me.

Not a given.  With so much floor space, they can clear any mistakes in a matter 
of hours and get the suppliers to eat the rest and provide what the customers 
say they want 'now' with a minimal amount of market research ;-)

> And again, if they didn't do at least a halfway decent job of selling
> what people wanted to buy, they wouldn't have the money to be so big.

Their technique is to do a decent job of undercutting the competition till they 
go out of business, then they can sell and charge what they want to (within 
certain limits, but which always involve the lowest input costs and enough 
markup to ensure good profitability and continued low retail prices)  If a 
significant cometitor starts making inroads in a local market, they simply use 
their financial strength to undercut them again for a while.

This does not always mean they don't serve their customers well by offering the 
products they want at good prices but they do have an employment monopoly in 
local markets and employees often see that they either work for or against 
Wal-Mart but always at Wal-Mart wages and conditions because that's what they 
have brought employment standards down to.

> A) Do you think USITT and ESTA are evil organizations? They "are
> willing to use their money and power to affect the political and social
> world that we live, work, and perform in". Oh, but they're supporting
> an agenda that you (presumably) support; safety in theatre and keeping
> an eye on government regulation to make sure it actually helps the
> industry, among other things. They may not have the money that Wal-Mart
> has, but I bet they wouldn't mind if they did. EVERYONE has an agenda;
> even you.

I have no idea why you are equating a profitable retail chain with non-profit, 
member-driven organizations that have completely different purposes.  This 
paragraph seems like a confusing smokescreen for something ;-)

> B) Wal-Mart's policies have NOTHING to do with civil liberties. My rant
> on censorship should have made that clear. Wal-Mart has been around for
> years, yet to this day, they have not stopped me from doing, saying,
> thinking, or reading a single thing. They don't want me in jail or

They may have stopped you from supporting companies who treat their employees 
fairly and pay them and those of their suppliers a decent wage because they have 
eliminated your options.

> fined for ANYTHING I do... that would impact my ability to spend money
> in their store. :) They do not and cannot BAN anything. They can only
> choose not to sell it. 

Actually, Wal-Mart can get extremely nasty about local groups who campaign 
against the approval of their plans to locate stores in new locations and they 
fight very hard against those groups and the individuals behind them, even to 
the extent of political interference and whisper campaigns that are well-funded 
and very close to slander.  The tricky part of all this is that these battles 
are all fought one at a time on local levels and rarely are raised to a national 
level of consciousness.

> C) Free market IS the "American way of life". 

And your point is? ;-)

> D) If you keep ammo under your bed for fear of Wal-Mart and Disney, you
> might want to get some aluminium foil to keep their radio waves out of

That won't work.  Use copper screening.

> your head. Don't worry, Wal-Mart carries big rolls of it. :)

They don't sell that, though ;-)

> But seriously, you sure didn't buy that ammo AT Wal-Mart, because
> Michael Moore turned market pressure on them after Columbine, and now
> they don't sell guns or ammo. You should be upset that they're

Yeay Michael!  Disney knows the power he has and is really afraid of it ;-)

> infringing on a right that actually does get mentioned by name in the
> Constitution. Are you?

I gather you are referring to the right to bear arms, written when guns were 
muzzle loaded, single shot awkward suckers ;-)

> Disclaimer: I am by nature a Devil's Advocate. This is offered in the
> spirit of a lively political debate. It is assumed that all
> participants are reasonable adults, and that no personal offense is
> intended or taken by any.

Absolutely likewise ;-)

Charlie

------------------------------

Message-ID: <40BDD31A.5020806 [at] fredonia.edu>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 09:16:10 -0400
From: "Stephen E. Rees" <Rees [at] fredonia.edu>
Subject: Re: Ring Cycle
References: <list-3542949 [at] prxy.net>

Loren,
You, Sir, need to get out of the sun!!:)
Steve

Loren Schreiber wrote:
> So, OK--I mow the lawn, I do the heavy lifting, etc. Wife does the 
> laundry, but I'm thinkin' "What the hell, I'll give it a shot." So I 
> look at the freakin' washer and there ain't no freakin' "ring cycle" 
> anywhere. I ain't no anti-semite, but I think might have some in mah 
> drawers, so I'm looking for the freakin' "ring cycle." Well, "spin 
> cycle" was about as close I come. I don't think it works as good. I can 
> still feel them anti-semites in my drawers. I think I'll use Wisk next 
> time. Got me some from Wal-Mart.
> 
> Loren "ah gradumated from LSU" Schreiber


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 14:11:17 +0100 (BST)
From: Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
Subject: Re: MicroVision Disks
In-Reply-To: <list-3545041 [at] prxy.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.50.0406021410090.5873-100000 [at] midi>
References: <list-3545041 [at] prxy.net>

On Wed, 2 Jun 2004, Steve Larson wrote:

> This thread has gone on long enough, already.  Can't
> someone just dig into the old box in storage and pull
> out a half dozen of the DSDD disks and send them to
> whomever wants it.  I know I've got a box of old disks
> that I've never thrown away.  If you want some email
> me off list with your address and I'll send them.

I've got hundreds of them, as well.  The major difficulty is they are in Canada 
so they usually have to cross a border to get where they are wanted but they are 
available ;-)

Charlie

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 09:26:13 -0400
Subject: Re: MicroVision Disks
From: Herrick <Herrick [at] hglightingdesign.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3545110 [at] prxy.net>
Message-Id: <6B43C500-B498-11D8-8378-0003934521EC [at] hglightingdesign.com>

Indeed I'll take Steve up on his offer but it's more about getting the 
right answer to the question.

"What type of disks does a microvision take? "

Apparently the answer is both...depending...

-H
>


Herrick Goldman
Lighting Designer, NYC
www.HGLightingDesign.com

"To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and 
in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS


------------------------------

Message-ID: <20040602093624.dmx5wwwg0swg8osc [at] webmail.longwood.edu>
Date: Wed,  2 Jun 2004 09:36:24 -0400
From: schreinerpd [at] longwood.edu
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging
References: <list-3542684 [at] prxy.net>
In-Reply-To: <list-3542684 [at] prxy.net>

> But I'm REALLY intrigued by the liquid counterweight idea.  Aren't there
> some super dense materials that are still a liquid at the range of
> temperatures in most theatres?  Guinness? I could have some pretty dense
> homebrew ready in four weeks or so.

Actually, since the specific gravity of alcohol is less than that of water,
you'd be better off leaving the yeast out of the equation entirely for this.

I've already got a name for the system though..."counter-wort".



------------------------------

Message-Id: <p06110401bce38a02069f [at] [168.192.123.250]>
In-Reply-To: <list-3544471 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3544471 [at] prxy.net>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 09:47:01 -0400
From: Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging

At 6:38 AM -0400 6/2/04, Delbert Hall wrote:

>Here is a simple idea for making counterweight systems safer.  Keep your
>counterweight system the same as it is now, except make your arbor well
>as deep as your grid is high (half that for double purchase systems).
>
>impractical for most existing theatres. OK, what do you think?


I think the cable transfer would be a sidewise bitch to deal with.
And around here that'd put the arbor well deep into the water table.

-- 
Dave Vick, IATSE #274
   Head Electrician,
   The Wharton Center for Performing Arts at Michigan State University
   <http://www.whartoncenter.com/>

    Carpe Per Diem

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 09:56:20 -0400
From: Michael Powers <mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu>
Subject: Doonesbury (Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please.)
Cc: Chip.Wood [at] motorola.com (Wood Chip-P26398)
Message-id: <1086184580.40bddc844655e [at] mail-www3.oit.umass.edu>

Wood Chip-P26398 <Chip.Wood [at] motorola.com> writes:

<<Did you see Doonesbury on Sunday? >>

Chip,

Yes.  I read every single name, one at a time. One at a time, ... 
and cried.   

Michael

Michael Powers, Technical Director
UMass Theatre Department
112 FAC West
151 Presidents Drive, Ofc.2
Amherst, Ma. 01003-9331

413-545-6821  voice
413-577-0025  fax

mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu

------------------------------

Message-Id: <p06110402bce38c348a33 [at] [168.192.123.250]>
In-Reply-To: <list-3544966 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3543517 [at] prxy.net> <list-3544966 [at] prxy.net>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 09:54:36 -0400
From: Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)

At 1:36 PM +0100 6/2/04, Charlie Richmond wrote:

>  Michael Moore's newsletter of May 5, 2004:


Well, there's his side of the story, and there's Disney's side of the 
story, and then there's what probably *really* happened.

I wouldn't trust either Michael Moore or Disney to tell the truth as 
far as I could throw them.

-- 
Dave Vick, IATSE #274
   Head Electrician,
   The Wharton Center for Performing Arts at Michigan State University
   <http://www.whartoncenter.com/>

    Carpe Per Diem

------------------------------

Message-ID: <001b01c448a9$a1d796b0$a8a44481 [at] rcarovil>
From: "Rob Carovillano" <rcarovil [at] sju.edu>
References: <list-3544357 [at] prxy.net>
Subject: Re: Michael Moore
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 09:58:06 -0400

Thought you might all like an update since it has been talked about so much.


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=529&e=2&u=/ap/20040602/ap_en_mo/michael_moore_film

Disney stated to Miramax and Moore over a year ago that they would not
distribute the film.  They had that long to solve the problem, but they
waited until the last minute so they could get the extra free marketing by
creating a conflict.  A very smart marketing move.


Rob Carovillano
Technical Director
Bluett Theatre
Saint Joseph's University
rcarovil [at] sju.edu



------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 10:08:04 -0400
From: Michael Powers <mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu>
Message-id: <1086185284.40bddf44d0e04 [at] mail-www3.oit.umass.edu>

"Matthew Breton" <theatricalmatt [at] hotmail.com> writes:

>>I have often wondered why there is no "liquid" counter weight 
>>system out there.

>Given how hot it gets backstage on some shows, evaporation must 
>factor in  somehow....

Matthew,

One would think that the fluid in such a system would be contained 
in a closed system and that the fluid would probably be something 
akin to hydraulic fluid, so evaporation would be close to 
neglegeble. Of course, it would still require periodoc topping off, 
filtering and flushing and replacing.

On that note however, a long time ago I read a passage about 
stagehands at a theatre that used open vat saltwater dimmers having 
to top the vats up daily.  I wonder about hot days and or two show 
days????

Michael

Michael Powers, Technical Director
UMass Theatre Department
112 FAC West
151 Presidents Drive, Ofc.2
Amherst, Ma. 01003-9331

413-545-6821  voice
413-577-0025  fax

mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu

------------------------------

From: "MARK OBRIEN" <omark4 [at] msn.com>
Subject: Re: I went to Home Depot today
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 07:09:44 -0700
Message-ID: <BAY3-F41eUNyFSXOktn0003bfcb [at] hotmail.com>

While babysitting someones house while they had a fence put in, I watched 
the workers put up a dog run up in about 20 min.  Quickcrete? one may ask.  
I saw them use regular concrete mix, and put in a bag of plaster.  Voila!  
poor mans quickcrete.  Damn did they move fast after that. It was only about 
80 out. (bit chilly)



Mark O'Brien




>
>
>So I went to Home Depot today. Got a bunch of lumber for a new fence and 
>was looking for post hole concrete among the other concrete mixes. Asked 
>the young lad where to find post hole concrete and he asked, "Is that like 
>Quickcrete?" When I finally found the material (in the garden department) I 
>took the time to relocate the young lad, dragged him, albeit unwillingly, 
>over to garden and pointed to the bags I had been looking for. In the 
>future, this young man will know the correct answer to the question. Ah, my 
>life as an edumacator.
>
>Loren
>

_________________________________________________________________
Stop worrying about overloading your inbox - get MSN Hotmail Extra Storage! 
http://join.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200362ave/direct/01/


------------------------------

Subject: Re: Food for thought
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 10:11:00 -0400
Message-ID: <56439B09A4ADDC46876BDFF2BBD35DF001C173D6 [at] ex1.capecod.edu>
From: "Hofmann, Christopher" <chofmann [at] capecod.edu>

>A US Supreme Court justice stated that he doesn't know what obscenity
is, either, but he did >say that "he knows it when he sees it". <g> /s/
Richard

US Sepreme Court Justice Potter Stewart

From http://www.michaelariens.com/ConLaw/justices/stewart.htm
"Somewhat unfortunately, Stewart may best known for his statement in
Jacobellis v. Ohio (1964), an obscenity case, that "I know it when I see
it," in determining whether the film was obscene."

Chris


------------------------------

Message-Id: <p06110407bce390b09760 [at] [168.192.123.250]>
In-Reply-To: <list-3545386 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3544357 [at] prxy.net> <list-3545386 [at] prxy.net>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 10:12:48 -0400
From: Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
Subject: Re: Michael Moore

At 9:58 AM -0400 6/2/04, Rob Carovillano wrote:

>  They had that long to solve the problem, but they
>  waited until the last minute so they could get the
>  extra free marketing by creating a conflict.
>  A very smart marketing move.


And typical of that whiny-butt Moore.

-- 
Dave Vick, IATSE #274
   Head Electrician,
   The Wharton Center for Performing Arts at Michigan State University
   <http://www.whartoncenter.com/>

    Carpe Per Diem

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 15:14:31 +0100 (BST)
From: Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
Subject: Re: Michael Moore
In-Reply-To: <list-3545477 [at] prxy.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.50.0406021513570.5873-100000 [at] midi>
References: <list-3544357 [at] prxy.net> <list-3545386 [at] prxy.net> <list-3545477 [at] prxy.net>

On Wed, 2 Jun 2004, Rigger wrote:

> And typical of that whiny-butt Moore.

Hmmmmm.....  very interesting imagery ;-)

CBR

------------------------------

From: "Matthew Breton" <theatricalmatt [at] hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: 
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 10:33:11 -0400
Message-ID: <BAY14-F21DCZx4FR0rm0002f046 [at] hotmail.com>

>One would think that the fluid in such a system would be contained
>in a closed system and that the fluid would probably be something
>akin to hydraulic fluid, so evaporation would be close to
>negligable. Of course, it would still require periodoc topping off,
>filtering and flushing and replacing.

I was being about as serious in my comment about evaporating water as others 
are in their thoughts about Guinness. :)  And about as serious as I would be 
in suggesting the stagehands could top the saltwater dimmer vats you mention 
off with (ewww!) sweat.

It seems to me that while a liquid counterweight system might be more 
precise, the gear needed to run it -- pumps, filters, cooling units and so 
on -- are probably more cumbersome than the current arrangement of weights 
and pulleys. Plus, anything that looks like a refrigerator is bound to be a 
Facilities job, not Technical. ;)

And -- not to make light of another's injuries -- but if Unka Bill almost 
got clobbered by a stage brick, imagine the havoc a leaky hose under 
pressure could wreak. Might be a good way to cool off everyone ... 'cept the 
producer.


Matthew Breton
Technical Director
Green Street Studios

_________________________________________________________________
Watch the online reality show Mixed Messages with a friend and enter to win 
a trip to NY 
http://www.msnmessenger-download.click-url.com/go/onm00200497ave/direct/01/


------------------------------

Message-ID: <20040602143338.59650.qmail [at] web50301.mail.yahoo.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 07:33:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jason Tollefson <jason [at] tollefsondesigns.com>
Subject: Re: Automation Grenade
In-Reply-To: <list-3536409 [at] prxy.net>

> > Many times the eyes that should be watching stuff move are
> > occupied doing other things or have been lulled into a false sense of
> > security because it has worked 500 times in a row uneventfully.

And how many times have you seen a technician onstage either pushing a wagon or pulling a
counterweight line while looking for a spike mark instead of watching stage for errant actors and
such?

> Sorry I was not clear.  I was talking about the permanent type shows that
> we are seeing in Florida and Vegas, for example.  Obviously tours are a
> different story.  But then they don't have 100 winches in the show either.

I certainly can't speak for every "permanent type show" in Florida but speaking for the show I
currently find myself working with at one of the Theme Parks here in Orlando I must take exception
to the implication that we are lax in our attention to safety.  Yes the Show Control Operator is
in the control booth at the back of the house but onstage, next to every automated effect and with
direct access to an E-Stop there is one and in some cases two technicians tasked monitoring the
automation.  That is in addition to the E-Stops at the Show Control and the Stage Manager's
positions in the booth who are watching the show live onstage and on video monitors with infrared
cameras for monitoring during blackouts.  Each and every day we run a Global E-Stop test and a
Test Show without performers or light cues to test the automation systems in full light to make
sure everything is working properly.

Let's not forget that ANY mechanical effect, whether operated manually or via automation can be
dangerous.  We use automation for those parts of the show that must sync with the soundtrack or
that would be too complicated or dangerous to operate manually.  Unsynchronized effects,
especially those which interact with the performers, are manually operated.  Both have their
place.

Jason Tollefson
LD-at-Large (and Theme Park Technician)
Orlando, FL
www.tollefsondesigns.com



------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 10:32:47 -0400
From: Michael Powers <mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu>
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging
Message-id: <1086186767.40bde50fe6e6b [at] mail-www3.oit.umass.edu>

"Big Fred Schoening" <bigfred [at] mindspring.com> writes:  

<<  ......  stage weights is stored at the top, just under the head 
block. The lift lines all run through slots in the weights,....  Of 
course, ... that would require an assload of weight .....>>

Fred,

Sounds like you may have the beginning of a mechanically workable 
system.  Ecconomicly or practically workable  .... maybe, maybe not. 
Obviously there'd have to be a safety interlock to prevent the "Pin" 
from being pulled if the weights were not fully supported from 
below.  Wow!  Think of an entire full arbor stack of weights making 
a sudden trip, headblock to traproom.  Also, can you imagine trying 
to rig a carpet hoist on that system?? 

Michael

Michael Powers, Technical Director
UMass Theatre Department
112 FAC West
151 Presidents Drive, Ofc.2
Amherst, Ma. 01003-9331

413-545-6821  voice
413-577-0025  fax

mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu

------------------------------

From: ken [at] kenholyoak.com (Ken Holyoak)
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;) and Dave Vick
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 09:37:37 -0500
Message-ID: <002f01c448af$27080450$0900a8c0 [at] COMPAQ>
In-Reply-To: <list-3545368 [at] prxy.net>

Couldn't have said it better my self.

Thank you

Kenneth. H. Holyoak
Information + Insight = Profit
POB 68633
Indianapolis, IN 46268-0633
 
ken [at] kenholyoak.com
317-253-7000


-----Original Message-----
From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Rigger
Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2004 8:55 AM
To: Stagecraft
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)

For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending
your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at:
   http://stagecraft.theprices.net/
---------------------------------------------------


At 1:36 PM +0100 6/2/04, Charlie Richmond wrote:

>  Michael Moore's newsletter of May 5, 2004:


Well, there's his side of the story, and there's Disney's side of the 
story, and then there's what probably *really* happened.

I wouldn't trust either Michael Moore or Disney to tell the truth as 
far as I could throw them.

-- 
Dave Vick, IATSE #274
   Head Electrician,
   The Wharton Center for Performing Arts at Michigan State University
   <http://www.whartoncenter.com/>

    Carpe Per Diem


------------------------------

From: "MARK OBRIEN" <omark4 [at] msn.com>
Subject: Re: counterweight rigging
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 07:39:47 -0700
Message-ID: <BAY3-F26rKhTfC6zVXD00012d3e [at] hotmail.com>

I worked a show a few years back, where the counterweight for the operating 
piece was steel shot. It worked great, but on load out, it was discovered 
that there was moisture in the mix, and the shot did not flow through the 
ball valve on the bottom of the vessel.  Was not my problem, but they did 
not appear to be having fun. They also spilled 16th inch balls all over 
backstage.

So if you are backstage at Bill Grahm Aud. in SF, and you find a bunch of 
little balls underfoot...



Mark O'Brien





>From: "Delbert Hall" <halld [at] etsu.edu>
>Reply-To: "Stagecraft" <stagecraft [at] theatrical.net>
>To: "Stagecraft" <stagecraft [at] theatrical.net>
>Subject: Re: counterweight rigging
>Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 21:36:35 -0400
>
>For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending
>your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at:
>    http://stagecraft.theprices.net/
>---------------------------------------------------
>
>
>When I get back to the office on Thursday, off doing BEAUTY AND THE
>BEAST, I will try to find my copy of the patent that used steel balls or
>pellets as counterweight.  I have no idea how much cheaper this kind of
>system would be than using a winch.  You could still have a runaway if
>you did not drain the counterweight before unloading the batten. I'll
>let ya'll know if I find it.
>
>-Delbert
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>
> >I have often wondered why there is no "liquid" counter weight system
>out
> >there.
>
>Given how hot it gets backstage on some shows, evaporation must factor
>in
>somehow....
>
>Though you could always distribute some extra Poland Springs to it, same
>as
>for the follow spot ops. :)
>
>
>Matthew Breton
>Technical Director
>Green Street Studios
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page -
>FREE
>download! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 11:06:24 -0400
From: Michael Powers <mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu>
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging
Message-id: <1086188784.40bdecf077eda [at] mail-www3.oit.umass.edu>

"Kevin Patrick" <patrick_kevin [at] colstate.edu> writes:

<<   ....   It would be very, very bad, if ever
the arbor flew up at an uncontrolled rate.  .... I've never seen it, 
but how often does an arbor fly up uncontrollably?  It's pretty 
difficult to accidentally add #500 to a pipe when it's gridded....>>

Kevin,

Not offten, granted, but I have seen the results of such a runaway.  
It was at a small theatre in Oklahoma City in '64.  I was part of 
the crew hired to clean up the mess, repair and replace the 
equipment.  The loading galery had been cut during construction for 
$$$ reasons.  Arbors were sent up with  a block and fall attached 
and pipe weight plus maybe 50 lbs extra.  The scenery was loaded 
onto the batten and then the arbor was hauled down to the floor to 
load.  The accident was what you would expect, heavy scenery at the 
grid, under weighted arbor at floor level and the load came loose.  
We never did find out how it got loose but the result was 
catestrophic.  The very heavy, wood frame set piece hit the floor at 
full speed, shattered and broke loose.  Judging from eyewitness 
accounts and examining the pieces, it seem that the pipe didn't stop 
just because the scenery hit the floor, it kept right on toward the 
trap room.  The pipe hit part of the set piece (before it completely 
shattered and fell) and one end bounced back up 10' - 15' and when 
it fell back down, the shock load broke one or two of the dogclips 
on the trim chains and the threaded coupling.  As mentioned earlier, 
the arbor was sent up pipe weight + 50 lbs. so now half the pipe and 
all the scenery wwere gone and the arbor mad it's trip back down.  
Unlike Paddy's brick eppisode this was the end of the accident, only 
one trip up and one back down.  Well, the end except that the broken 
section of pipe was not centerd on the two lift lines that didn't 
break so it went up hanging vertically.  The trim chain loops were 
not tight to the batten and when the upper end hit the underside of 
the grid, the pipe slipped out and came back down.  The good news, 
no one was hurt.  Bottom line, it can happen.

<<  ...   Aren't there some super dense materials that are still a 
liquid at the range of temperatures in most theatres?  
Guinness? ...>>

Now you're talking my language!

Michael

Michael Powers, Technical Director
UMass Theatre Department
112 FAC West
151 Presidents Drive, Ofc.2
Amherst, Ma. 01003-9331

413-545-6821  voice
413-577-0025  fax

mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu

------------------------------

Subject: Power quality, electrical system specs
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 10:16:03 -0500
Message-ID: <721DC9EE550F834A92EC08BDC332B0EE01607F45 [at] trader.river.idm.com>
From: "Steven Haworth" <sjh [at] idm.com>

Howdy.

I came across a really good article on electrical requirements to keep =
sound clean in stage environments, where computers, lighting dimmers & =
such all interact.  It's got some guidelines which probably should be =
part of the requirement specs for any new or upgrade performance space.

http://ecmweb.com/mag/electric_harmonics_nightclubs_electrical/



- Steven      (sjh [at] idm.com)
---------------------------
http://www.stagelights.info

------------------------------

Message-ID: <00d301c448b4$906b97e0$0201a8c0 [at] BRUTUS>
From: "Jon Ares" <jonares [at] hevanet.com>
References: <list-3542949 [at] prxy.net>
Subject: Re: Ring Cycle
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 08:16:21 -0700

>  So I look at the
> freakin' washer and there ain't no freakin' "ring cycle" anywhere.


Loren, you spelled it wrong... it's "wring" cycle.  Ya need to go look out
there on yer front porch (by the refigator and davenport up on blocks) and
sees if you gots one of them fancy warshing machines with the wringer on
top.  I reckon.

    -- Jeb Ares
www.hevanet.com/acreative


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 10:05:04 -0500
From: Fred Fisher <fwfisher [at] wisc.edu>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
In-reply-to: <list-3541613 [at] prxy.net>
Message-id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040602100008.00bb7ac8 [at] wiscmail.wisc.edu>
References: <list-3536409 [at] prxy.net>


>
>
>     What I don't understand is why Disney had the rights in the first place.
>Everyone knows Moor's politics. If Disney doesn't like them, why did they
>get involved in the first place??
>
>Bruce
>--
>Bruce Purdy
>Technical Director
>Smith Opera House



  Miramax , a subsidiary of Disney, financed the movie.   They have enough 
independence to produce what movies they want to and Disney gets to 
distribute them.   Given that the movie won the Palm d'Or  at Cannes, I 
expect it will get a distributor soon.  I know we will see it as a family 
and I'm sure we'll show it here when the students get back in the fall.
Fred 


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 10:09:05 -0500
From: Fred Fisher <fwfisher [at] wisc.edu>
Subject: Re: Sex drugs and Opera/ food for thought
In-reply-to: <list-3541331 [at] prxy.net>
Message-id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040602100632.01fee608 [at] wiscmail.wisc.edu>


>Richard Neiderlander wrote:
>Yes, Peter Townsend is a 'poet of the theatre'; a Rock Opera is still an
>Opera...
>
> > See me, feel me, touch me, heal me.
> > Good ol' Tommy
> > Mike Rock

The movie "A Nightmare Before Christmas" is also an opera.
Fred 


------------------------------

In-Reply-To: <list-3541314 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3541314 [at] prxy.net>
Message-Id: <EAF8A2FB-B4A8-11D8-8661-000A95EE4F20 [at] tany.com>
Cc: Herrick [at] hglightingdesign.com (Herrick Goldman)
From: Brian Aldous <brian [at] tany.com>
Subject: Re: Microvision disks? 
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 11:24:19 -0400

OK, yes, it was fun watching the house techs light up when I showed 
them that all sorts of programming they wanted to do but didn't know 
how could be done if they used the GOLD key.

Where are you exactly?  Would I be out of line if I just sent you half 
a dozen DD disks for your very own?

BA


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 11:38:03 -0400
Subject: Re: Automated Rigging (was Re: Automation Grenade ... careful
 ..)
From: Bruce Purdy <bpurdy [at] rochester.rr.com>
Message-ID: <BCE36C9A.3695%bpurdy [at] rochester.rr.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3544357 [at] prxy.net>

> but the truly 
> great thing is that we do this, here on the list and everyday at our jobs.  We
> have ideas and then look for ways to realize them.  We create problems and
> then 
> solve them.  And we have some fun along the way.  What else could you ask for?

    Well said Bill, except ......

    We "Create" problems? Identify problems - yes, but I for one try not to
create problems! : )

Bruce
-- 
Bruce Purdy
Technical Director
Smith Opera House



------------------------------

Message-ID: <20040602154733.44192.qmail [at] web50609.mail.yahoo.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 08:47:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: b Ricie <b_ricie [at] yahoo.com>
Subject: Guinness Arbor
In-Reply-To: <list-3544357 [at] prxy.net>

As I stated, the "Liquid" arbor has been floating
around my head for a while, as well as each time I
have to make a trek to a loading rail. Another added
benefit to a dense liquid arbor would be the ability
to change the weight in the arbor as the weight on the
pipe changes. No more having to run the legs in order
to build enough steam to land them. Gosh, I am sure
you could throw a computer into the mix that was told
to keep the arbor in perfect balance at all times.
Yes, I am aware that would take work away from a human
and give a job to a machine, but seeing how it is now,
I would be happy to give up that part of my work.

=====
Brian Rice 
b_ricie [at] yahoo.com


	
		
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Friends.  Fun.  Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger.
http://messenger.yahoo.com/ 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 11:51:17 -0400
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging - terminations
From: Bruce Purdy <bpurdy [at] rochester.rr.com>
Message-ID: <BCE36FB5.3696%bpurdy [at] rochester.rr.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3544357 [at] prxy.net>

> Sam's right.  When you replace a thimble with a larger diameter object like a
> pipe, placing a sleeve right down on top of the pipe is no good.  The cable
> coming into the sleeve comes in at a severe angle and side loads the sleeve.
> Less holding capacity.
> 
> IMHO, a trim chain or batten clamp is the way to go.

    Now I understand that the context of this conversation is attaching  the
batten to the fly lines, but what about attaching scenery to the batten?

    The way I've always done it, and seen it done by others, is to wrap the
wire rope around the batten and attach a pair of cable clamps. (Thimbles are
used on the bottom end where it attaches to the plate on the scenery.)

    Do others use chain or baton clamps for hanging scenery as well?

Bruce
-- 
Bruce Purdy
Technical Director
Smith Opera House



------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 11:59:28 -0400
From: Steve Bailey <sbmtbike [at] optonline.net>
Subject: Re: MicroVision Disks
Message-id: <003e01c448ba$95ca5a40$6401a8c0 [at] computer>
References: <list-3545041 [at] prxy.net>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Larson"

> This thread has gone on long enough, already.  Can't
> someone just dig into the old box in storage and pull
> out a half dozen of the DSDD disks and send them to
> whomever wants it.  I know I've got a box of old disks
> that I've never thrown away.

Taken care of.

Herrick's borrowing my un-used MVFX, complete with whatever blank DSDD disks
I still have (half dozen or so). Should see him fine

Steve B.
Brooklyn College



------------------------------

In-Reply-To: <list-3544357 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3544357 [at] prxy.net>
Message-Id: <F66FDF90-B4AE-11D8-8661-000A95EE4F20 [at] tany.com>
From: Brian Aldous <brian [at] tany.com>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;) 
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 12:07:35 -0400

There's been plenty of reportage on this story - just the sort of 
publicity money can't buy for Michael Moore.

Disney owns Miramax.  Refusing to distribute a film which Eisner (head 
of Disney) warned Weinstein (the head of Miramax) that he didn't want 
to fund well in advance, and which the Miramax division went ahead with 
anyway, is well within Disney's rights.  If someone is paying you to 
produce content, and you make something they don't like, then you made 
the mistake, and it doesn't matter if you are Michael Moore and your 
funder is Disney or you are Michelangelo and your funder is Pope 
Julius.

When it becomes censorship is when an external power or group which 
didn't fund your work (typically but not necessarily the government) 
quashes your work or keeps your opinion from being heard in the public 
forum.  When a congressman ignorant of art punishes a museum or theatre 
for displaying something that that congressman's campaign donors 
mightn't like  (forgetting that tax money comes from ALL of us 
'murricans), that too is censorship.

It's all about who pays the bills.

BTW, I rather like Moore & want to see his film.  Remember his "John's 
of Justice" routine on TV?  Bringing a truckload of portajons to places 
- a Broadway Theatre included - where the line for the Ladies room was 
longer than the line for the Mens?

BA


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 12:10:28 -0400
Subject: Re: Microvision disks?  (boy what a fun list)
From: Herrick <Herrick [at] hglightingdesign.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3545919 [at] prxy.net>
Message-Id: <5D8CFB63-B4AF-11D8-9919-0003934521EC [at] hglightingdesign.com>

OK stop already! At this point I'll be the worlds largest clearing 
house for DS/DD disks!!

Steve Larson may be mailing me some. Voytko is in the East Village (I 
may drive by tomorrow) with a few, and Aldous if you are in the office 
tomorrow I'll stop by to say hi anyway.

For reference I am not incapable of sourcing these disks on my own. I 
was just trying to find out which disks I need. (I will however take 
all donations)

Also since the rest of the gang should be recognized. I'm going to 
request that Cape Rep Theatre put special thanks in the program to 
Stagecraft.

Due to the response to the 3 questions I have posted for my production 
of "Glass Menagerie" I have or will have received the generous help and 
loans of:

1. Strand BP "Followspot" (a la Les Mis)

1. Microvison with working capacitor for hard memory

Multiple offers of DS/DD disks

an offer of storage space should I not be in town to pick up said BP 
spotlight.

an offer of pick up, delivery, and return for repair of my original 
microvision's capacitor.

beyond all that i have a great excuse to meet a few folks i've never 
met before and to go visit some folks I haven't seen in awhile.

Thanks go out to the following generous folks:

Steve Litterst

Steve Bailey

Steve Larson

(what's with the helpful Steve's?)

Ken Romaine

Andrew Nikel

Sara Clausen

Aaron Meadow

The afore mentioned Voytko and Aldous.

FWIW It sounds like I have a few spare rooms on Cape Cod for about 10 
days starting next Monday. Come visit and bring a wrench. :)

I gotta start asking for better gear..I wonder what else we could get. 
Anyone have any Space Cannons lying around? My AD is wrestling with 
procuring "Magic Lantern" projections. How about a Catalyst?(kidding 
i'm kidding..we don't have the room)

Thanks Y'all

_H


On Wednesday, Jun 2, 2004, at 11:24 America/New_York, Brian Aldous 
wrote:

>
> Where are you exactly?  Would I be out of line if I just sent you half 
> a dozen DD disks for your very own?
>
> BA
>
>
>
Herrick Goldman
Lighting Designer, NYC
www.HGLightingDesign.com

"To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and 
in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS


------------------------------

From: IAEG [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <92.c77c816.2def5913 [at] aol.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 12:23:47 EDT
Subject: Re: Microvision disks?  (boy what a fun list)


In a message dated 6/2/04 9:12:44 AM, Herrick [at] hglightingdesign.com writes:

<< FWIW It sounds like I have a few spare rooms on Cape Cod for about 10 
days starting next Monday. Come visit and bring a wrench >>


a wrench?  or a wench ? 


very best,

Keith Arsenault

IAEG -  International Arts & Entertainment Group 
Tampa, Florida

------------------------------

Message-Id: <p0611040ebce3afa1d7f9 [at] [168.192.123.250]>
In-Reply-To: <list-3546084 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3546084 [at] prxy.net>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 12:27:49 -0400
From: Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging - terminations

At 11:51 AM -0400 6/2/04, Bruce Purdy wrote:

>The way I've always done it, and seen it done by others, is to wrap the
>wire rope around the batten and attach a pair of cable clamps. (Thimbles are
>used on the bottom end where it attaches to the plate on the scenery.)
>
>Do others use chain or baton clamps for hanging scenery as well?

I prefer to use a short (1' or so) piece of rated chain attached to 
the piece's liftline. Wrap the chain around the batten and shackle it 
back to itself.

It's just a system liftline trimchain flipped upside-down.

(or umop-ep!sdn, if you prefer)

((yes, I'm bored today))


-- 
Dave Vick, IATSE #274
   Head Electrician,
   The Wharton Center for Performing Arts at Michigan State University
   <http://www.whartoncenter.com/>

    Carpe Per Diem

------------------------------

From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <21.3f12d3fd.2def5cc3 [at] aol.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 12:39:31 EDT
Subject: Re: Food for thought

In a message dated 02/06/04 01:07:10 GMT Daylight Time, ladesigners [at] juno.com 
writes:

>  Finding out just what is 
>  > obscenity is
>  > another trick altogether.

Like beauty, obscenity is in the eye of the beholder. 

Frank Wood

------------------------------

From: "Sam Fisher" <Sam [at] FisherTheatrical.com>
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging - terminations
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 12:42:56 -0400
In-Reply-To: <list-3546324 [at] prxy.net>
Message-ID: <auto-000003546408 [at] prxy.net>



"I prefer to use a short (1' or so) piece of rated chain attached to 
the piece's liftline. Wrap the chain around the batten and shackle it 
back to itself."

Dave Vick, IATSE #274

I'm assuming that should have read (around the batten and shackle it back to
the thimble of the liftline.) Side loading a chain link is bad.

Sam Fisher



------------------------------

Message-Id: <p06110414bce3b43eeca7 [at] [168.192.123.250]>
In-Reply-To: <list-3546324 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3546084 [at] prxy.net> <list-3546324 [at] prxy.net>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 12:44:02 -0400
From: Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging - terminations

At 12:27 PM -0400 6/2/04, Rigger wrote:

>I prefer to use a short (1' or so) piece of rated chain


Make that 18"-2' or so.

-- 
Dave Vick, IATSE #274
   Head Electrician,
   The Wharton Center for Performing Arts at Michigan State University
   <http://www.whartoncenter.com/>

    Carpe Per Diem

------------------------------

From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <a9.59372564.2def621b [at] aol.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 13:02:19 EDT
Subject: Re: Rings (was: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;) )

In a message dated 02/06/04 01:07:12 GMT Daylight Time, ladesigners [at] juno.com 
writes:

>  How True! The season patron pays a small fortune each year to be assured
>  that the company can and will provide them with the finest operatic
>  entertainment, no matter what 'Guest Artists' are jobbed in to sing the
>  lead(s). Grand Opera's closest cousin is the huge Vegas 'Production
>  Show'.

The trouble with casting opera, worldwide, is that, in a major house such as 
the Met, Covent Garden, La Scala, or Vienna, you have to cast singers who are 
known to sing the roles well. Not just adequately, but well. In "La Fille du 
Regiment", for example, you need a tenor who can reliably hit a torrent of high 
Cs. In a performance with Sutherland, that was where Pavarotti made his name. 
But such singers need booked years ahead.

Most German cities run to an Opera House, and many French ones. Some recruit 
international stars, but most make do with what they have available, importing 
others as they need, and adjusting their programmes. All are competent, but 
there's a big gap between that and being great.
 

Frank Wood

------------------------------

From: "William Knapp" <will [at] thebase.com>
Subject: Overhead, overlong
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 13:17:36 -0400
Message-ID: <NIEDJHENHPAHOKCLDGKOEEECFGAA.will [at] thebase.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3536409 [at] prxy.net>

OOf, sorry to prolong this pissing contest, but.

My rigging is 1000% safe (you somehow believe that I do not have that
capability to make that determination) just the manner of manufacture
differs from local standards. So I'm going to show the locals my rigging and
put the onus on them to determine that it is not up to local standards. If
they do so and if it's in the contract that the costs to re-rig are mine so
be it. I'm not going to go out of my way to spend thousands of pounds to
remake a system that's already safe until I have to. It's a subtlety in
handling the situation.

A similar example, however trickier, is fireproofing. Everywhere one goes
one has to meet local fire-proofing regulations. They are usually very
specific about types of retardants, application etc. I get the goods treated
at home and carry New York fireproofing certificates for all the fabric
goods, all that does is say that they meet NYC standards. I also have
several drops made by Gerriets that are Opera plastics or other space age
materials that are inherently fire-retardant, Gerriets USA doesn't have
English spec sheets on the make-up/fire-proofness of the drops. I suppose I
could pay a couple of hundred dollars to have someone spray retardant on my
plastics just in order to have a certificate that isn't worth the paper it's
printed on in another country. No, I show up knowing that all my goods are
fireproofed and will pass any test, I work with local fire authorities, let
them cut pieces off the drops for testing if they like. So far I've been
lucky, no one has asked that a piece of scenery be re-fireproofed, but if
they did, so be it I don't have prevailing authority.

The point of my posting was not to call the guys at the Barbican assholes,
they're not. Nor did it make any comment on the reasonableness of UK
standards. I posted my experience to an existing thread: "I went to the UK,
local regulations made me redo my tail downs. They were expensive but of
excellent quality." Since then my production management has been called
"Poor"(tony.miller10 [at] btopenworld.com digest#23 message#30), "arrogant"
(Bsapsis [at] aol.com digest#23 message #37) and sub-third world (see below).
Nice list.

I and everyone I work with are as concerned with safety as anyone. We all
have spotless histories in that regard. Nothing I have written suggests any
different, so I bristle at any suggestion otherwise.

All this thinking about those tail downs have reminded me of an interesting
point. The cables that were remade for us in London were beautiful: perfect
swages, all exactly the same length. But they didn't use thimbles on the
eyes, that wouldn't pass in New York.

Tony, we'll be in your part of the world again this fall: Barbican,
Sheffield, The Lowry, Warwick, Oxford, Brighton, Edinburgh. Please stop by
to inspect the rigging.


Will Knapp
Production Manager
Merce Cunningham Dance Company
55 Bethune St.
New York, NY 10014
212-255-8240 X20
mobile: 646-732-9274
mailto:will [at] thebase.com


> Tony, when you tour to New York City how will exactly will you check on
New
> York Health and Safety rules that pertain to theater? Even with the
internet
> I think you'd have a difficult time.

I work with shows all over the world. Mainly around Europe but at least a
couple of times a year somewhere in a different continent. If I'm going
somewhere I can't get information on local rules and conditions then we must
either make a recce  or bite the bullet and employ someone who can sort it
for us. This is often the case when we take a show to the USA, we will
employ a US based Production Manager.

> The Barbican contract does specify that all rigging must meet local
> regulations. In prep we discussed the probability that our rigging would
not
> pass inspection, but we'd wait until we got there.

So you thought your rigging would fail inspection and you thought you would
wing it and see if you could get away with it. Not rig to the highest common
denominator and the safest standard but wing it and see if you could get
away with it.

 > This production management has done shows in a couple hundred theaters in
> more than 30 countries. There's always something local you didn't
anticipate
> no matter how good your planning. You do what you gotta do, no hard
> feelings. Sometimes when you get to the point that you anticipate there
may
> be a problem, but then again you may just get away with it, you wait for
the
> other party to make it an issue. That's good and practical production
> management.

That is not what I regard as good and practical production management
especially with something as safety critical as rigging. I regard that as
slapdash and have worked with third world touring theatre companies that
couldn't be faulted on their preparation and implementation even though they
are working with tiny budgets and zero backup.

Getting off my high horse now,

Tony Miller.
 Subject: Re: Overhead...
From: Tony Miller <tony.miller10 [at] btopenworld.com>
Message-ID: <BCE15284.468F%tony.miller10 [at] btopenworld.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3532206 [at] prxy.net>

> Tony, when you tour to New York City how will exactly will you check on
New
> York Health and Safety rules that pertain to theater? Even with the
internet
> I think you'd have a difficult time.

I work with shows all over the world. Mainly around Europe but at least a
couple of times a year somewhere in a different continent. If I'm going
somewhere I can't get information on local rules and conditions then we must
either make a recce  or bite the bullet and employ someone who can sort it
for us. This is often the case when we take a show to the USA, we will
employ a US based Production Manager.

> The Barbican contract does specify that all rigging must meet local
> regulations. In prep we discussed the probability that our rigging would
not
> pass inspection, but we'd wait until we got there.

So you thought your rigging would fail inspection and you thought you would
wing it and see if you could get away with it. Not rig to the highest common
denominator and the safest standard but wing it and see if you could get
away with it.

 > This production management has done shows in a couple hundred theaters in
> more than 30 countries. There's always something local you didn't
anticipate
> no matter how good your planning. You do what you gotta do, no hard
> feelings. Sometimes when you get to the point that you anticipate there
may
> be a problem, but then again you may just get away with it, you wait for
the
> other party to make it an issue. That's good and practical production
> management.

That is not what I regard as good and practical production management
especially with something as safety critical as rigging. I regard that as
slapdash and have worked with third world touring theatre companies that
couldn't be faulted on their preparation and implementation even though they
are working with tiny budgets and zero backup.

Getting off my high horse now,

Tony Miller.



------------------------------

Subject: Re: Totally OT: Starship Troopers II (Was: Ring)
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 10:18:50 -0700
Message-ID: <D970C7F47C09C845806F744DA67B21760DF562 [at] mercury.exchange.local>
From: "Michael Finney" <mfinney [at] thinkwelldesign.com>

"Joe Meils" <bipolarber [at] cyberback.com> wrote:

<<You know, it makes me feel really good to know there are so many
passionate fans of science fiction/fantasy/horror on this list. Kinda
makes
up for all the years in high school I was beat up and/or ignored for
reading
all that "weird shit." I walked into a bookstore last weekend, and got
to
talking with the manager.>>=20

Amen!  And by all means support your local small bookseller....here in
LA we lost a wonderful Science Fiction/Fantasy/Horror bookstore called
Dangerous Visions a few years ago, and (as a result) lost a wonderful
resource, gathering place, and "destination" for signings by most any
major (and many minor) genre author you could mention.  They're still
around on-line (www.readsf.com), but it really isn't quite the same.

Hmmm...back to "support your mom and pop stores 'cause they're a unique
resource"....

Michael Finney
Thinkwell Design & Production
mfinney [at] thinkwelldesign.com =20
http://www.thinkwelldesign.com =20


(PS - yep, "Starship Troopers II" is fairly abysmal....almost bad enough
to achieve "B movie" classic status.  But the CGI work is darned good,
and works well on the small screen.  Amazing how much dodgy art
direction you can cover with a few flash CG images and a lot of haze....

------------------------------

From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <ac.597efffe.2def6678 [at] aol.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 13:20:56 EDT
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)

In a message dated 02/06/04 01:07:12 GMT Daylight Time, ladesigners [at] juno.com 
writes:

> Let's not compare Apples (literature) with Oranges (live on stage). The
>  Music alone leads me to prefer stealing rings from the Nibelungen under
>  the Rhine than from the inhabitants of Middle Earth. In fact, I an
>  listening to Valkyries sing in the background as I type this, and I am in
>  Valhalla!

So, oddly enough, am I! But your 'Apples', allow me to create my own 
pictures. Your 'Oranges' interpose the director's vision between me and the work. I 
have often found this unsuccessful. For example, when Hunding returns to his 
house, in a bowler hat, black jacket and striped trousers carrying a briefcase, 
and the next morning fights Siegmund with a broadsword, I find my credulity 
stretched past breaking point.



Frank Wood

------------------------------

From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <6b.2af743c2.2def66e6 [at] aol.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 13:22:46 EDT
Subject: Re: Sex drugs and Opera/ food for thought

In a message dated 02/06/04 01:32:30 GMT Daylight Time, ladesigners [at] juno.com 
writes:

> Yes, Peter Townsend is a 'poet of the theatre'; a Rock Opera is still an
>  Opera...

That is open to question.

Frank Wood

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 13:35:34 -0400
Subject: Re: Microvision disks?  (boy what a fun list)
From: Steve Larson <tiptd [at] theatreinthepark.com>
Message-ID: <BCE38826.428B%tiptd [at] theatreinthepark.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3546195 [at] prxy.net>

Disks are in the mail.

Steve

on 6/2/04 12:10 PM, Herrick at Herrick [at] hglightingdesign.com wrote:

> For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending
> your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at:
> http://stagecraft.theprices.net/
> ---------------------------------------------------
> 
> 
> OK stop already! At this point I'll be the worlds largest clearing
> house for DS/DD disks!!
> 
> Steve Larson may be mailing me some. Voytko is in the East Village (I
> may drive by tomorrow) with a few, and Aldous if you are in the office
> tomorrow I'll stop by to say hi anyway.
> 
> For reference I am not incapable of sourcing these disks on my own. I
> was just trying to find out which disks I need. (I will however take
> all donations)
> 
> Also since the rest of the gang should be recognized. I'm going to
> request that Cape Rep Theatre put special thanks in the program to
> Stagecraft.
> 
> Due to the response to the 3 questions I have posted for my production
> of "Glass Menagerie" I have or will have received the generous help and
> loans of:
> 
> 1. Strand BP "Followspot" (a la Les Mis)
> 
> 1. Microvison with working capacitor for hard memory
> 
> Multiple offers of DS/DD disks
> 
> an offer of storage space should I not be in town to pick up said BP
> spotlight.
> 
> an offer of pick up, delivery, and return for repair of my original
> microvision's capacitor.
> 
> beyond all that i have a great excuse to meet a few folks i've never
> met before and to go visit some folks I haven't seen in awhile.
> 
> Thanks go out to the following generous folks:
> 
> Steve Litterst
> 
> Steve Bailey
> 
> Steve Larson
> 
> (what's with the helpful Steve's?)
> 
> Ken Romaine
> 
> Andrew Nikel
> 
> Sara Clausen
> 
> Aaron Meadow
> 
> The afore mentioned Voytko and Aldous.
> 
> FWIW It sounds like I have a few spare rooms on Cape Cod for about 10
> days starting next Monday. Come visit and bring a wrench. :)
> 
> I gotta start asking for better gear..I wonder what else we could get.
> Anyone have any Space Cannons lying around? My AD is wrestling with
> procuring "Magic Lantern" projections. How about a Catalyst?(kidding
> i'm kidding..we don't have the room)
> 
> Thanks Y'all
> 
> _H
> 
> 
> On Wednesday, Jun 2, 2004, at 11:24 America/New_York, Brian Aldous
> wrote:
> 
>> 
>> Where are you exactly?  Would I be out of line if I just sent you half
>> a dozen DD disks for your very own?
>> 
>> BA
>> 
>> 
>> 
> Herrick Goldman
> Lighting Designer, NYC
> www.HGLightingDesign.com
> 
> "To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and
> in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS
> 
> 
> 


------------------------------

From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <103.4747622b.2def6ee0 [at] aol.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 13:56:48 EDT
Subject: Re: Welcome back Frank

In a message dated 02/06/04 06:18:51 GMT Daylight Time, 
lschreib [at] mail.sdsu.edu writes:

> Yo,
>  
>  Frank! Mah man! Cool to have you back.

Thanks for the welcome.

 Uh huh. What you know about 
>  series-wound, universal motors is all $^%$& up! But, hey, nobody's prefect.

Well, not a lot. They didn't turn up often in my end of the world. 
But enough. The starter motor in your car is probably one. Enormous torque at 
low revs, and enormous currents. 300A is not unusual, and that from a 12V 
supply. I have it in my mind that they were also used to power steel rolling 
mills.

Frank Wood

------------------------------

From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <160.303349e4.2def7071 [at] aol.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 14:03:29 EDT
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging

In a message dated 02/06/04 14:37:05 GMT Daylight Time, 
schreinerpd [at] longwood.edu writes:

> 
>  > But I'm REALLY intrigued by the liquid counterweight idea.  Aren't there
>  > some super dense materials that are still a liquid at the range of
>  > temperatures in most theatres?  Guinness? I could have some pretty dense
>  > homebrew ready in four weeks or so.

Yes. Mercury. Liquid, density 13.6,  Also, hazardous.



Frank Wood

------------------------------

Message-ID: <1086199886.40be184ee5b76 [at] webmail.bard.edu>
Date: Wed,  2 Jun 2004 14:11:26 -0400
From: doran [at] bard.edu
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging - terminations
References: <list-3546084 [at] prxy.net>
In-Reply-To: <list-3546084 [at] prxy.net>

Bruce,

Yes.  18"-24" trim chain to 7x19 GAC (connected with a shackle) is our 
preferred method here.  Thimbles, of course, at both ends of the wire rope.  
For finer adjustments, we like to hide a forged jaw/eye turnbuckle within the 
scenery where practical.  Also, if you have to lengthen your trim, doing it in 
wire rope just puts a kink in the GAC somewhere in the standing line where 
the cable clips were initially.

And while we're at it, while a hitch around the pipe with wire rope does 
increase the radius of the turn the wire rope makes, it doesn't provide the 
necessary side support to the cable, allowing the cable to flatten under load.  
This is one of the things a thimble does well.

Just my input,
Andy Champ-Doran
Technical Director
Bard College Departments of Dance and Theater


Quoting Bruce Purdy <bpurdy [at] rochester.rr.com>:
> > Sam's right.  When you replace a thimble with a larger diameter object like
> a
> > pipe, placing a sleeve right down on top of the pipe is no good.  The
> cable
> > coming into the sleeve comes in at a severe angle and side loads the
> sleeve.
> > Less holding capacity.
> > 
> > IMHO, a trim chain or batten clamp is the way to go.

> but what about attaching scenery to the batten?
> 
>     The way I've always done it, and seen it done by others, is to wrap the
> wire rope around the batten and attach a pair of cable clamps. (Thimbles are
> used on the bottom end where it attaches to the plate on the scenery.)
>     Do others use chain or baton clamps for hanging scenery as well?
> Bruce Purdy
> Technical Director
> Smith Opera House




------------------------------

Message-ID: <1086200309.40be19f5e4f3c [at] webmail.bard.edu>
Date: Wed,  2 Jun 2004 14:18:29 -0400
From: doran [at] bard.edu
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
References: <list-3536409 [at] prxy.net> <list-3545861 [at] prxy.net>
In-Reply-To: <list-3545861 [at] prxy.net>

Fred,

My beautiful bride tells me she heard a radio newscast this morning that said 
they now have an American distributor, and the move is scheduled for release 
on June 26.

Let us know what else is heard.
Andy C-D


Quoting Fred Fisher <fwfisher [at] wisc.edu>:

>   Miramax , a subsidiary of Disney, financed the movie.   They have enough 
> independence to produce what movies they want to and Disney gets to 
> distribute them.   Given that the movie won the Palm d'Or  at Cannes, I 
> expect it will get a distributor soon.  I know we will see it as a family 
> and I'm sure we'll show it here when the students get back in the fall.
> Fred 
  



------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20040602105514.0168f118 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 10:55:14
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Rings

>Head and shoulders above practically
>everything put to paper in the past 70 years, IMHO.
>
>As an aside, anyone else here seriously disappointed with the butchering (I
>mean, adapting) that was done in turning it into a screenplay?

HMmmmm... Head and Shoulders above?  Maybe if you're talking about the
shampoo.  J.R. was good, and I loved the book, but there was a lot of
really great stuff written in that huge time period.  Uhm, 'Stranger in a
Strange Land'?  'Hitchhiker's Guide', the five (now six) book trilogy?  And
yeah, if you want your kids to learn anything from Mr. Tolkien, I suggest
you have them read the books.  And I wasn't that dissappointed with the
editing of the film.  It's like telling the LD that you want the floor to
be mirror, but you don't want a buncha bounce.  Some things are more easily
done the short way when you don't have a narrator and are stil trying to
cut the fiolm to three hours.
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20040602110123.0168f118 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 11:01:23
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)

>The whole Faramir thing is my biggest beef.  Especially since I've used
>"Faramir" for an internet handle since about '95.

You're a geek.  The above quoted statement gives it away right up front,
but you confirm it with a blow-by-blow description of how you would
actually have re-edited the films.  Off the cuff, as it were, as if you had
already gone over this in your mind a dozen times.
Look, I'm as geeky as the next guy, but I hide it under a thin veneer of
professional interest and intillectual excercise.  Ya gotta learn to blend,
mah brutha!  ; >
		
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <12f.43116233.2def7926 [at] aol.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 14:40:38 EDT
Subject: Re: Power quality, electrical system specs

In a message dated 02/06/04 16:16:37 GMT Daylight Time, sjh [at] idm.com writes:

> Howdy.
>  
>  I came across a really good article on electrical requirements to keep 
sound 
> clean in stage environments, where computers, lighting dimmers & such all 
> interact.  It's got some guidelines which probably should be part of the 
> requirement specs for any new or upgrade performance space.

I am baffled. I read the article, and got no information from it. OK, your 
eectrical distrubution systems are hidden from me, but three-phaase, whethwer ay 
220V or 440V is not.


Frank Wood

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20040602111057.0168f118 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 11:10:57
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Totally OT:  Starship Troopers II (Was: Ring)

>Speaking of film butchery, I note that they will now add insult to injury by
>releasing "Starship Troopers II" 

Imagine, if you will, the interior of a film makers (read: money guy's)
office:
MG:  So, what do you want?
Technical SpEfx Guys:  We just found a very cool way to do HUGE insects!
MG:  And?
TSG:  Well, we want to make a movie.
MG:  What movie?
TSG:  One with HUGE bugs.
MG:  Which one with HUGE bugs.
TSG:  We don't care, but it'd be better if the bugs were the bad guys, this
software 	makes 'm pretty scary-looking.
MG:  So, you don't know WHICH script you want to do?
TSG:  Uhm, nmo.  Is that a problem?
MG:  Uhm, the bugs are really cool, right?
TSG:  Oh yeah.  REALLY cool.
MG:  Ok, I'll put the marketing guys on it.

While the conversation isn't recorded verbatim, this is basically how
'Stormship Troopers' was born to the big screen.  I wonder what they've
invented this time?
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20040602111237.0168f118 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 11:12:37
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Wal-mart

>You know guys, this bashing of wal-mart is stupid. 
>Wal-mart is the life blood of small town, high school
>theatre.  We get the majority of all of our props,
>paint, music and alot of other stuff for our
>productions there.

The first highs are always free.  The worse the dope is for you, the better
it makes you feel.
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20040602111712.0168f118 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 11:17:12
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)

>I lived with Bakshi's animated version for far too long.

Did that lead you to any of Ralph's earlier works?  While most of his
'Fritz' stuff was a rip-off or Robert Crumb, Robert was way too strange to
do anything with it anyways.  Bakshi and Crumb are probably responsible for
my taste in women more than anyone else on the planet, and some of my
wierder tastes as well...
Oh, and merely knowing who Bakshi is makes you a geek.
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <p06110401bce3d37e3f3c [at] [168.192.123.250]>
In-Reply-To: <list-3547303 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3547303 [at] prxy.net>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 14:58:26 -0400
From: Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
Subject: Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)

At 11:17 AM -0400 6/2/04, CB wrote:

>  Oh, and merely knowing who Bakshi is makes you a geek.


Guilty as charged.

(i own 'wizards' on dvd.)


-- 
Dave Vick, IATSE #274
   Head Electrician,
   The Wharton Center for Performing Arts at Michigan State University
   <http://www.whartoncenter.com/>

    Carpe Per Diem

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20040602113045.0168f118 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 11:30:45
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Re: Powerpoint Background

>Consult Google, under "region 1 DVD format."
>The Reader's Digest version: Nope; incompatible.

HMmmm.. What I found under the search for "region 1 DVD format" only told
me that content of the DVD differed.  I didn't see anything about format
and output.
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 15:07:05 -0400
Subject: Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)
From: Herrick <Herrick [at] hglightingdesign.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3547303 [at] prxy.net>
Message-Id: <09AB5966-B4C8-11D8-9919-0003934521EC [at] hglightingdesign.com>

I am NOT a GEEK! I am LoTGs (Lord of the GEEKS!)

Yes I am particularly fond of Bakshi's "wizards"  but you probably even 
know my favorite quote from it anyway.


On Wednesday, Jun 2, 2004, at 11:17 America/New_York, CB wrote:
>
> Oh, and merely knowing who Bakshi is makes you a geek.
> 		
Herrick Goldman
Lighting Designer, NYC
www.HGLightingDesign.com

"To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and 
in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS

also

"Do not meddle in the affairs of Wizards for the are subtle and quick 
to anger"


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 15:07:41 -0400
Subject: Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)
From: Herrick <Herrick [at] hglightingdesign.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-3547393 [at] prxy.net>
Message-Id: <1ED2AAB7-B4C8-11D8-9919-0003934521EC [at] hglightingdesign.com>

wait ..it's out on DVD? !!!!

cool ..ok you win.

On Wednesday, Jun 2, 2004, at 14:58 America/New_York, Rigger wrote:
>
>
> (i own 'wizards' on dvd.)
>
>
>
Herrick Goldman
Lighting Designer, NYC
www.HGLightingDesign.com

"To the scores of silent alchemists who wreak their joy in darkness and 
in light bringing magic to life, we bow most humbly. "-CDS


------------------------------

Message-ID: <1086203513.40be26794f7b1 [at] webmail.bard.edu>
Date: Wed,  2 Jun 2004 15:11:53 -0400
From: doran [at] bard.edu
Subject: Re: Counterweight Rigging
References: <list-3542684 [at] prxy.net>
In-Reply-To: <list-3542684 [at] prxy.net>

Kevin,

Go down to the US Air Force Academy's Arnold Hall in Colorado Springs.  Ask 
them what happened in about '87 or '88 when their projection screen rigging 
failed.  If anyone is around that remembers, you'll find a combination of 
causes, but a chain hoist hooked up to the bottom of the arbor enabled that 
thing get well out of weight, pipe-heavy by more than 500 lbs. for sure.  The 
arbor only travelled up a short distance, but the results were catastrophic 
whan that brake caught the runaway.  Fortunately, spreader plates were in 
place to keep the weights captured.  No serious injuries to people, but the 
percussion insturments took quite a beating, so to speak.

Andy Champ-Doran


Quoting Kevin Patrick <patrick_kevin [at] colstate.edu>:

 I've never seen it, but
> how often does an arbor fly up uncontrollably?  It's pretty difficult to
> accidentally add #500 to a pipe when it's gridded.
> Kevin Patrick
> Theatre.colstate.edu


------------------------------

Message-ID: <3537.207.201.197.75.1086205825.squirrel [at] webmail.columbia.sc>
In-Reply-To: <list-3545610 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3536409 [at] prxy.net> <list-3545610 [at] prxy.net>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 15:50:25 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Automation Grenade
From: usctd [at] columbia.sc

Obviously I can't speak for every show either.  My point was not to point
out a lax nature regarding safety.  My point was that with large
automation shows there is a very good oportunity for very bad things to
happen no matter how well prepared you may be.

And we have all been there.  No matter what everyone may say, after you do
a show a couple hundred times eyes and thoughts tend to wander in and out
of focus.

By the way, you described the exact scenario I advocated in my mailing
regarding automation effects safety.

-- 
Eric Rouse
TD-University of SC, Columbia
Freelance Foyboy

> For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending
> your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at:
>    http://stagecraft.theprices.net/
> ---------------------------------------------------
>
>
>> > Many times the eyes that should be watching stuff move are
>> > occupied doing other things or have been lulled into a false sense of
>> > security because it has worked 500 times in a row uneventfully.
>
> And how many times have you seen a technician onstage either pushing a
> wagon or pulling a
> counterweight line while looking for a spike mark instead of watching
> stage for errant actors and
> such?
>
>> Sorry I was not clear.  I was talking about the permanent type shows
>> that
>> we are seeing in Florida and Vegas, for example.  Obviously tours are a
>> different story.  But then they don't have 100 winches in the show
>> either.
>
> I certainly can't speak for every "permanent type show" in Florida but
> speaking for the show I
> currently find myself working with at one of the Theme Parks here in
> Orlando I must take exception
> to the implication that we are lax in our attention to safety.  Yes the
> Show Control Operator is
> in the control booth at the back of the house but onstage, next to every
> automated effect and with
> direct access to an E-Stop there is one and in some cases two technicians
> tasked monitoring the
> automation.  That is in addition to the E-Stops at the Show Control and
> the Stage Manager's
> positions in the booth who are watching the show live onstage and on video
> monitors with infrared
> cameras for monitoring during blackouts.  Each and every day we run a
> Global E-Stop test and a
> Test Show without performers or light cues to test the automation systems
> in full light to make
> sure everything is working properly.
>
> Let's not forget that ANY mechanical effect, whether operated manually or
> via automation can be
> dangerous.  We use automation for those parts of the show that must sync
> with the soundtrack or
> that would be too complicated or dangerous to operate manually.
> Unsynchronized effects,
> especially those which interact with the performers, are manually
> operated.  Both have their
> place.
>
> Jason Tollefson
> LD-at-Large (and Theme Park Technician)
> Orlando, FL
> www.tollefsondesigns.com
>
>
>


------------------------------

Message-ID: <002801c448d5$97c46140$0201a8c0 [at] BRUTUS>
From: "Jon Ares" <jonares [at] hevanet.com>
References: <list-3547406 [at] prxy.net>
Subject: Re: Powerpoint Background
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 12:12:47 -0700

>
> HMmmm.. What I found under the search for "region 1 DVD format" only told
> me that content of the DVD differed.  I didn't see anything about format
> and output.

I figured someone else might have noted this, and maybe someone did...   if
you manufacture your own DVD, you have the ability to make it
"region-free" - so it's not limited to playing on a restricted player.

Many (but certainly not all) DVD players sold in Europe will play NTSC as
well as PAL video, but you'd have to check with each and every household
your video might be shown.  (Some do SECAM and PAL, but not NTSC.)

 -- Jon Ares
www.hevanet.com/acreative


------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20040602114327.0168f118 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 11:43:27
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Re: Food for thought

>A US Supreme Court justice stated that he doesn't know what obscenity is,
>either, but he did say that "he knows it when he sees it". <g>

Yeah, that's the tricky part I referred too.  When asked what kind of music
they like, lots of folk will say that they don't know how to quaintify it,
but they know what they like when they hear it.  My old partner in
'Interplanetary Productions'  (the driving force behind the grinning planet
blowing raspberries and the frindly 'Don't Panic' on our business cards)
used to accurately sum up why they didn't accept new, original tunes, ,
"They don't know what they like, but they'll like what they hear when they
know it."
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <p06110400bce3d9048abf [at] [168.192.123.250]>
In-Reply-To: <list-3547460 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3547460 [at] prxy.net>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 15:21:01 -0400
From: Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
Subject: Re: Rings (warning:  almost completely OT)

At 3:07 PM -0400 6/2/04, Herrick wrote:

>  wait ..it's out on DVD? !!!!


Welcome to the year 2000, Herrick.

-- 
Dave Vick, IATSE #274
   Head Electrician,
   The Wharton Center for Performing Arts at Michigan State University
   <http://www.whartoncenter.com/>

    Carpe Per Diem

------------------------------

Message-ID: <CAAA0A148189D311A7640050DA5F8F110691984B [at] es.bsdnet.wednet.edu>
From: "Storms, Randy" <rstorms [at] bham.wednet.edu>
Subject: Re: Totally OT:  Starship Troopers II (Was: Ring)
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 12:31:45 -0700 

Christopher Weuve, who apparently has *lots* of free time to think about
Heinlein, wrote a fairly cogent thesis about the novel versus the movie. 

http://www.kentaurus.com/troopers.htm#about

Cheers,

-- r.

Randy Storms
rstorms [at] bham.wednet.edu

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20040602115914.0168f118 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 11:59:14
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)

>the artists themselves were shunned
>- not for their product - their songs - but purely personal issues.

Uhm, that's "political issues".  It wasn't like CC didn't like their
clothes or their hairstyles.  The didn't like their political statement.
Period.  And whether or not you agree with their legal right to do this, it
does show their feelings about the constitution and the rights that tehy
feel humans should have, and all, don't it.  Just because it's LEGAL don't
maek it right.

>    What I don't understand is why Disney had the rights in the first place.
>Everyone knows Moor's politics. If Disney doesn't like them, why did they
>get involved in the first place??

Two (of all the) possible reasons:  
1.  	The Rat thought that he'd be able to stifle MM's 911F from the
beginning.  It 	was all part of his evil plan. 
2. 	The Rat was so blinded by the potential profits he temporarily lost
sight oif his 	underlying political motivations, and bought the film in a
greed-head lust 	frenzy.

It's Disney.  Imagine the darkest, most reviled reason that you can think
of why they do anything, and you're probably not too far off.  BTW< MM's
movie DID get sold and will be released today or tomorrow-ish.
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20040602122116.0168f118 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 12:21:16
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)

>Sounds like political statements.
>Do artists now have an entitlement to access any venue they choose?

My point is that these artists already had access to these venues, as long
as they made their corporate daddies good money and didn't act up.  As soon
as they made political statements that they believed in, their access was
denied.  Denied due to, and only to, expressed political reasons.   The US
constitution and Amnesty International (just to name a couple) believe that
humans must be able to express themselves politically to be free.  Disney
and Clear Channel believe that this right extends making them money without
disagreeing with their political (read: financial) agenda.  This is wrong,
even if it isn't illegal.  It is censorship, even if it isn't LEGALLY
censorship.
Its bad, and it threatens us at the very basic core of who we are, and what
we do.
You're either part of the problem or part of the solution, and if you want
to choose which side you want to be on based on available perks, you really
can't complain when you find yourself up against the wall trying to peek
around the blindfold.
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20040602123221.0168f118 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 12:32:21
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)

>The logical conclusion of what you're saying is that, if you invest
>your own private money in a performers' act, you are forever obligated
>to continue to invest YOUR money in them

Sigh... If you don't see it coming, you can pretend that your still safe
and happy...
No, the logical conclusion would be that corporations are taking a hard
line on money.  Personal rights, human rights, persons and humans are all
taking a back seat to how much money they can make.  It isn't a good thing.
 It's a bad thing.  The things I've posted about are examples of an
ideology, not crimes (Hey, didn't I say that, like, forurteen times?)

Just for more clarification:
IT AIN"T ABOUT THE LAW, HERE, PEOPLE.  ITS ABOUT WHAT'S RIGHT.

OK, now that we've gotten over that, tell me how society at large benefit
from the aforementioned actions by Disney, Clear Channel, et al.
I have taken these actions and pointed out potential peril, and all I have
received in return was head-in-the-sand denials of any wrong-doing.
Legally, wrong, that is.



				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <6.1.1.1.0.20040602125217.02627c28 [at] localhost>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 13:04:35 -0700
From: Jerry Durand <jdurand [at] interstellar.com>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
In-Reply-To: <list-3545090 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3543464 [at] prxy.net>
 <list-3545090 [at] prxy.net>

At 06:08 AM 6/2/2004, you wrote:
> > infringing on a right that actually does get mentioned by name in the
> > Constitution. Are you?
>
>I gather you are referring to the right to bear arms, written when guns were
>muzzle loaded, single shot awkward suckers ;-)

Not to start an arms race (I'm a pyro so I appreciate things that go bang 
and the BATFE has my photo and fingerprints on file) but...

The constitution says "the people" have the right to bear arms.  At the 
time there were militia type groups and there has been some debate over the 
years if what they really meant was it is ok for gropups like the National 
Guard to bear arms.  The constitution never mentions INDIVIDUAL people 
having this right.

I also wonder why it's ok to have 50 pounds of black powder stored under 
your bed in an apartment building as long as you own a black powder gun, 
canon, or shooting anvil, but it's a felony to have one molecule of black 
powder outside of a magazine if you don't have a gun, canon, or anvil.


----------
Jerry Durand
Durand Interstellar, Inc.
219 Oak Wood Way
Los Gatos, California 95032-2523  USA
tel:  +1 408 356-3886
fax:  +1 408 356-4659
web:  www.interstellar.com



------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20040602123540.0168f118 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 12:35:40
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)

>I believe that Disney had only 'first refusal' rights to distribute films
>under their deal with Miramax

I ain't no lawyer, but why would Mike have to sue (or threaten to sue) if
Disney on had rights to 'first refusal'.  Might be legalese, but I would
guess that first refusal means that Mike is free to have the movie released
elsewhere if Disney chooses not to.  Mike had to get all legal on their
asses to get the movie released.  Is there a legal definition of 'first
refusal' that I'm not familiar with?
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <p06110403bce3e5cb8959 [at] [168.192.123.250]>
In-Reply-To: <list-3547823 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3543464 [at] prxy.net> <list-3545090 [at] prxy.net>
 <list-3547823 [at] prxy.net>
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 16:18:56 -0400
From: Rigger <rigger [at] tds.net>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)

At 1:04 PM -0700 6/2/04, Jerry Durand wrote:

>  The constitution says "the people" have the right to bear arms.
>  At the time there were militia type groups and there has been
>  some debate over the years if what they really meant was it is
>  ok for gropups like the National Guard to bear arms.  The
>  constitution never mentions INDIVIDUAL people having this right.


For your information, the courts in several jurisdictions have 
recently ruled otherwise; that the right to bear arms is in fact an 
individual right.

I suggest respectfully that we drop the 2nd Amendment debate from 
this thread; it's a topic that you do *not* want to get me wound up 
on, trust me.

-- 
Dave Vick, IATSE #274
   Head Electrician,
   The Wharton Center for Performing Arts at Michigan State University
   <http://www.whartoncenter.com/>

    Carpe Per Diem

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2004 21:47:33 +0100 (BST)
From: Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
In-Reply-To: <list-3547931 [at] prxy.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.50.0406022145360.11124-100000 [at] midi>
References: <list-3543464 [at] prxy.net> <list-3545090 [at] prxy.net> <list-3547823 [at] prxy.net>
 <list-3547931 [at] prxy.net>

On Wed, 2 Jun 2004, Rigger wrote:

> I suggest respectfully that we drop the 2nd Amendment debate from 
> this thread; it's a topic that you do *not* want to get me wound up 
> on, trust me.

I do agree it's become OT and this isn't really the best list to discuss it ;-)

But, really, do we ALL have to do what you want just because your mainspring is 
wound too tightly? ;-)

Charlie

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Message-Id: <6.1.1.1.0.20040602134058.02781318 [at] localhost>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 13:49:42 -0700
From: Jerry Durand <jdurand [at] interstellar.com>
Subject: Re: Guinness Arbor
In-Reply-To: <list-3546054 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3544357 [at] prxy.net>
 <list-3546054 [at] prxy.net>

At 08:47 AM 6/2/2004, you wrote:
>As I stated, the "Liquid" arbor has been floating
>around my head for a while, as well as each time I
>have to make a trek to a loading rail. Another added
>benefit to a dense liquid arbor would be the ability
>to change the weight in the arbor as the weight on the
>pipe changes. No more having to run the legs in order
>to build enough steam to land them. Gosh, I am sure
>you could throw a computer into the mix that was told
>to keep the arbor in perfect balance at all times.
>Yes, I am aware that would take work away from a human
>and give a job to a machine, but seeing how it is now,
>I would be happy to give up that part of my work.

You could also use a hydraulic cylinder in a multi-purchase system (the 
cylinder goes between the floor and the lower block).  Set it up like an 
elevator, the output orifice is so small that a broken hose only leads to a 
controlled descent.  Use two or more sets of cables and you have a safe 
system, even if a cable broke.  You could still add some counterweight like 
elevators have, just to help.  The fluid could be water, that was used for 
elevators and car crushers for a long time.

Another possibility would be a dual winch with a speed brake on it (again 
taking from elevators, if the RPMs are too high or the motor loses power, a 
brake engages).  Of course each of the two cables should be able to hold 
all the load with a good safety factor.

Of course these would both have an e-stop button on both sides of the 
stage, in the booth, and any place else that seemed reasonable.


----------
Jerry Durand
Durand Interstellar, Inc.
219 Oak Wood Way
Los Gatos, California 95032-2523  USA
tel:  +1 408 356-3886
fax:  +1 408 356-4659
web:  www.interstellar.com



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Message-Id: <6.1.1.1.0.20040602141925.02628ff0 [at] localhost>
Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2004 14:30:21 -0700
From: Jerry Durand <jdurand [at] interstellar.com>
Subject: Re: Food for thought... discuss as you please. ;)
In-Reply-To: <list-3547931 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-3543464 [at] prxy.net>
 <list-3545090 [at] prxy.net>
 <list-3547823 [at] prxy.net>
 <list-3547931 [at] prxy.net>

At 01:18 PM 6/2/2004, you wrote:

>I suggest respectfully that we drop the 2nd Amendment debate from this 
>thread; it's a topic that you do *not* want to get me wound up on, trust me.


No problem dropping the 2nd amendment argument since as I said I'm not 
against it in the first place.

Something that IS theater related is us pyros trying to be legal while the 
BATFE makes more and more stuff illegal (while at the same time saying that 
a gun owner can safely store all his ammo and powder in a home).  In a 
recent court case the government said according to their new definitions 
that self-lighting charcoal is an explosive and you need a magazine to keep 
it in.  They also added "anything that can be made to explode" as a 
regulated explosive now (which you need permits and a magazine for).  Under 
the current rules anyone in this country can be arrested, if they feel like it.

My wife and I are still working on our operator's permits for California 
and still own part of the Rocket Ranch, but it sure is a pain at 
times.  Hopefully pyro isn't totally banned as a terrorist activity.


----------
Jerry Durand
Durand Interstellar, Inc.
219 Oak Wood Way
Los Gatos, California 95032-2523  USA
tel:  +1 408 356-3886
fax:  +1 408 356-4659
web:  www.interstellar.com



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End of Stagecraft Digest #27
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