Return-Path: X-Processed-By: Virex 7 on prxy.net X-Real-To: stagecraftlist [at] theatrical.net Received: by prxy.net (CommuniGate Pro PIPE 4.2) with PIPE id 4625171; Sat, 09 Oct 2004 03:01:13 -0700 X-ListServer: CommuniGate Pro LIST 4.2 List-Unsubscribe: List-ID: Message-ID: From: "Stagecraft" Sender: "Stagecraft" To: "Stagecraft" Precedence: list Subject: Stagecraft Digest #157 Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 03:00:49 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.2 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,AWL,BAYES_00, BIZ_TLD,DIET_1,DIET_2,MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR autolearn=ham version=3.0.0-pre4 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.0-pre4 (2004-08-04) on prxy.net X-prxy-Spam-Filter: Scanned X-TFF-CGPSA-Version: 1.4a3 For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- Stagecraft Digest, Issue #157 1. Dry Ice Storage by "Tony Deeming" 2. Re: Batten Clamps (mea culpa) by "Scheu Consulting Services" 3. Rechargable Batteries by "Jonathan Wills" 4. Re: What rental item disappointed you most? by Barney Simon 5. Re: What rental item disappointed you most? by howie 6. Re: What rental item disappointed you most? by IAEG [at] aol.com 7. Re: Batten Clamps (mea culpa) by Bsapsis [at] aol.com 8. Re: Batten Clamps (mea culpa) by Stephen Litterst 9. Re: LDI by "Ken Romaine" 10. State of the art for drop folding? by "Jon Ares" 11. Re: LDI by John McKernon 12. Re: LDI by Richard Niederberg 13. Re: State of the art for drop folding? by John McKernon 14. Re: State of the art for drop folding? by IAEG [at] aol.com 15. AutoCAD programmer by John McKernon 16. Re: plywood: was Steel Prices by StevevETTrn [at] aol.com 17. Re: State of the art for drop folding? by IAEG [at] aol.com 18. Re: Rechargable Batteries by "Paul Schreiner" 19. Re: What rental item disappointed you most? by doran [at] bard.edu 20. Re: Dry Ice Storage by "Kevin Linzey" 21. Re: What rental item disappointed you most? by Steve Larson 22. Re: Rechargable Batteries by "rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" <"rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" [at] mail.wlakemail.com> 23. Re: LDI by "Joe Golden" 24. Light storage by "rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" <"rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" [at] mail.wlakemail.com> 25. Re: Light storage by Greg Persinger 26. Re: Dry Ice Storage by "LES LIND" 27. Re: Light storage by "rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" <"rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" [at] mail.wlakemail.com> 28. Re: Dry Ice Storage by "Tony Deeming" 29. Re: An academic question by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com 30. Re: Light storage by Mark O'Brien 31. Re: Rechargable Batteries by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com 32. Re[2]: What rental item disappointed you most? by "Frank E. Merrill" 33. test by Michael Beyer 34. Re: What rental item disappointed you most? by Barney Simon 35. Re: State of the art for drop folding? by Barney Simon 36. Re: What rental item disappointed you most? by Barney Simon 37. Re: Rechargable Batteries by Greg Bierly 38. Re: State of the art for drop folding? by Greg Bierly 39. Re: Dry Ice Storage by Greg Bierly 40. Re: Dry Ice Storage by Greg Bierly 41. Re: What rental item disappointed you most? by "Tony Deeming" 42. Re: What rental item disappointed you most? by IAEG [at] aol.com 43. Re: State of the art for drop folding? by "Mike Rock" 44. Re: by "Waxler, Steve (waxlers)" 45. Re: by "Waxler, Steve (waxlers)" 46. Re: by Steve Larson 47. Re: What rental item disappointed you most? by Steve Larson 48. Re: Re: by Boyd Ostroff 49. Re: RE: by "Dr. Randall W.A. Davidson" 50. Re: RE: by "Dr. Randall W.A. Davidson" 51. Re: Looking for a Laser by CB 52. Herbal Cigarettes by CB 53. Re: State of the art for drop folding? by Stuart Wheaton 54. What rental item disappointed you most? by CB 55. Re: An academic question by CB 56. Re: An academic question by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com 57. Re: Dry Ice Storage by Stuart Wheaton 58. Re: An academic question by 59. need production staff still? by in a fishbowl 60. Re: by "Delbert Hall" 61. UVa nostalgia (was Re: ) by Boyd Ostroff 62. Re: Dry Ice Storage by "Alf Sauve" 63. Re: Dry Ice Storage by Dale Farmer 64. Re: What rental item disappointed you most? by "John D. Palmer" *** Please update the subject line of your reply to use the subject *** line of the message you are replying to! Please only reply to *** one message subject in each reply. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message-ID: <018501c4ad2d$8cae6730$0a01a8c0 [at] Tony> From: "Tony Deeming" References: Subject: Dry Ice Storage Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 12:54:17 +0100 On the assumption that the Glaciator that I have on loan at present isn't going to be a go-er (which is possible due to the problems with ambient heat we've got!) I now need to look at the options, and of course dry ice is the obvious one. Now - I've used CO2 on and off for 25 years, so don't need any pointers on usage or storage, but what I do need to investigate is a source of suitable storage boxes (at least two) to hold the stuff whilst it awaits use on stage. Our CO2 supplier (Univar) is local so there's minimal transport problems, esp as the show's director lives 5 minutes from their depot, so it's what to store it in at the theatre. The added complication is that the supplier is NOT open at weekends, so for the middle weekend, we have 5 performances (Friday, 2 x Saturday & 2 x Sunday) for the stuff to last, so the boxes have got to be good insulators and preferably portable, too. One option may be to construct a bigger box in which to store the stuff in bulk and use smaller, maybe even domestic cool-boxes, to move it from there to the stage (which actually sounds not unreasonable). So - thoughts from the gang. Any suitable (UK) insulated box suppliers out there? Thanks TD (Now you see why I was considering the Glaciator...?!) copied to rats ------------------------------ From: "Scheu Consulting Services" Subject: Re: Batten Clamps (mea culpa) Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 08:07:47 -0400 Organization: Scheu Consulting Services, Inc. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Oops... The 200 lb RWL for batten clamps I mentioned was for 1/2 clamps. That is, the ones *without* the second bolt beneath the batten. A full pipe clamp, with bolts above and below the batten carry a RWL of 750 lb. But I'm still of the opinion that these should only be used for static, low load applications. Sorry... Peter Scheu Scheu Consulting Services, Inc. www.scheuconsulting.com Tel: 315.422.9984 fax: 413.513.4966 ------------------------------ Message-Id: <200410081217.i98CH8vk029660 [at] smtp-mtc05.proxy.aol.com> From: "Jonathan Wills" Subject: Rechargable Batteries Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 08:17:03 -0400 Organization: Jonathan Wills Hello all, I know this has been discussed in the past, but I can not get the archives to work. I am wondering if anyone uses rechargeable batteries with wireless systems. I have 13 wireless mics and do not want to purchase new batteries every show if rechargeables would work. I am looking for both the pros and cons, battery life and other useful information. If anyone knows of a good vendor to purchase from that may be helpful also. Thank you, Jonathan Wills Wills Lighting and Stage www.WillsLighting.com 423.432.8082 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.771 / Virus Database: 518 - Release Date: 9/28/2004 ------------------------------ Message-ID: <41668BF3.6090309 [at] JosephCHansen.com> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 08:45:39 -0400 From: Barney Simon Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? References: In-Reply-To: Frank E. Merrill wrote: >For Dealers and such: >What item have you for rental by others that has disappointed you the most > I inherited several painted drops when I took over here... about 40; half of them are of a sepia style done in the 1930's, of the balance most have pealing paint. The ones in marginal condition, I'm afraid to rent without warnings... the sepias, while beautiful, are of such a style that a user must have that in mind... I do not have enough other variety to have a lot of choices, so unless the customer's requirements happen to hit, we are out of luck. Not a day goes by that I do not ponder their demise, but have not done anything. Barney JC Hanen Co. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <41668F29.7040902 [at] hillinteractive.net> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 08:59:21 -0400 From: howie Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? References:

In-Reply-To: those old drops might be quite valuable, here in Vermont there are ongoing projects going on in many towns to restore old show curtains and backdrops that have been found in town meetinghouses and theaters. Not many have survived. Call Christy's & see if they'll appraise them... -----------howie Barney Simon wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > Frank E. Merrill wrote: > >> For Dealers and such: >> What item have you for rental by others that has disappointed you the >> most >> > I inherited several painted drops when I took over here... about 40; > half of them are of a sepia style done in the 1930's, of the balance > most have pealing paint. The ones in marginal condition, I'm afraid to > rent without warnings... the sepias, while beautiful, are of such a > style that a user must have that in mind... I do not have enough other > variety to have a lot of choices, so unless the customer's requirements > happen to hit, we are out of luck. Not a day goes by that I do not > ponder their demise, but have not done anything. > > Barney > JC Hanen Co. > > ------------------------------ From: IAEG [at] aol.com Message-ID: <12f.4dc3714c.2e97eac5 [at] aol.com> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 09:06:13 EDT Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? In a message dated 10/8/04 9:00:11 AM, hi [at] hillinteractive.net writes: << those old drops might be quite valuable, here in Vermont there are ongoing projects going on in many towns to restore old show curtains and backdrops that have been found in town meetinghouses and theaters. Not many have survived. Call Christy's & see if they'll appraise them... -----------howie >> there is a huge market in old Carnival Banner Line / Show paintings, , I would imagine that eventually there could be one in vintage theatricals like this as well what restaurant in NYC used to have the Picasso front cloth for the Diaghalev / Massine ballet PARADE hanging in it's foyer ? very best, Keith Arsenault International Arts & Entertainment Group Tampa, FL ------------------------------ From: Bsapsis [at] aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 09:20:28 EDT Subject: Re: Batten Clamps (mea culpa) In a message dated 10/8/04 8:08:45 AM, peter [at] scheuconsulting.com writes: << Oops... The 200 lb RWL for batten clamps I mentioned was for 1/2 clamps. That is, the ones *without* the second bolt beneath the batten. A full pipe clamp, with bolts above and below the batten carry a RWL of 750 lb. But I'm still of the opinion that these should only be used for static, low load applications. >> This is a classic example of the "run with it till it doesn't work" mentality that we love so much in the theatre business. Here we have a device that has been used in, what...elebenty seven theatres around the country and we don't really know what it will hold or for how long. We simply know that it has held so far. Now don't get me wrong, I am not opposed to this philosophy, quite the contrary, but it's really important that we all know, acknowledge and remember that this philosophy is in place. I had another thought on this topic, but I forget what it was. Ah well Bill S. Sapsis Rigging, Inc. www.sapsis-rigging.com 800.727.7471 800.292.3851 fax 267.278.4561 mobile We stand behind, and under, our work. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 09:52:42 -0400 From: Stephen Litterst Subject: Re: Batten Clamps (mea culpa) Message-id: <50112505f3.505f350112 [at] ithaca.edu> ----- Original Message ----- From: Bsapsis [at] aol.com Subject: Re: Batten Clamps (mea culpa) > ---------------------------- > > > In a message dated 10/8/04 8:08:45 AM, peter [at] scheuconsulting.com > writes: > << > Now don't get me wrong, I am not opposed to this philosophy, quite > the > contrary, but it's really important that we all know, acknowledge > and remember that > this philosophy is in place. Precisely the reason I asked the question in the first place. Not only do I want to be sure of the ratings for every component of the system, I want to be able to document it so my students don't pick up the "well, it's always worked" mindset. By the way, thank Mike for helping me out with the beam clamp question and apologize again for thinking he was you. :) Steve L. Stephen Litterst Technical Supervisor Ithaca College, Dept of Theatre Arts 607.274.34947 slitterst [at] ithaca.edu ------------------------------ Subject: Re: LDI Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 06:52:43 -0700 Message-ID: <35418D398577A34FB3A059F99B9F370202E0C58D [at] nigel.tmbworldwide.tmb.com> From: "Ken Romaine" Mr. Golden wrote: "Everyone is welcome to stop at the ELS booth/BAR for a liquid = beverage." And I mention that my new employer, TMB, will also, as usual,=20 have a booth with adult beverages available, although we all=20 know that these are NOT permitted on the show floor. I look forward to seeing those of you that will be in Lost Wages. Note the new contact info below: Ken Romaine Sales TMB New York P: +1-201-541-9292 F: +1-201-541-8448 kr [at] tmb.com=20 ------------------------------ Message-ID: <001b01c4ad43$28dbbd00$0600000a [at] BRUTUS> From: "Jon Ares" References: Subject: State of the art for drop folding? Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 07:29:02 -0700 Last night, we unpacked some painted drops from a vendor, and initially I was excited to show students the proper way to fold/unfold drops, but to our surprise, they were folded in some soft of 'accordian' style - they even included a blurry photocopy of "How to fold a drop" - text is illegible, but the pictures are sufficient. My question is, has this become the 'new' way? Is it no longer preferred to do the half-and-half up to the webbing, then folding to center thing? Obviously these drops need to go back to the vendor they way they specify, but I am wondering if I should be teaching the students a different way.... -- Jon Ares Program Director, West Linn HS Theatre Arts www.hevanet.com/acreative http://www.wlhs.wlwv.k12.or.us/aresj/theatre/index.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 10:30:17 -0400 Subject: Re: LDI From: John McKernon Message-ID: In-Reply-To: > And I mention that my new employer, TMB, will also, as usual, > have a booth with adult beverages available, although we all > know that these are NOT permitted on the show floor. Except at the ED/Lighting Dimensions booth... And the Martin booth, and the TMB booth, and the ELS booth, etc. etc. I'll be in the City Theatrical booth, as usual - which unfortunately doesn't have a bar. Still, I'd love to have friends (and customers) come visit - See you there! - John ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 07:31:34 -0700 Subject: Re: LDI Message-ID: <20041008.073140.684.1.ladesigners [at] juno.com> From: Richard Niederberg Naturally, both ELS and TMB will supply us with their booth numbers, but when? Do we really have to look them up in the thick LDI showguide? /s/ Richard > Mr. Golden wrote: > "Everyone is welcome to stop at the ELS booth/BAR for a liquid > beverage." > And I mention that my new employer, TMB, will also, as usual, > have a booth with adult beverages available, although we all > know that these are NOT permitted on the show floor. > I look forward to seeing those of you that will be in Lost Wages. > Ken Romaine ________________________________________________________________ Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand. Now includes pop-up blocker! Only $14.95/ month - visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 10:34:17 -0400 Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding? From: John McKernon Message-ID: In-Reply-To: > to our > surprise, they were folded in some soft of 'accordian' style - they even > included a blurry photocopy of "How to fold a drop" - text is illegible, but > the pictures are sufficient. My question is, has this become the 'new' way? I certainly hope not! The traditional method produces the most gentle folds possible. Accordion-style folding produces sharp creases that are hell on the paint and almost impossible to get rid of. - John McKernon ------------------------------ From: IAEG [at] aol.com Message-ID: <92.16c8068b.2e980362 [at] aol.com> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 10:51:14 EDT Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding? In a message dated 10/8/04 10:35:28 AM, stagecraft2004 [at] mckernon.com writes: << > to our > surprise, they were folded in some soft of 'accordian' style - they even > included a blurry photocopy of "How to fold a drop" - text is illegible, but > the pictures are sufficient. My question is, has this become the 'new' way? I certainly hope not! The traditional method produces the most gentle folds possible. Accordion-style folding produces sharp creases that are hell on the paint and almost impossible to get rid of. - John McKernon >> very best, Keith Arsenault International Arts & Entertainment Group Tampa, FL ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 10:52:47 -0400 Subject: AutoCAD programmer From: John McKernon Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Dear friends, I'm looking around to hire someone who knows and can program AutoCAD - in Lisp and also using AutoCad macros. This would be part-time contract work as needed for a project I'm considering. $$ are low, given the realities of the size of our market, which is why I'm asking you folks first - Anyone who knows anyone or who is interested, please email me privately - john2004 [at] mckernon.com Thanks! - John McKernon ------------------------------ From: StevevETTrn [at] aol.com Message-ID: <193.3017dae9.2e9803fb [at] aol.com> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 10:53:47 EDT Subject: Re: plywood: was Steel Prices >3/4 cd ply from 25 up to 32 >here's the worst. 3/4 ac ply from 34 up to 60. And my yard can't tell me when they'll get it in. Just try buying any kind of sheet material here in Hurricane Florida! It has become a black hole sweeping up all available stock. In the day or two prior to each storm, the waiting lines for plywood were as long as 12 hours, with no certainty of getting any. Many people took down their fences to cover their windows. Now that the season is (hopefully) winding down, there may be a significant supply of "slightly" used plywood. I've finally taken a chance and taken down my window coverings. ;) SteveV Orl, FL ------------------------------ From: IAEG [at] aol.com Message-ID: <198.303e275b.2e98045c [at] aol.com> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 10:55:24 EDT Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding? In a message dated 10/8/04 10:35:28 AM, stagecraft2004 [at] mckernon.com writes: << > to our > surprise, they were folded in some soft of 'accordian' style - they even > included a blurry photocopy of "How to fold a drop" - text is illegible, but > the pictures are sufficient. My question is, has this become the 'new' way? I certainly hope not! The traditional method produces the most gentle folds possible. Accordion-style folding produces sharp creases that are hell on the paint and almost impossible to get rid of. - John McKernon >> but yes, , there are those who like what I believe is knowns as SHOP FOLD, and rental companies / organizations that require you return drops this way, i've gotten nasty letters from one when I haven't, but never have been given the threatened sur charge. very best, Keith Arsenault International Arts & Entertainment Group Tampa, FL ------------------------------ Subject: RE: Rechargable Batteries Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 11:03:08 -0400 Message-ID: <6E497ADB607656479C24E6D7BF6B505A74ACF7 [at] exchange.rmwc.edu> From: "Paul Schreiner" > I know this has been discussed in the past, but I can not get=20 > the archives to work. I am wondering if anyone uses=20 > rechargeable batteries with wireless systems. I have 13=20 > wireless mics and do not want to purchase new batteries every=20 > show if rechargeables would work.=20 >=20 > I am looking for both the pros and cons, battery life and=20 > other useful information. I've never tried using rechargeables, so any info I give you won't be first hand...but I've also watched the discussions in the past, so I'd like to think I remember the basic issues! The general consensus seems to be that rechargeable "9V" batteries actually put out, fully charged, significantly less than 9 volts--usually in the 8.6-8.8 range. Brand new alkaline 9V batteries will push 9.2-9.4, and most wireless systems look (at least those that run on 9V batteries) for a voltage right around 9...some will work with less, but not all, and anything significantly less will only cause problems (including dropouts and a substantially shorter life cycle). I'm not aware of any online comprehensive listing of battery requirements and/or performance with wireless systems and rechargeables, so I can't help you there. Some people have also voiced the question of battery memory, but that is not a problem any more with the newer rechargeables AFAIK. Other concerns have included the trouble one sometimes can go through in keeping "recharged" vs. "spent" batteries separate and so forth, which can be more problematic than when dealing with alkaline and the handy-dandy plastic tabs that are placed over the terminals if you buy pro grade batteries in bulk. Basically, the practical upshot comes down to this...if you wanna try them, you'll have to see if they work for your system...but don't hold your breath, either. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <1097248446.4166aebe63160 [at] webmail.bard.edu> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 11:14:06 -0400 From: doran [at] bard.edu Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? References:

In-Reply-To: Barney, I have a friend who may be interested in your drops. He's the Chair of the Theater Department at Briar Cliff University, and an Opera House Historian, among other things. He used to have a rather extensive collection of rescued drops from the old Midwest Opera Houses from that period, and he may be interested in these. His name is Richard Poole Briar Cliff University 3303 Rebecca Street Sioux City, IA 51104 richard.poole [at] briarcliff.edu (712)279-5487 Give me a call. Thanks, Andy Champ-Doran Quoting Barney Simon : > I inherited several painted drops when I took over here... about 40; Not a day goes by that I do not > ponder their demise, but have not done anything. > > Barney > JC Hanen Co. > ------------------------------ From: "Kevin Linzey" Subject: RE: Dry Ice Storage Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 11:25:51 -0400 Message-ID: <001e01c4ad4b$19b018a0$6800a8c0 [at] KLinzeypc> In-Reply-To: Check with your dry ice supplier. My regular supplier stores most of = the ice in large coolers that the fork lift around the warehouse. They also rent/sell coolers that hold anywhere between 100lbs and 1000lbs. Rental = for the week of the 100lb cooler is about $15. They are basically Styrofoam coolers that have 2"-3" thick wall with an outer plastic coating. Kevin Kevin Linzey Fisher Theatrical, LLC. Cell: 443-415-4587 Office: 410-455-9641 Fax: 410-455-9643 http://www.fishertheatrical.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf=20 > Of Tony Deeming > Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 7:54 AM > To: Stagecraft > Subject: Dry Ice Storage >=20 >=20 > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see=20 > > --------------------------------------------------- >=20 > On the assumption that the Glaciator that I have on loan at=20 > present isn't going to be a go-er (which is possible due to=20 > the problems with ambient heat we've got!) I now need to look=20 > at the options, and of course dry ice is the obvious one. >=20 > Now - I've used CO2 on and off for 25 years, so don't need=20 > any pointers on usage or storage, but what I do need to=20 > investigate is a source of suitable storage boxes (at least=20 > two) to hold the stuff whilst it awaits use on stage. >=20 > Our CO2 supplier (Univar) is local so there's minimal=20 > transport problems, esp as the show's director lives 5=20 > minutes from their depot, so it's what to store it in at the theatre. >=20 > The added complication is that the supplier is NOT open at=20 > weekends, so for the middle weekend, we have 5 performances=20 > (Friday, 2 x Saturday & 2 x > Sunday) for the stuff to last, so the boxes have got to be=20 > good insulators and preferably portable, too. >=20 > One option may be to construct a bigger box in which to store=20 > the stuff in bulk and use smaller, maybe even domestic=20 > cool-boxes, to move it from there to the stage (which=20 > actually sounds not unreasonable). >=20 > So - thoughts from the gang. > Any suitable (UK) insulated box suppliers out there? >=20 > Thanks > TD > (Now you see why I was considering the Glaciator...?!) >=20 > copied to rats >=20 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 11:31:16 -0400 Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? From: Steve Larson Message-ID: In-Reply-To: You might also contact Lance Brockman at the University of Minnesota. They have a spectacular collection of drops from the Minneapolis area and Lance is one of the authorities in the US on old drops and scene painting techniques. Steve on 10/8/04 11:14 AM, doran [at] bard.edu at doran [at] bard.edu wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > Barney, > > I have a friend who may be interested in your drops. He's the Chair of the > Theater Department at Briar Cliff University, and an Opera House Historian, > among other things. He used to have a rather extensive collection of > rescued drops from the old Midwest Opera Houses from that period, and he > may be interested in these. > > His name is Richard Poole > Briar Cliff University > 3303 Rebecca Street > Sioux City, IA 51104 > richard.poole [at] briarcliff.edu > (712)279-5487 > > Give me a call. > Thanks, > Andy Champ-Doran > > > Quoting Barney Simon : > >> I inherited several painted drops when I took over here... about 40; > Not a day goes by that I do not >> ponder their demise, but have not done anything. >> >> Barney >> JC Hanen Co. >> > > > > ------------------------------ Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 08:51:28 -0700 From: "rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" <"rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" [at] mail.wlakemail.com> Subject: Re: Rechargable Batteries We used Radio Shack rechargables in our 2 E6's for a summer and they worked fine. Richard At 8:17 AM -0400 10/8/04, Jonathan Wills wrote: >For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see >--------------------------------------------------- > >Hello all, > >I know this has been discussed in the past, but I can not get the archives >to work. I am wondering if anyone uses rechargeable batteries with wireless >systems. I have 13 wireless mics and do not want to purchase new batteries >every show if rechargeables would work. > > -- Theatre Royal, Barkerville, B.C. ------------------------------ Subject: RE: LDI Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 08:56:38 -0700 Message-ID: From: "Joe Golden" ELS is booth 1405, just left of center from the main entrance, second booth back. > Naturally, both ELS and TMB will supply us with their booth=20 > numbers, but when? Do we really have to look them up in the=20 > thick LDI showguide? /s/ Richard >=20 ------------------------------ Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 09:02:10 -0700 From: "rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" <"rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" [at] mail.wlakemail.com> Subject: Light storage Our theatre is a summer only theatre. We pack everything up in October and return in May. In winter it can drop to -40 C, but the air is dry dry dry. Our stage manager insists that the light board and light bulbs must go into "warm storage." Naturally I followed her advice. However, it seems to me that cold is not going to harm light bulbs, and likely not the board if they are warmed again before use. Comments? Richard Wright -- Newman & Wright Theatre Company Williams Lake and Vancouver Presenting 1870s and 1930s Theatre Productions at Theatre Royal, Barkerville ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 11:20:14 -0500 Subject: Re: Light storage From: Greg Persinger Message-ID: In-Reply-To: I wouldn't worry about the fixtures and the lamps but I personally would want the console to stay in warm storage if possible. It's a little easier on the components although it probably isn't going to hurt it. What kind of console is it? Greg Persinger Vivid Illumination Greg [at] Vividillumination.com ------------------------------ Message-Id: Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 12:24:16 -0400 From: "LES LIND" Subject: Re: Dry Ice Storage Any chance you could talk to the supplier to see if an employee might come in over the weekend? Just for a few minutes? Les Lind, TD NHS Dramatics Northeastern High School Manchester, PA >>> deeming.tony [at] btinternet.com 10/8/04 7:54:17 AM >>> For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- On the assumption that the Glaciator that I have on loan at present isn't going to be a go-er (which is possible due to the problems with ambient heat we've got!) I now need to look at the options, and of course dry ice is the obvious one. Now - I've used CO2 on and off for 25 years, so don't need any pointers on usage or storage, but what I do need to investigate is a source of suitable storage boxes (at least two) to hold the stuff whilst it awaits use on stage. Our CO2 supplier (Univar) is local so there's minimal transport problems, esp as the show's director lives 5 minutes from their depot, so it's what to store it in at the theatre. The added complication is that the supplier is NOT open at weekends, so for the middle weekend, we have 5 performances (Friday, 2 x Saturday & 2 x Sunday) for the stuff to last, so the boxes have got to be good insulators and preferably portable, too. One option may be to construct a bigger box in which to store the stuff in bulk and use smaller, maybe even domestic cool-boxes, to move it from there to the stage (which actually sounds not unreasonable). So - thoughts from the gang. Any suitable (UK) insulated box suppliers out there? Thanks TD (Now you see why I was considering the Glaciator...?!) copied to rats ------------------------------ Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 10:02:21 -0700 From: "rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" <"rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com" [at] mail.wlakemail.com> Subject: Re: Light storage Thanks Greg It's a small 24 channel Leprechon. I do take out our sound board but the way it has been set up in the past if the light console gets taken out we have no house lights during the winter, only stage work lights. There was an old board that was used for that purpose, an ancient Strand, but when we plugged it in this fall we had no lights. I think it has died. The console will be blanketed and covered. Richard Wright At 11:20 AM -0500 10/8/04, Greg Persinger wrote: >For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see >--------------------------------------------------- > >I wouldn't worry about the fixtures and the lamps but I personally would >want the console to stay in warm storage if possible. It's a little easier >on the components although it probably isn't going to hurt it. > >What kind of console is it? > > >Greg Persinger >Vivid Illumination > >Greg [at] Vividillumination.com -- Theatre Royal, Barkerville, B.C. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <001801c4ad59$9f02ec40$0a01a8c0 [at] Tony> From: "Tony Deeming" References: Subject: Re: Dry Ice Storage Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 18:09:47 +0100 Nope - been there before, tried it! And as there are 2 shows on Sunday, that would be even harder to do!! Ta anyway, Ynot ----- Original Message ----- From: "LES LIND" To: "Stagecraft" Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 5:24 PM Subject: Re: Dry Ice Storage > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > Any chance you could talk to the supplier to see if an employee might > come in over the weekend? Just for a few minutes? > > Les Lind, TD > NHS Dramatics > Northeastern High School > Manchester, PA > > > > >>> deeming.tony [at] btinternet.com 10/8/04 7:54:17 AM >>> > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > > --------------------------------------------------- > > On the assumption that the Glaciator that I have on loan at present > isn't > going to be a go-er (which is possible due to the problems with ambient > heat > we've got!) I now need to look at the options, and of course dry ice is > the > obvious one. > > Now - I've used CO2 on and off for 25 years, so don't need any pointers > on > usage or storage, but what I do need to investigate is a source of > suitable > storage boxes (at least two) to hold the stuff whilst it awaits use on > stage. > > Our CO2 supplier (Univar) is local so there's minimal transport > problems, > esp as the show's director lives 5 minutes from their depot, so it's > what to > store it in at the theatre. > > The added complication is that the supplier is NOT open at weekends, so > for > the middle weekend, we have 5 performances (Friday, 2 x Saturday & 2 x > Sunday) for the stuff to last, so the boxes have got to be good > insulators > and preferably portable, too. > > One option may be to construct a bigger box in which to store the stuff > in > bulk and use smaller, maybe even domestic cool-boxes, to move it from > there > to the stage (which actually sounds not unreasonable). > > So - thoughts from the gang. > Any suitable (UK) insulated box suppliers out there? > > Thanks > TD > (Now you see why I was considering the Glaciator...?!) > > copied to rats > > > ------------------------------ From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com Message-ID: <1f6.77f51d.2e982660 [at] aol.com> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 13:20:32 EDT Subject: Re: An academic question In a message dated 08/10/04 02:24:13 GMT Daylight Time, charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com writes: > > However, if you were to post for a lighting designer/sound designer/op it > > don't seem to phase folk much. Go for it, Dan, you won't do any worse > that > > those that hire lighting guys to do sound design... > > Thanks for echoing my opinion on this, as usual ;-) > > Some of the best known (not necessarily best...) sound designers are failed > lighting designers... ;-) Fram an amateur point of view, many of us do both. Indeed, at one time, out of the two one dozen strong departments, only four people were not a member of both. This harks back to the days when you had to be something of an engineer to do either. Nowadays, it's far less common as the quipment gets more specialised. There are now only four lighting designers who also design sound, and all are in their late fifties or older. The complexity of the equipment and the greater range of tasks it can handle call for more specialisation. Frank Wood ------------------------------ In-Reply-To: References:

Message-Id: <3C4CCFF0-194E-11D9-AEE9-000393897332 [at] email.arizona.edu> Cc: marko [at] email.arizona.edu (Mark O'Brien) From: Mark O'Brien Subject: Re: Light storage Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 10:19:39 -0700 As for work-lights, why not by a DMX dongle that basically runs all channels 0-100%. It just plugs in in place of the board For that matter, why not just take the board home at night? Mark O'Brien Opera Technical Director University of Arizona, School of Music Tucson, AZ 520/621-7025 520/591-1803 Mobile On Oct 8, 2004, at 10:02 AM, rtwright [at] goldrushbc.com wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > > --------------------------------------------------- > > Thanks Greg > > It's a small 24 channel Leprechon. > > I do take out our sound board but the way it has been set up in the > past if the light console gets taken out we have no house lights > during the winter, only stage work lights. There was an old board that > was used for that purpose, an ancient Strand, but when we plugged it > in this fall we had no lights. I think it has died. > > The console will be blanketed and covered. > > Richard Wright ------------------------------ From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com Message-ID: <194.2f2bac41.2e982e18 [at] aol.com> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 13:53:28 EDT Subject: Re: Rechargable Batteries In a message dated 08/10/04 13:18:07 GMT Daylight Time, Jonathan [at] WillsLighting.com writes: > I know this has been discussed in the past, but I can not get the archives > to work. I am wondering if anyone uses rechargeable batteries with wireless > systems. I have 13 wireless mics and do not want to purchase new batteries > every show if rechargeables would work. > > I am looking for both the pros and cons, battery life and other useful > information. The big problem with rechargeable batteries is organisational. Making sure that the batteries are properly recharged. At the lowest level, this means collecting ALL the batteries after the show; putting them on to charge; and then issuing fully charged batteries before the next performance. This may seem obvious, but there is a pitfall. Some varieties of rechargeable cells suffer from a 'memory' effect. This means that if you only hef discharge them, and then recharge them, after a while they forget about the other half of the charge. So a battery which has got used to running two hour shows may fail on a three hour one. The remedy is to fully discharge (to 1V/cell) them before their charge. I think that modern rechargeables are better than when I made a study of this, some years ago. And cell manufacturers keep on changing things. What was the best cell last week may not be the best one this week. The BBC's Film Engineering Department made a wise policy decicsion. Cameras and lighting, which are heavy current loads, ran from big Ni-Cd packs, and the crews carried chargers. Everything else, tape recorders, mixers, radio mics, and so on ran on primary cells, non-rechargeable. I think this is the way to go. Frank Wood ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 12:58:40 -0500 From: "Frank E. Merrill" Message-ID: <1610210177.20041008125840 [at] TCON.net> Subject: Re[2]: What rental item disappointed you most? In-Reply-To: References:

Howdy! Friday, October 08, 2004, my friend Barney Simon wrote about aging scene drops: BS> most have pealing paint. I can't resist this one, although I know that the adjectivs above is a mere typographical error. I have this image of a big painted bell, see. Tee hee hee.... We eliminated the last of our painted drops from our rental inventory in the early 1960's. Since renting drops has never been our greatest virtue, we found that we never rented enough to make it viable considering the problems with trying to have the right size image on the prop[er size drop. I salute those that are serious about the rental scene drop business, because I shudder at the inventory nightmares. Best regards, Frank E. Merrill MERRILL STAGE EQUIPMENT Eastablished 1946 Indianapolis 317: 255 4666 Running The Bat! Natural e-mail system v3.0 mailto:Lamplighter [at] TCON.net ------------------------------ Message-ID: <468d22820410081101a3671cd [at] mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 14:01:27 -0400 From: Michael Beyer Subject: test test ------------------------------ Message-ID: <4166DAE7.4010002 [at] JosephCHansen.com> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 14:22:31 -0400 From: Barney Simon Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? References: In-Reply-To: >what restaurant in NYC used to have the Picasso front cloth for the Diaghalev >/ Massine ballet PARADE hanging in it's foyer ? > 4 seasons ------------------------------ Message-ID: <4166DAF9.1020904 [at] JosephCHansen.com> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 14:22:49 -0400 From: Barney Simon Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding? References: In-Reply-To: IAEG [at] aol.com wrote: >but yes, , there are those who like what I believe is knowns as SHOP FOLD, > > As a shop/rental house owner, I understand why the shop fold exists. Here we have a shop space 35' x 10'... not exactly the space required for a proper full stage fold. Barney J C Hansen Co. ------------------------------ Message-ID: <4166DB32.7040107 [at] JosephCHansen.com> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 14:23:46 -0400 From: Barney Simon Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? References:

In-Reply-To: howie wrote: > those old drops might be quite valuable, I've offered some of them (free) to a couple of museums and they have turned me down... claiming the have no place to display a 15 x 30 drop (or two). The artist was the scenic artist for Dali's NY Ballet sets... which explains some of the designs. Barney ------------------------------ In-Reply-To: References: Message-Id: From: Greg Bierly Subject: Re: Rechargable Batteries Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 14:25:14 -0500 I have never tried rechargables for wireless but the consensus seemed to be last time this was discussed on the list was Varta (brand name). If I ever tried it I would use new batteries for each performance and go with the rechargables for rehearsals and non critical meetings. I usually have plenty of partially used 9v left after a performance for the next rehearsal period. I do hate having them run out at odd intervals during rehearsals but I would still probably have the same thing with rechargables anyway. Greg Greg Bierly Technical Director Hempfield HS ------------------------------ In-Reply-To: References:

Message-Id: <808E31A3-1960-11D9-886B-000D936BFA94 [at] dejazzd.com> From: Greg Bierly Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding? Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 14:30:24 -0500 Every rented drop I have seen has been folded that way and had the same photocopied sheet along with it. But also on that note every rented drop I have seen has such a fine single coat of paint that it almost looks dyed as opposed to being "painted". Thus the drops are much more supple and softer than anything I have ever painted and not prone to any cracking. They are always light enough that once the bottom pipe is in there have never been any wrinkle issues. (BTW most of the drops I have worked with have been Tobins Lake but I have seen at least three other companies do the same thing) On Oct 8, 2004, at 9:29 AM, Jon Ares wrote: > My question is, has this become the 'new' way? Is it no longer > preferred to do the half-and-half up to the webbing, then folding to > center thing? Obviously these drops need to go back to the vendor > they way they specify, but I am wondering if I should be teaching the > students a different way.... My guess it is not a "new" way, just the rental way. I would teach my students to follow directions and fold rental drops as shown and "house" drops in the manner you prefer. Greg Bierly Technical Director Hempfield HS ------------------------------ In-Reply-To: References:

Message-Id: From: Greg Bierly Subject: Re: Dry Ice Storage Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 14:52:53 -0500 > One option may be to construct a bigger box in which to store the > stuff in > bulk and use smaller, maybe even domestic cool-boxes, to move it from > there > to the stage. When I started here, my predecessor had bought four 34 quart (32liter) picnic coolers at the corner pharmacy to go pick up our dry ice. We do 25lbs per machine per drop, so usually a 50lb block per show. The 50lb block fits perfectly into a cooler and leaves enough room on the sides to manipulate the block. The blocks come wrapped in butcher paper. Our supplier is open on Saturdays with our shows running Friday, Sat, and 1 Sunday matinee. I have picked up the weekend supply on Friday in the past but usually just pick up Sat and Sundays by 5pm on Friday. By Sunday I usually lose about 10 lbs from a 50lb block if I picked it up on Friday. I usually buy an extra 25lbs for a Sunday performance. The individual coolers work well as long as no one is opening and closing them. Since each cooler holds enough for one drop for two machines we can, prior to the show or at intermission, break a block into chunks/powder and divide it into two coolers (25lbs ea.) one for each side of the stage (ea. machine) and load the machine on cue. Meanwhile the other blocks remain undisturbed until the next show. I have wrapped the coolers in packing blankets and put them in a dark cool corner of the pit but it really doesn't seem to make much of a difference. At my previous place of employment we had an old deepfreeze icecream cooler that we would store all the blocks in until they were transferred into coolers to taken to the stage. There was a discussion on list that freezers really don't cool things enough to do anything. I think the thermostat was broken (or rigged) that it ran all the time just to keep the ambient temperature down so the ice didn't have to cool the air around it. We could keep 350lbs of dry ice for a weekend with minimal loss. > (Now you see why I was considering the Glaciator...?!) I was getting tired of students trying to slip chunks of dry ice past me to make "water bottle bombs" I think someone on this list had a link for an extremely graphic picture of a cap mark in someones forehead. Even with that posted I had difficulities. After seeing the MDG Ice Fog in action I called them up and got a great educational deal on a "Neused" (demo) unit. Now I change the dewar at the top of a run and sleep a lot easier. Sorry for the long reply Greg Bierly Technical Director Hempfield HS ------------------------------ In-Reply-To: References:

Message-Id: From: Greg Bierly Subject: Re: Dry Ice Storage Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 15:08:39 -0500 Not that it matters I meant Saturday by 5 when the butcher closes. > but usually just pick up Sat and Sundays by 5pm on Friday. Greg ------------------------------ Message-ID: <002601c4ad6f$4a9c7840$0a01a8c0 [at] Tony> From: "Tony Deeming" References:

Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 20:44:54 +0100 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Barney Simon" To: "Stagecraft" Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 7:23 PM Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > howie wrote: > > > those old drops might be quite valuable, > > > I've offered some of them (free) to a couple of museums and they have > turned me down... claiming the have no place to display a 15 x 30 drop > (or two). > > The artist was the scenic artist for Dali's NY Ballet sets... which > explains some of the designs. > > Barney > > Shame you're left pond - at 30 x 15 I might've been tempted o take a look. Ynot ------------------------------ From: IAEG [at] aol.com Message-ID: <19e.2a3180fb.2e98502f [at] aol.com> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 16:18:55 EDT Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? In a message dated 10/8/04 2:25:08 PM, barney [at] JosephCHansen.com writes: << I've offered some of them (free) to a couple of museums and they have turned me down... claiming the have no place to display a 15 x 30 drop (or two). The artist was the scenic artist for Dali's NY Ballet sets... which explains some of the designs. Barney >> I have seen ballet / opera drops on display at the De Young Museum in SF as well as in the Philadelphia Museum of Art, very best, Keith Arsenault International Arts & Entertainment Group Tampa, FL ------------------------------ Message-ID: <004a01c4ad75$1c8d07c0$80fea8c0 [at] Fred> From: "Mike Rock" References:

Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding? Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 15:26:34 -0500 Nothing makes me less happy than folding drops. It might be the fact its the last thing before we get to leave, or its done so late/early that we have to redo it several times because of error or it might be the lack of a standerd in folding. We get drops from a few differnt companys and only one sends along instructions so it gets a bit confusing. If I had my way I would outlaw accordian style and stick with the style you discribed. Mike ------------------------------ Message-ID: <886EF25AF8BEF64EB89A820EF84064FF09413F8E [at] UCMAIL4> From: "Waxler, Steve (waxlers)" Subject: RE: Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 16:57:15 -0400 Michael, What would happen if you removed the chain and just ran it like a single purchase counter weight system. The sprockets would still be there (maybe they can be removed also) but it might work better than what you have now. Steve Waxler Technical Director College Conservatory of Music University of Cincinnati -----Original Message----- From: Michael Powers [mailto:mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu] Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 11:33 AM To: Stagecraft Subject: For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ --------------------------------------------------- Granted, the system is in desparate need of renovation. Many of the components need to be replaced. I do wonder how well it worked when everything was brand new. However, the chain part of the equation just doesn't pan out as well in practice as it did on paper. Michael Michael Powers, Technical Director UMass Theatre Department 112 FAC West 151 Presidents Drive, Ofc.2 Amherst, Ma. 01003-9331 413-545-6821 voice 413-577-0025 fax mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edconvenienceepartment 112 FAC West 151 Presidents Drive, Ofc.2 Amherst, Ma. 01003-9331 413-545-6821 voice 413-577-0025 fax mfpowers [at] theater.umass.edu ------------------------------ Message-ID: <886EF25AF8BEF64EB89A820EF84064FF09413F9D [at] UCMAIL4> From: "Waxler, Steve (waxlers)" Subject: RE: Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 17:07:14 -0400 There have been a few hydraulic systems in use. The last that I know of was in New Orleans. The cylinders were mounted horizontally on the grid and a cable was attached to the rod. They did have leakage problems and they ended up putting pans under all the cylinders so that the oil did not drop to the stage floor. I think they finally removed that system about 5 years ago. Steve Waxler Technical Director College Conservatory of Music University of Cincinnati -----Original Message----- From: Matthew Breton [mailto:theatricalmatt [at] hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2004 10:33 AM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ --------------------------------------------------- >One would think that the fluid in such a system would be contained >in a closed system and that the fluid would probably be something >akin to hydraulic fluid, so evaporation would be close to >negligable. Of course, it would still require periodoc topping off, >filtering and flushing and replacing. I was being about as serious in my comment about evaporating water as others are in their thoughts about Guinness. :) And about as serious as I would be in suggesting the stagehands could top the saltwater dimmer vats you mention off with (ewww!) sweat. It seems to me that while a liquid counterweight system might be more precise, the gear needed to run it -- pumps, filters, cooling units and so on -- are probably more cumbersome than the current arrangement of weights and pulleys. Plus, anything that looks like a refrigerator is bound to be a Facilities job, not Technical. ;) And -- not to make light of another's injuries -- but if Unka Bill almost got clobbered by a stage brick, imagine the havoc a leaky hose under pressure could wreak. Might be a good way to cool off everyone ... 'cept the producer. Matthew Breton Technical Director Green Street Studios _________________________________________________________________ Watch the online reality show Mixed Messages with a friend and enter to win a trip to NY http://www.msnmessenger-download.click-url.com/go/onm00200497ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 17:16:53 -0400 Subject: Re: From: Steve Larson Message-ID: In-Reply-To: The system in New Orleans was a disaster from the start. Lines would drift, cylinders would leak. University of Virginia has a super hydraulic fly system. LaVahn Hoh was the TD there for many years. Steve on 10/8/04 5:07 PM, Waxler, Steve (waxlers) at WAXLERS [at] UCMAIL.UC.EDU wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > There have been a few hydraulic systems in use. The last that I know of was > in New Orleans. The cylinders were mounted horizontally on the grid and a > cable was attached to the rod. They did have leakage problems and they ended > up putting pans under all the cylinders so that the oil did not drop to the > stage floor. I think they finally removed that system about 5 years ago. > > > Steve Waxler > Technical Director > College Conservatory of Music > University of Cincinnati > > -----Original Message----- > From: Matthew Breton [mailto:theatricalmatt [at] hotmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2004 10:33 AM > To: Stagecraft > Subject: Re: > > For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending > your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: > http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ > --------------------------------------------------- > > >> One would think that the fluid in such a system would be contained >> in a closed system and that the fluid would probably be something >> akin to hydraulic fluid, so evaporation would be close to >> negligable. Of course, it would still require periodoc topping off, >> filtering and flushing and replacing. > > I was being about as serious in my comment about evaporating water as others > > are in their thoughts about Guinness. :) And about as serious as I would be > > in suggesting the stagehands could top the saltwater dimmer vats you mention > > off with (ewww!) sweat. > > It seems to me that while a liquid counterweight system might be more > precise, the gear needed to run it -- pumps, filters, cooling units and so > on -- are probably more cumbersome than the current arrangement of weights > and pulleys. Plus, anything that looks like a refrigerator is bound to be a > Facilities job, not Technical. ;) > > And -- not to make light of another's injuries -- but if Unka Bill almost > got clobbered by a stage brick, imagine the havoc a leaky hose under > pressure could wreak. Might be a good way to cool off everyone ... 'cept the > > producer. > > > Matthew Breton > Technical Director > Green Street Studios > > _________________________________________________________________ > Watch the online reality show Mixed Messages with a friend and enter to win > a trip to NY > http://www.msnmessenger-download.click-url.com/go/onm00200497ave/direct/01/ > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 17:19:24 -0400 Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? From: Steve Larson Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Perhaps, for those who might be able to use them, we could get some photos or them. Might be something that some of us could use. Steve on 10/8/04 4:18 PM, IAEG [at] aol.com at IAEG [at] aol.com wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > > In a message dated 10/8/04 2:25:08 PM, barney [at] JosephCHansen.com writes: > > << > I've offered some of them (free) to a couple of museums and they have > turned me down... claiming the have no place to display a 15 x 30 drop > (or two). > > The artist was the scenic artist for Dali's NY Ballet sets... which > explains some of the designs. > > Barney >> > > > I have seen ballet / opera drops on display at the De Young Museum in SF as > well as in the Philadelphia Museum of Art, > > very best, > > Keith Arsenault > International Arts & Entertainment Group > Tampa, FL > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 17:30:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Boyd Ostroff Subject: Re: In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 8 Oct 2004, Steve Larson wrote: > University of Virginia has a super hydraulic fly system. LaVahn Hoh was > the TD there for many years. Ah, my old stomping grounds :-) When I graduated from UVA in 1971 they had just begun construction of that theatre.... Boyd Ostroff ooo Opera Company of Philadelphia Director of Design & Technology ooooooo 1420 Locust St, Suite 210 ostroff [at] operaphilly.com ooooooo Philadelphia, PA 19102 http://tech.operaphilly.com ooo (215) 893-3600 x225 ------------------------------ From: "Dr. Randall W.A. Davidson" Subject: RE: Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 14:35:01 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01c4ad7e$abb1b050$726dfea9 [at] DrDoomsComputer> In-Reply-To: Yes. I recall inspecting it when it was just about to open. Sheets of plywood, sheets of thick cardboard all over the place to keep the oil from dripping onto the stage. Tales of people slipping and sliding. doom ==================================================== A Masters Workshop for Entertainment Technicians, Riggers, Public Assembly Technicians, and Educational Performing Arts Personnel - Sponsored by Risk International & Associates, Inc. April 4, 5, 6, 2005 at ELCO Performing Arts Center, Elkhart, Indiana Brochure & Registration Form available at: www.riskit.com/workshops ==================================================== Risk International & Associates, Inc. - Dedicated to making the world a healthier & safer place. Website: www.riskit.com E-mail: rdavidson [at] riskit.com ==================================================== International Secondary Education Theater Safety Association (ISETSA) - Dedicated to the protection of every student in the performing arts. Website: www.isetsa.org E-mail: info [at] isetsa.org ==================================================== 960 E. Bonita #158, Pomona, CA 91767 Phone/Fax: (909) 625-5961 ==================================================== -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Steve Larson Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 2:17 PM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- The system in New Orleans was a disaster from the start. Lines would drift, cylinders would leak. University of Virginia has a super hydraulic fly system. LaVahn Hoh was the TD there for many years. Steve on 10/8/04 5:07 PM, Waxler, Steve (waxlers) at WAXLERS [at] UCMAIL.UC.EDU wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > There have been a few hydraulic systems in use. The last that I know of was > in New Orleans. The cylinders were mounted horizontally on the grid and a > cable was attached to the rod. They did have leakage problems and they ended > up putting pans under all the cylinders so that the oil did not drop to the > stage floor. I think they finally removed that system about 5 years ago. > > > Steve Waxler > Technical Director > College Conservatory of Music > University of Cincinnati > > -----Original Message----- > From: Matthew Breton [mailto:theatricalmatt [at] hotmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2004 10:33 AM > To: Stagecraft > Subject: Re: > > For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending > your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: > http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ > --------------------------------------------------- > > >> One would think that the fluid in such a system would be contained >> in a closed system and that the fluid would probably be something >> akin to hydraulic fluid, so evaporation would be close to >> negligable. Of course, it would still require periodoc topping off, >> filtering and flushing and replacing. > > I was being about as serious in my comment about evaporating water as others > > are in their thoughts about Guinness. :) And about as serious as I would be > > in suggesting the stagehands could top the saltwater dimmer vats you mention > > off with (ewww!) sweat. > > It seems to me that while a liquid counterweight system might be more > precise, the gear needed to run it -- pumps, filters, cooling units and so > on -- are probably more cumbersome than the current arrangement of weights > and pulleys. Plus, anything that looks like a refrigerator is bound to be a > Facilities job, not Technical. ;) > > And -- not to make light of another's injuries -- but if Unka Bill almost > got clobbered by a stage brick, imagine the havoc a leaky hose under > pressure could wreak. Might be a good way to cool off everyone ... 'cept the > > producer. > > > Matthew Breton > Technical Director > Green Street Studios > > _________________________________________________________________ > Watch the online reality show Mixed Messages with a friend and enter to win > a trip to NY > http://www.msnmessenger-download.click-url.com/go/onm00200497ave/direct/ 01/ > > ------------------------------ From: "Dr. Randall W.A. Davidson" Subject: RE: Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 14:39:44 -0700 Message-ID: <000f01c4ad7f$53f259e0$726dfea9 [at] DrDoomsComputer> In-Reply-To: I have inspected many, about a dozen, hydraulic systems in several countries. I have provided risk assessments for some of them more than once, i.e. three or four times. I have found them to be exceptional when they are well maintained, but when there is so much deferred maintenance and institutions and venues who do not have or will not have a budget to maintain them, there are egregious problems. Dr. Doom ==================================================== A Masters Workshop for Entertainment Technicians, Riggers, Public Assembly Technicians, and Educational Performing Arts Personnel - Sponsored by Risk International & Associates, Inc. April 4, 5, 6, 2005 at ELCO Performing Arts Center, Elkhart, Indiana Brochure & Registration Form available at: www.riskit.com/workshops ==================================================== Risk International & Associates, Inc. - Dedicated to making the world a healthier & safer place. Website: www.riskit.com E-mail: rdavidson [at] riskit.com ==================================================== International Secondary Education Theater Safety Association (ISETSA) - Dedicated to the protection of every student in the performing arts. Website: www.isetsa.org E-mail: info [at] isetsa.org ==================================================== 960 E. Bonita #158, Pomona, CA 91767 Phone/Fax: (909) 625-5961 ==================================================== -----Original Message----- From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Waxler, Steve (waxlers) Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 2:07 PM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see --------------------------------------------------- There have been a few hydraulic systems in use. The last that I know of was in New Orleans. The cylinders were mounted horizontally on the grid and a cable was attached to the rod. They did have leakage problems and they ended up putting pans under all the cylinders so that the oil did not drop to the stage floor. I think they finally removed that system about 5 years ago. Steve Waxler Technical Director College Conservatory of Music University of Cincinnati -----Original Message----- From: Matthew Breton [mailto:theatricalmatt [at] hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2004 10:33 AM To: Stagecraft Subject: Re: For info on subscribing, unsubscribing, and suspending your list subscription, go to the Stagecraft web site at: http://stagecraft.theprices.net/ --------------------------------------------------- >One would think that the fluid in such a system would be contained >in a closed system and that the fluid would probably be something >akin to hydraulic fluid, so evaporation would be close to >negligable. Of course, it would still require periodoc topping off, >filtering and flushing and replacing. I was being about as serious in my comment about evaporating water as others are in their thoughts about Guinness. :) And about as serious as I would be in suggesting the stagehands could top the saltwater dimmer vats you mention off with (ewww!) sweat. It seems to me that while a liquid counterweight system might be more precise, the gear needed to run it -- pumps, filters, cooling units and so on -- are probably more cumbersome than the current arrangement of weights and pulleys. Plus, anything that looks like a refrigerator is bound to be a Facilities job, not Technical. ;) And -- not to make light of another's injuries -- but if Unka Bill almost got clobbered by a stage brick, imagine the havoc a leaky hose under pressure could wreak. Might be a good way to cool off everyone ... 'cept the producer. Matthew Breton Technical Director Green Street Studios _________________________________________________________________ Watch the online reality show Mixed Messages with a friend and enter to win a trip to NY http://www.msnmessenger-download.click-url.com/go/onm00200497ave/direct/ 01/ ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20041008150322.01414750 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 15:03:22 From: CB Subject: Re: Looking for a Laser > Just what do you do with a laser is a "children's room"? I always envisioned one that targeted sound during a show and created quiet with extreme prejudice... Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20041008150935.01414750 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 15:09:35 From: CB Subject: Herbal Cigarettes >There >are so many productions which require smoking. Begin Quote: "Gunshots, explosions, inclement weather and smoking in this production have been imitated to protect the safety of our patrons and actors. We ask that you become a willing partner in this suspension of disbelief to keep all of us safer. Thank you, the Management." Close Quote. Best solution I've ever seen... Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ Message-ID: <4167132D.7050803 [at] fuse.net> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 18:22:37 -0400 From: Stuart Wheaton Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding? References:

In-Reply-To: Mike Rock wrote: > > Nothing makes me less happy than folding drops. It might be the fact its the > last thing before we get to leave, or its done so late/early that we have to > redo it several times because of error or it might be the lack of a standerd > in folding. We get drops from a few differnt companys and only one sends > along instructions so it gets a bit confusing. If I had my way I would > outlaw accordian style and stick with the style you discribed. Rolling a drop is certainly gentler on the paint, provided you use a big enough roller. However, I mostly hang drops that have been printed or dyed these days, so the paint cracking is not a big concern, and most of these drops are hung from traveller tracks. When you are on a ladder, trying to pop carriers into a track, or tie onto the carriers, you want the drop to be folded accordion style. If you are hanging a drop on a pipe, you want it folded traditional style. The trick really is to ensure that the pretty side of the drop has the least chance of dragging through the shcmutz and dust that are always on the floor at load in, and leaves you with the least weight to lift while tying it on. Whichever way you get your drop, it'll probably be wrong for your application. That's just pure murphy. Stuart ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20041008151938.01414750 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 15:19:38 From: CB Subject: What rental item disappointed you most? >For us it's our MD player. It got some use for about two years and has >been sitting idle for the last 3. Yeah, but that co-incides with CD burners becoming affordable to every TD&H that fancies themselves a sound designer. With the software avalable, there is no reason to suffer thru MD quality. For me it was my projector. I traded my lil 1100 lumen that would sit atop my headboard and put bigscreen in my bedroom up to a 2300 lumen pro job that sits in a case in my warehouse. I've rented it a coupla times, but the biggest boon was the opera tickets that came with a rental to the AZ Opera. I was so close I shoulda had a clip-light. To get this one to sit on my headboard I had to prop it up and use a mirror, and then had to blast the surround to overcome the fan noise. Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20041008152219.01414750 [at] pop.west.cox.net> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 15:22:19 From: CB Subject: Re: An academic question >Unhappily, not. I live in the UK, and am a heavy smoker. But I wish you all >well. Maybe things have changed since I've been there last, but there are few places in Vegas that you can't smoke. LV and New Orleans are the last bastions of the smoker. Chris "Chris" Babbie Location Sound MON AZ Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment. Rates negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment... ------------------------------ From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com Message-ID: <60.46231cf2.2e986f12 [at] aol.com> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 18:30:42 EDT Subject: Re: An academic question In a message dated 08/10/04 23:24:18 GMT Daylight Time, psyd [at] cox.net writes: > Maybe things have changed since I've been there last, but there are few > places in Vegas that you can't smoke. LV and New Orleans are the last > bastions of the smoker. Things may have changed, but thank you for the information. That said, it's still a good 3,500 miles away. Frank Wood ------------------------------ Message-ID: <4167161D.3060005 [at] fuse.net> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 18:35:09 -0400 From: Stuart Wheaton Subject: Re: Dry Ice Storage References:

In-Reply-To: Tony Deeming wrote: > Nope - been there before, tried it! > And as there are 2 shows on Sunday, that would be even harder to do!! > Tony, Try contacting the local university. the Chemistry and Physics people often have need for cryogenic storage and for dry ice. They also often run experiments that need weekend attention, so you might find someone there who could store your dry ice for you and give you better access. Stuart ------------------------------ From: Subject: RE: An academic question Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 18:32:55 -0400 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 19:08:58 -0400 From: in a fishbowl Subject: need production staff still? I am interested in working on your film on your productiong crew. I am a costume designer. Are you still looking for people? Laurie ------------------------------ From: "Delbert Hall" Subject: RE: Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 19:30:42 -0400 Organization: ETSU Message-ID: <000001c4ad8e$d462c2e0$6400a8c0 [at] delbert> In-Reply-To: I first saw the hydraulic system at UVA in 1976. It thought it was a little noisy than a counterweight system, but other than that, it worked very well. I have done two flying workshops at UVA during the last few years (I was last there in May) and the hydraulic system is still there and still working well. I have known LaVahn for years and he is a really great guy. LaVahn's rigging class is wonderful. He challenges then to understand the mechanicals of rigging. His students really seem top notch. Boyd, I guess you know David Weiss pretty well too. David is another old friend of mine. -Delbert On Fri, 8 Oct 2004, Steve Larson wrote: > University of Virginia has a super hydraulic fly system. LaVahn Hoh was > the TD there for many years. Ah, my old stomping grounds :-) When I graduated from UVA in 1971 they had just begun construction of that theatre.... Boyd Ostroff ooo Opera Company of Philadelphia Director of Design & Technology ooooooo 1420 Locust St, Suite 210 ostroff [at] operaphilly.com ooooooo Philadelphia, PA 19102 http://tech.operaphilly.com ooo (215) 893-3600 x225 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 19:50:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Boyd Ostroff Subject: UVa nostalgia (was Re: ) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 8 Oct 2004, Delbert Hall wrote: > I have known LaVahn for years and he is a really great guy. He is terrific. IIRC, my senior year was his first at UVA. We had lots of fun joking around backstage and I remember some great parties at his place. I also remember how mad he would get when mail arrived addressed to "Miss LaVahn Hoh" ;-) > Boyd, I guess you know David Weiss pretty well too. David is another old > friend of mine. Yes, of course. In many ways I can thank (or blame ;-) him for getting into this business. About a year or so back I had an e-mail from him and we caught up on things a bit. Actually I think somebody here on the list forwarded one of my messages to him and he decided to drop me a line. Boyd Ostroff ooo Opera Company of Philadelphia Director of Design & Technology ooooooo 1420 Locust St, Suite 210 ostroff [at] operaphilly.com ooooooo Philadelphia, PA 19102 http://tech.operaphilly.com ooo (215) 893-3600 x225 ------------------------------ Message-ID: <0b2301c4ad94$a6387760$0600a8c0 [at] alf> From: "Alf Sauve" References:

Subject: Re: Dry Ice Storage Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 19:55:25 -0400 The trick I was taught by the ice company. Tightly wrap each block in newspaper multiple times. Tightly -- like a present. Line bottom of ice chest with alternating layers of paper and blanket/towels. Place ice in middle. Surround with more layers of paper and blanket/towels. Try to fill all spaces of the cooler so that there is as little air as possible inside. The idea is to slow the passage of heat. The cooler the ambient temperature the better. But not inside a fridge or freezer. Alf ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Deeming" To: "Stagecraft" Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 7:54 AM Subject: Dry Ice Storage > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > On the assumption that the Glaciator that I have on loan at present isn't > going to be a go-er (which is possible due to the problems with ambient > heat > we've got!) I now need to look at the options, and of course dry ice is > the > obvious one. > > Now - I've used CO2 on and off for 25 years, so don't need any pointers on > usage or storage, but what I do need to investigate is a source of > suitable > storage boxes (at least two) to hold the stuff whilst it awaits use on > stage. > > Our CO2 supplier (Univar) is local so there's minimal transport problems, > esp as the show's director lives 5 minutes from their depot, so it's what > to > store it in at the theatre. > > The added complication is that the supplier is NOT open at weekends, so > for > the middle weekend, we have 5 performances (Friday, 2 x Saturday & 2 x > Sunday) for the stuff to last, so the boxes have got to be good > insulators > and preferably portable, too. > > One option may be to construct a bigger box in which to store the stuff in > bulk and use smaller, maybe even domestic cool-boxes, to move it from > there > to the stage (which actually sounds not unreasonable). > > So - thoughts from the gang. > Any suitable (UK) insulated box suppliers out there? > > Thanks > TD > (Now you see why I was considering the Glaciator...?!) > > copied to rats > > ------------------------------ Message-ID: <41674A93.6A36C5FC [at] cybercom.net> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 22:18:59 -0400 From: Dale Farmer Subject: Re: Dry Ice Storage References:

Greg Bierly wrote: > For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see > --------------------------------------------------- > > > One option may be to construct a bigger box in which to store the > > stuff in > > bulk and use smaller, maybe even domestic cool-boxes, to move it from > > there > > to the stage. > > > I was getting tired of students trying to slip chunks of dry ice past > me to make "water bottle bombs" I think someone on this list had a > link for an extremely graphic picture of a cap mark in someones > forehead. Even with that posted I had difficulities. After seeing the > MDG Ice Fog in action I called them up and got a great educational deal > on a "Neused" (demo) unit. Now I change the dewar at the top of a run > and sleep a lot easier. I brought some dry ice to a picnic to keep some ice cream frozen on a hot july day. One less than clueful person at the picnic put some dry ice in a plastic soda pop bottle with some water and sealed the cap back on. Then she put it down in a sunny spot and walked away. After a couple of minutes her and her bozo boyfriends got impatient and went over to pick it up. The ever-reliable Murphy chose that moment to have the bottle burst. She got a sprained thumb and bruises on the palm of her hand. She also got the undivided attention of the park rangers and the cops who happened to be driving by. The rest of us got to pack up out picnic and depart with our tails between our legs. Respect the power of dry ice. --Dale ------------------------------ Message-ID: <001101c4adc3$e7894ee0$6501a8c0 [at] Toshiba2> From: "John D. Palmer" Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most? Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 22:50:37 -0700 O.K. as an end user the item which disappointed me the most was... The DHA Light Curtains. Oh, my goodness, what a pain in the rear they were! Great support from the rental shop. Didn't fail during a show. But, biggus painus in the anus. They took a large amount of time to make them happy in the installation. Every night when initializing them, it was catch as catch can how many tries it would take to get them to all come up on line. BTW, who saw the article in Entertainment Design where, "One manufacturer thinks that rental shops should charge 1-2% of the equipment cost per week in rental." I like how this quote is not attributed to the manufacturer. How would a rental company make any money? Figuring in cost for maintenance and repair would mean that the shop wouldn't turn a profit on that piece of gear for a minimum of 1.5-3yrs. That also doesn't take into account the shop's overhead. I sometimes think that gear is priced pretty crazily, but 1-2% is certifiable. Y'all play safe now, John D. Palmer Palmer & Company Design & Production (213) 453-1547 ------------------------------ End of Stagecraft Digest #157 *****************************