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For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see <http://stagecraft.theprices.net/>
---------------------------------------------------

Stagecraft Digest, Issue #158

 1. Re: need production staff still?
    by "Simon Shuker" <simon [at] ef-ae.com>
 2. Rigging problems that I have seen recently
    by "Delbert Hall" <halld [at] etsu.edu>
 3. Re: Dry Ice Storage.
    by "Duane" <dhoberg [at] kc.rr.com>
 4. Re: LDI
    by MissWisc [at] aol.com
 5. Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux
    by IAEG [at] aol.com
 6. Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently
    by "Dr. Randall W.A. Davidson" <doomster [at] worldnet.att.net>
 7. Re: What rental item disappointed you most?
    by Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
 8. Re: State of the art for drop folding?
    by Loren Schreiber <lschreib [at] mail.sdsu.edu>
 9. Snow Machines and Peg Legs
    by seanrmc [at] earthlink.net
10. Re: State of the art for drop folding?
    by IAEG [at] aol.com
11. Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux
    by "Delbert Hall" <halld [at] etsu.edu>
12. Re: State of the art for drop folding?
    by "Jon Ares" <jonares [at] hevanet.com>
13. Re: What rental item disappointed you most?
    by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
14. Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs
    by Greg Persinger <gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
15. Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs
    by Greg Persinger <gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
16. Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs
    by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
17. Re: State of the art for drop folding?
    by Greg Persinger <gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
18. Re: State of the art for drop folding?
    by IAEG [at] aol.com
19. Re: State of the art for drop folding?
    by Boyd Ostroff <ostroff [at] operaphilly.com>
20. Dry Ice Storage
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
21. west coasting
    by Greg Persinger <gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
22. Rechargable Batteries
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
23. State of the art for drop folding?
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
24. Re: An academic question
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
25. Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs
    by seanrmc [at] earthlink.net
26. Re: An academic question
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
27. need production staff still?
    by CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
28. Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux
    by "Samuel L. Jones" <sjones [at] ucla.edu>
29. Re: An academic question
    by "Jon Ares" <jonares [at] hevanet.com>
30. Re: Dry Ice Storage
    by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
31. Re: An academic question
    by FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
32. Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux
    by IAEG [at] aol.com
33. Re: need production staff still?  ? ? ? ? ? ?
    by IAEG [at] aol.com
34. Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux
    by "Dr. Randall W.A. Davidson" <doomster [at] worldnet.att.net>
35. Re: What rental item disappointed you most?
    by "Jason" <OneOccy [at] hotmail.com>
36. Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux
    by Bsapsis [at] aol.com
37. Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs
    by "Sam Fisher" <Sam [at] FisherTheatrical.com>

*** Please update the subject line of your reply to use the subject
*** line of the message you are replying to! Please only reply to
*** one message subject in each reply.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Simon Shuker" <simon [at] ef-ae.com>
Subject: RE: need production staff still?
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 15:22:51 +0400
In-Reply-To: <list-4621947 [at] prxy.net>
Message-Id: <20041009112256.8D8B45858 [at] mail05.powweb.com>

 What is a productiong crew.??????????????

-----Original Message-----
From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of in a
fishbowl
Sent: Saturday, October 09, 2004 3:09 AM
To: Stagecraft
Subject: need production staff still?

For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see <http://stagecraft.theprices.net/>
---------------------------------------------------

I am interested in working on your film on your productiong crew. I am a
costume designer.  Are you still looking for people?

Laurie



------------------------------

From: "Delbert Hall" <halld [at] etsu.edu>
Subject: Rigging problems that I have seen recently
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 08:06:21 -0400
Organization: ETSU
Message-ID: <000301c4adf8$647bdbf0$6400a8c0 [at] delbert>
In-Reply-To: <list-4625523 [at] prxy.net>

This month has been and will remain very busy.  A few of the theatres
were I have been this month have had some pretty bad rigging problems
and I thought I would share.

Theatre #1 (Florida):  They installed the HVAC ducts both above and
below the grid, directly in line where the lift cable for the linesets
had to go.  Their solution was to punch holes in the ducts and run
electrical conduits through the ducts.  The lift cables then ran through
the conduits (sometimes horizontally and sometimes vertically).  One
problem with this solution, beside the noise, is the fact that
condensation builds up in these conduits and the cables literally sit in
water all the time.  The cables were very rusty.  Also, there was always
water on the stage directly below the vertical conduits.  This rigging
had many problems and was extremely noisy.

Another interesting rigging technique used here was the use of pop
rivets to attach the sections of pipe together to make the battens.  The
battens had a lot of play at the joints.

Theatre #2 (Penn):  This high school theatre (rigged in 1973) only had
one cable clip per termination, both at the batten and at the arbor (and
most of these were on backwards).  This theatre also had some strange
aluminum track that the arbors ran on, and it squealed horribly. 

Theatre #3 (Penn): This community theatre had dead-hung pipes.  I was
told that these were installed by a nationally known stage rigging
company (name withheld).  The problems here included: S hooks being used
on the trim chains, and all the batten joints were made with threaded
couplers.  

I get to see a lot of good theatre rigging and a lot of bad.  I am no
longer surprised when the folks with the bad stuff 1) are in denial
about the state of their rigging, or 2) blame me for not telling them in
advance that their rigging is sub-standard.  

The point of my rant is to ask you to 1) make sure your rigging is OK,
and 2) don't be afraid to tells others when you see a problem with their
rigging.  It is never fun to have to tell someone that before I can
install my equipment we must spend the next few hours making sure that
your battens are not going to fall out of air.

-Delbert


------------------------------

Message-ID: <030e01c4ae01$366670a0$0201a8c0 [at] kc.rr.com>
From: "Duane" <dhoberg [at] kc.rr.com>
References: <list-4625167 [at] prxy.net>
Subject: Re: Dry Ice Storage.
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 08:09:29 -0500

Dry Ice does not melt. It sublimates. Long term storage requires minimizing
the amount of surface area exposed to ambient air.  Solid blocks will last
longer than tubes or chunks.  Hot air moves more, increasing the rate of
sublimation as the amount of air moving past the Dry Ice surface increases.

The suggestion to wrap blocks in multiple layers of newspaper would make
what you buy last the longest.  Most companies wrap their product in a waxed
impregnated heavy paper because air tight plastic plastic becomes brittle
and breaks under the extreme cold allowing air to contact the surface.
Leave the original wrapping on as long as possible.

Try to find or make an air tight box that just fits the size and amount of
dry ice you need for each performance.  An air tight lid that fits inside
the container and rests on top of a towel, blanket, or similar on top of the
Dry Ice as you use it helps keep ambient air contact to a minimum.  A strip
of ethafoam or similar around the edge of the internal lid creates a nice
air fast seal and if contact with the Dry Ice is minimized should last a few
weeks.

If buying chunks or tubes.  The smaller the container that just fits the
amount needed to store the better.  Again a tight fitting lid should fit
inside the container that rests on top of a folded up towel on top of the
Dry Ice to minimize the surface area expose to air.

Insulation is for protection from the cold as the dry ice or the box itself
is handled.  It assists in decreasing the amount of air that can contact the
Dry Ice but the real secret is no contact with the air.  If using a freezer
chest, do not plug it in and create an internal lid that sits on top of the
ice or create multiple compartments with lids inside the chest.  If the
chest is large, a second person who does not lean into the chest to get ice
out is recommended.

Block carriers or bags of washed heavy muslin that just fit the ice you
require go a long way to increase the handlers safety when removing ice from
the container.  The bag or carrier also allow the box to just fit the size
of the Dry Ice, minimizing the amount of air around the block since you do
not require a space for hands to grasp the Dry Ice.  Just fold the strip
neatly on top and place the next block inside.  Make sure the cloth is very
dry prior to wrapping or bagging.  A layer or two of paper on the bottom and
between blocks or bags prevents the cloth from freezing to itself and tears
apart easier if anything does freeze together,

Since CO2 is heavier than air, low lying areas will fill up with the CO2,
displacing any atmosphere present.  Orchestra pits and trap rooms sometimes
have minimal air movement so an auxillary air movemment assist is sometimes
necessary depending upon the amount of CO2 generated.  This build up may
occur over time and be cummulative over performances so action to move extra
air to excess between performances in such low lying areas if in doubt would
be prudent.

Duane Hoberg
Technical Director
New Theatre Restaurant
Overland Park, Kansas



------------------------------

From: MissWisc [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <53.1814818a.2e994a8c [at] aol.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 10:07:08 EDT
Subject: Re:  Re: LDI
Cc: ladesigners [at] juno.com

In a message dated 10/8/4 9:34:39 AM, ladesigners [at] juno.com wrote:
<<Naturally, both ELS and TMB will supply us with their booth numbers, but
when? Do we really have to look them up in the thick LDI showguide?
/s/ Richard>>

From the sounds of things, Richard, you should be able to follow your nose 
right to them! And if you end up in another booth with bar, you can just say 
you're doing an expo "death march" (Appleton, WI slang term for going up and down 
College Avenue having one drink in each bar/restaurant with a bar - all 20 or 
so of them.)

Kristi

------------------------------

From: IAEG [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <12c.4ddb5e73.2e994cc8 [at] aol.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 10:16:40 EDT
Subject: Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux


In a message dated 10/9/04 8:07:12 AM, halld [at] etsu.edu writes:

<< 
This month has been and will remain very busy.  A few of the theatres
were I have been this month have had some pretty bad rigging problems
and I thought I would share.

Theatre #1 (Florida):  They installed the HVAC ducts both above and
below the grid, directly in line where the lift cable for the linesets
had to go.  Their solution was to punch holes in the ducts and run
electrical conduits through the ducts.  The lift cables then ran through
the conduits (sometimes horizontally and sometimes vertically).  One
problem with this solution, beside the noise, is the fact that
condensation builds up in these conduits and the cables literally sit in
water all the time.  The cables were very rusty.  Also, there was always
water on the stage directly below the vertical conduits.  This rigging
had many problems and was extremely noisy.

Another interesting rigging technique used here was the use of pop
rivets to attach the sections of pipe together to make the battens.  The
battens had a lot of play at the joints. >>



Delbert is actually being "kind" about this theatre, a community college 
facility built in the late 70's.

The proscenium theatre is on the second floor, with a loading door that opens 
out 15' above grade, directly over the door of a classroom and adjacent to 
large tree. The front of house lighting position is not accesible via a cat 
walk, the entire structure was mounted on a hand powered worm gear winch. Even in 
the lowered position it hit the side balconies meaning that a ladder periously 
placed in the seating area was still neccesary to mount or remove 
instruments.  Eventually the winch failed and the FOH was permanently tied off in the 
"up" position and now the only access to the FOH is via an extension ladder 
leaning on it.

There are no dressing rooms in this theatre, or running water backstage.  To 
access dressing rooms one must go down stairs,  cross the public lobby and 
enter the scene shop (originally it was a scene shop now it is perhaps the worlds 
smallest university dance studio) and then into the dressing rooms which were 
adjacent to the black box theatre on the other side of the building.

The two side balconies, (well they aren't really balconies , but I don't know 
how else to describe them ) have the unusual distinction of having the first 
two rows of seats actually HIGHER than the third.  Sight lines from these two 
areas are so bad that they are seldom used. From most of these seats a pianist 
playing downstage center would be unseen by people in the first 5 -6 rows.

Actually this list of faux pas' could go on and on and on.  This venue is a 
great example of a waste of taxpayer dollars and a situation where faculty and 
outside input was literally told to "go away" during the design and 
construction process.

I accidently blasted the architect for this venue in a public setting when 
the building first opened. I believe I used the word "malfeasance" I didn't know 
his wife was present. She gave me a tongue lashing as I obvioiusly didn't 
know what I was talking about.

The scary part is this architect is now in an offical architectual position 
for the State Board of Education.

Hopefully Delbert and Tracy's work on this theatre will at least make it 
safer if not more functional.

very best, 

Keith Arsenault
International Arts & Entertainment Group
Tampa, FL

------------------------------

From: "Dr. Randall W.A. Davidson" <doomster [at] worldnet.att.net>
Subject: RE: Rigging problems that I have seen recently
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 07:24:09 -0700
Message-ID: <00a401c4ae0b$a4f96ea0$726dfea9 [at] DrDoomsComputer>
In-Reply-To: <list-4625722 [at] prxy.net>

D=E9j=E0 vu! Good advice. Dr. Doom. In sixty four years of rigging, I  =
can
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A Masters Workshop for Entertainment Technicians, Riggers, Public
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Sponsored by Risk International & Associates, Inc.    April 4, 5, 6,
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Website: www.riskit.com E-mail: rdavidson [at] riskit.com
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=3D=3D

-----Original Message-----
From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of Delbert
Hall
Sent: Saturday, October 09, 2004 5:06 AM
To: Stagecraft
Subject: Rigging problems that I have seen recently

For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see <http://stagecraft.theprices.net/>
---------------------------------------------------

This month has been and will remain very busy.  A few of the theatres
were I have been this month have had some pretty bad rigging problems
and I thought I would share.

Theatre #1 (Florida):  They installed the HVAC ducts both above and
below the grid, directly in line where the lift cable for the linesets
had to go.  Their solution was to punch holes in the ducts and run
electrical conduits through the ducts.  The lift cables then ran through
the conduits (sometimes horizontally and sometimes vertically).  One
problem with this solution, beside the noise, is the fact that
condensation builds up in these conduits and the cables literally sit in
water all the time.  The cables were very rusty.  Also, there was always
water on the stage directly below the vertical conduits.  This rigging
had many problems and was extremely noisy.

Another interesting rigging technique used here was the use of pop
rivets to attach the sections of pipe together to make the battens.  The
battens had a lot of play at the joints.

Theatre #2 (Penn):  This high school theatre (rigged in 1973) only had
one cable clip per termination, both at the batten and at the arbor (and
most of these were on backwards).  This theatre also had some strange
aluminum track that the arbors ran on, and it squealed horribly.=20

Theatre #3 (Penn): This community theatre had dead-hung pipes.  I was
told that these were installed by a nationally known stage rigging
company (name withheld).  The problems here included: S hooks being used
on the trim chains, and all the batten joints were made with threaded
couplers. =20

I get to see a lot of good theatre rigging and a lot of bad.  I am no
longer surprised when the folks with the bad stuff 1) are in denial
about the state of their rigging, or 2) blame me for not telling them in
advance that their rigging is sub-standard. =20

The point of my rant is to ask you to 1) make sure your rigging is OK,
and 2) don't be afraid to tells others when you see a problem with their
rigging.  It is never fun to have to tell someone that before I can
install my equipment we must spend the next few hours making sure that
your battens are not going to fall out of air.

-Delbert


------------------------------

Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 16:34:40 +0100 (BST)
From: Charlie Richmond <charlier [at] RichmondSoundDesign.com>
Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most?
In-Reply-To: <list-4624119 [at] prxy.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.60.0410091628320.5286 [at] viscount.richmondsounddesign.com>
References: <list-4624119 [at] prxy.net>

On Fri, 8 Oct 2004, John D. Palmer wrote:

> BTW, who saw the article in Entertainment Design where, "One manufacturer 
> thinks that rental shops should charge 1-2% of the equipment cost per week in 
> rental."  I like how this quote is not attributed to the manufacturer.  How 
> would a rental company make any money?  Figuring in cost for maintenance and 
> repair would mean that the shop wouldn't turn a profit on that piece of gear 
> for a minimum of 1.5-3yrs.  That also doesn't take into account the shop's 
> overhead.  I sometimes think that gear is priced pretty crazily, but 1-2% is 
> certifiable.

We are one manufacturer who agrees wit' ya!  We appreciate more than you can 
say those rental companies who provide the invaluable service of stocking, 
servicing, shipping and supporting our equipment on a rental basis.  We will 
rent equipment if there is no rental house that has it but much prefer to have 
rental customers work with rental houses and feel that their charges are fully 
justified!

Charlie

+ Charlie Richmond - Richmond Sound Design Ltd - Aura Show Control Ltd +
+ http://www.RichmondSoundDesign.com -- http://www.AuraShowControl.com +
+---- "Performance for the Long Run" ----- "Creativity in Control" ----+

------------------------------

Message-Id: <6.1.1.1.2.20041009082941.0344bca0 [at] mail.sdsu.edu>
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 08:39:26 -0700
From: Loren Schreiber <lschreib [at] mail.sdsu.edu>
Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding?
In-Reply-To: <list-4625167 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-4625167 [at] prxy.net>

There are a couple of reasons to "reef" a drop--which is what I think y'all 
meant by folding accordion style:

One reason is when there is no room to lay the drop out to fold it. You can 
pull the drop out of a big pile on the floor and fold it neatly by reefing. 
This is what is done on boats where there is no room to lay a sail out 
flat. Secondly, the drop can be folded as the batten is lowered, allowing 
one to fold the drop before the rest of the stage is clear. Finally, the 
drop is less likely to pick up dirt, screws, small children, etc. when 
reefed. Most rental houses are not in the habit of over-painting old drops, 
so theirs are likely to be more supple and have fewer problems with creasing.






Loren Schreiber, Director of Technology and Production
School of Theatre, Television and Film, San Diego State University
http://www-rohan.sdsu.edu/faculty/schreibr/index.html



------------------------------

Message-ID: <22574537.1097340730982.JavaMail.root [at] ernie.psp.pas.earthlink.net>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 12:52:10 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: seanrmc [at] earthlink.net
Subject: Snow Machines and Peg Legs

Hi all...

So, I'm looking for recommendations for small (QUIET) snow machines.  The output doesn't need to be that heavy (this is for some "outside the window" snow), just quiet and perhaps cheap.  Buy or rent is fine.

Also...

The costume folks are looking for a "peg-leg."  You know, like a pirate.  NOT a prosthetic wooden leg, just a dowel and harness type thing.

Any thoughts for purchase or rent?

Thanks all!

--Sean

Sean R. McCarthy
seanrmc [at] earthlink.net


------------------------------

From: IAEG [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <82.18094d80.2e9972f3 [at] aol.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 12:59:31 EDT
Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding?


In a message dated 10/9/04 11:41:02 AM, lschreib [at] mail.sdsu.edu writes:

<< 
There are a couple of reasons to "reef" a drop--which is what I think y'all 
meant by folding accordion style:

One reason is when there is no room to lay the drop out to fold it. You can 
pull the drop out of a big pile on the floor and fold it neatly by reefing. 
This is what is done on boats where there is no room to lay a sail out 
flat. Secondly, the drop can be folded as the batten is lowered, allowing 
one to fold the drop before the rest of the stage is clear. Finally, the 
drop is less likely to pick up dirt, screws, small children, etc. when 
reefed. Most rental houses are not in the habit of over-painting old drops, 
so theirs are likely to be more supple and have fewer problems with creasing. 
>>

nope , , i what everyone is refering to as "accordian" fold or "shop" fold 
the "folds" are vertical, , what you are refering to as "reefing" the folds /  
creases would be horizontal. Reefing  is what we also call "west coasting" 
correct ? ?

very best, 

Keith Arsenault
International Arts & Entertainment Group
Tampa, FL

------------------------------

From: "Delbert Hall" <halld [at] etsu.edu>
Subject: RE: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 12:59:58 -0400
Organization: ETSU
Message-ID: <000001c4ae21$690ab640$6400a8c0 [at] delbert>
In-Reply-To: <list-4640189 [at] prxy.net>

Keith knows this Florida theatre pretty well.  After spending four days
there I wanted to slap the architect silly.  I did not mention that fact
that all of the lift lines for the #1 lineset have been muled so that
worker can access the trap door to the roof, but doing this means that
the cable enters the #2 loft block at a 30 degree angle.  Can you say
bad fleet angle?

-Delbert


Delbert is actually being "kind" about this theatre, a community college

facility built in the late 70's.

The proscenium theatre is on the second floor, with a loading door that
opens 
out 15' above grade, directly over the door of a classroom and adjacent
to 
large tree. The front of house lighting position is not accesible via a
cat 
walk, the entire structure was mounted on a hand powered worm gear
winch. Even in 
the lowered position it hit the side balconies meaning that a ladder
periously 
placed in the seating area was still neccesary to mount or remove 
instruments.  Eventually the winch failed and the FOH was permanently
tied off in the 
"up" position and now the only access to the FOH is via an extension
ladder 
leaning on it.

There are no dressing rooms in this theatre, or running water backstage.
To 
access dressing rooms one must go down stairs,  cross the public lobby
and 
enter the scene shop (originally it was a scene shop now it is perhaps
the worlds 
smallest university dance studio) and then into the dressing rooms which
were 
adjacent to the black box theatre on the other side of the building.

The two side balconies, (well they aren't really balconies , but I don't
know 
how else to describe them ) have the unusual distinction of having the
first 
two rows of seats actually HIGHER than the third.  Sight lines from
these two 
areas are so bad that they are seldom used. From most of these seats a
pianist 
playing downstage center would be unseen by people in the first 5 -6
rows.

Actually this list of faux pas' could go on and on and on.  This venue
is a 
great example of a waste of taxpayer dollars and a situation where
faculty and 
outside input was literally told to "go away" during the design and 
construction process.

I accidently blasted the architect for this venue in a public setting
when 
the building first opened. I believe I used the word "malfeasance" I
didn't know 
his wife was present. She gave me a tongue lashing as I obvioiusly
didn't 
know what I was talking about.

The scary part is this architect is now in an offical architectual
position 
for the State Board of Education.

Hopefully Delbert and Tracy's work on this theatre will at least make it

safer if not more functional.

very best, 

Keith Arsenault
International Arts & Entertainment Group
Tampa, FL


------------------------------

Message-ID: <006c01c4ae22$8f70c530$0600000a [at] BRUTUS>
From: "Jon Ares" <jonares [at] hevanet.com>
References: <list-4625167 [at] prxy.net> <list-4640616 [at] prxy.net>
Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding?
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 10:08:12 -0700

> Secondly, the drop can be folded as the batten is lowered, allowing one to 
> fold the drop before the rest of the stage is clear.

Yeah, I could understand if this drop company wanted the drop 'reefed' (like 
a sail) or 'West Coasted' with the accordian folds running horizontally, but 
they desire it to be accordianed vertically - left to right.  As if it were 
a traveler on a track.

    -- Jon Ares
Program Director, West Linn HS Theatre Arts
www.hevanet.com/acreative
http://www.wlhs.wlwv.k12.or.us/aresj/theatre/index.htm 


------------------------------

From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <68.465990ea.2e99791a [at] aol.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 13:25:46 EDT
Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most?

In a message dated 09/10/04 06:51:20 GMT Daylight Time, 
john [at] palmerandcompany.biz writes:

> BTW, who saw the article in Entertainment Design where, "One 
>  manufacturer thinks that rental shops should charge 1-2% of 
>  the equipment cost per week in rental."  I like how this 
>  quote is not attributed to the manufacturer.  How would a 
>  rental company make any money?  Figuring in cost for 
>  maintenance and repair would mean that the shop wouldn't 
>  turn a profit on that piece of gear for a minimum of 
>  1.5-3yrs.  That also doesn't take into account the shop's 
>  overhead.  I sometimes think that gear is priced pretty 
>  crazily, but 1-2% is certifiable.

My recollection is that they charge about 10% if the capital cost of the 
equipment, per week. Out of this they have to pay for storage space, bulbs, and 
maintenance and office staff, plus repaying the loan they took out to buy in 
their stock.

On this basis, if you're going to want something ten times a year, it's as 
cheap to buy it in. How easy this is to do depends on your financial 
arrangements. Hire costs come off the show budget, capital expenditure off the 
departmental budget. Often, these two don't mix easily.


Frank Wood

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 12:29:56 -0500
Subject: Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs
From: Greg Persinger <gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
Message-ID: <BD8D8A44.78C2%gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
In-Reply-To: <list-4640962 [at] prxy.net>

Sean,

A couple of years ago a client of mine purchased a snow machine that was
made of cardboard and had an AC electric motor  that slowly drove a series
of blades that scraped through the box.. The bottom of the box was full of
perforated holes and you could punch out as few or many as you liked to vary
the amount of snow.

You filled it with the plastic flakes and away you went. They worked great,
looked good, were cheap and quiet.

They got them from a supplier that sold retail store window display
products.  Might try a google search.


Greg Persinger
Vivid Illumination

Greg [at] Vividillumination.com





------------------------------

Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 12:46:02 -0500
Subject: Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs
From: Greg Persinger <gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
Message-ID: <BD8D8E0A.78C5%gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
In-Reply-To: <list-4640962 [at] prxy.net>

Here it is.

www.snowmaker.net

Check it out. 


Greg Persinger
Vivid Illumination

Greg [at] Vividillumination.com



------------------------------

From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <15.352d9b83.2e997f4f [at] aol.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 13:52:15 EDT
Subject: Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs

In a message dated 09/10/04 18:31:13 GMT Daylight Time, 
gregpersin [at] comcast.net writes:

> A couple of years ago a client of mine purchased a snow machine that was
>  made of cardboard and had an AC electric motor  that slowly drove a series
>  of blades that scraped through the box.. The bottom of the box was full of
>  perforated holes and you could punch out as few or many as you liked to 
vary
>  the amount of snow.

The classic snow machine is a half loop of sheets with slits in them, rigged 
between two battens and charged with snow. Jiggle one batten, and it snows; 
stop and it doesn't. It works, and is quiet.


Frank Wood

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 12:56:08 -0500
Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding?
From: Greg Persinger <gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
Message-ID: <BD8D9068.78C9%gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
In-Reply-To: <list-4641008 [at] prxy.net>

Keith Arsenault wrote:

> nope , , i what everyone is refering to as "accordian" fold or "shop" fold
> the "folds" are vertical, , what you are refering to as "reefing" the folds /
> creases would be horizontal. Reefing  is what we also call "west coasting"
> correct ? ?

In the rock and roll circles that I used to run in we had a different
definition for the term "west coasting" .

To do a "west coast" you let the drop pile up in a straight line underneath
the pipe or truss as the hang position was lowered in. You then untied the
drop and let the ties fall on top of the pile. You then went through and
tied every fourth tie or so to make a drape "tube" which then got coiled
into a hamper, or better yet a hard road case,  like a piece of cable.

Although this is horrible for long term storage, when you are playing a new
town almost every night it's not that bad as the wrinkles hang out before
showtime.

I was told the idea came from the way they did sails in California. Anybody
else want to weigh in?


Greg Persinger
Vivid Illumination

Greg [at] Vividillumination.com



------------------------------

From: IAEG [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <19e.2a3ca90f.2e9981c9 [at] aol.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 14:02:49 EDT
Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding?


In a message dated 10/9/04 1:57:30 PM, gregpersin [at] comcast.net writes:

<< 
Although this is horrible for long term storage, when you are playing a new
town almost every night it's not that bad as the wrinkles hang out before
showtime. >>

it's fine for scrims, , dyed drops, etc, , the better the drop and the 
painting the less effect that "west coasting" has on it.

very best, 

Keith Arsenault
International Arts & Entertainment Group
Tampa, FL

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 14:03:20 -0400 (EDT)
From: Boyd Ostroff <ostroff [at] operaphilly.com>
Subject: Re: State of the art for drop folding?
In-Reply-To: <list-4641310 [at] prxy.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0410091401390.15277-100000 [at] aria.operaphilly.com>

On Sat, 9 Oct 2004, Greg Persinger wrote:

> To do a "west coast" you let the drop pile up in a straight line underneath
> the pipe or truss as the hang position was lowered in. You then untied the
> drop and let the ties fall on top of the pile.

I have always heard this technique called "west coasting" also.

Boyd Ostroff                          ooo      Opera Company of Philadelphia
Director of Design & Technology     ooooooo        1420 Locust St, Suite 210
ostroff [at] operaphilly.com             ooooooo           Philadelphia, PA 19102
http://tech.operaphilly.com           ooo                (215) 893-3600 x225


------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20041009110630.01962510 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 11:06:30
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Dry Ice Storage

>The added complication is that the supplier is NOT open at weekends, 

When confronted with a similar situation, our supplier was willing to send
us with one of his storage boxes for the run of the show.  Additional
charges: a seat for each of his family members.  Cheap at twice the price.
Check with your supplier, and start the conversation with asking him to
show up for a few minutes on Sat. and Sun. mornings...
Or, borrow a large freezer.
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 13:08:26 -0500
Subject: west coasting
From: Greg Persinger <gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
Message-ID: <BD8D934A.78CD%gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
In-Reply-To: <list-4641359 [at] prxy.net>

One thing I might add is that on tour these were usually black backdrops,
and  white or black scrims, never anything painted.


Greg Persinger
Vivid Illumination

Greg [at] Vividillumination.com



------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20041009111204.01962510 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 11:12:04
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Rechargable Batteries

>I am looking for both the pros and cons, battery life and other useful
>information.

I've forwarded your post to a friend of mine who has done a bit of
empirical data gathering.  Let us know what he tells you.
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20041009111604.01962510 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 11:16:04
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: State of the art for drop folding?

>to our surprise, they were folded in some soft of 'accordian' style

Welcome to 'West-Coasting'!  'Proper' is so personal and subjective
nowadays.
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20041009112916.01962510 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 11:29:16
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: Re: An academic question

>Fram an amateur point of view, many of us do both.

Yes, but when I do things for friends for fun, I tend to be the Chief Head
Electric  Sound Prop Carpenter in charge of Scenery and Concessions.  In a
professional environment, "My dad has a barn!"  is not a great way to start
a discussion on making theatre.
The question, as evidenced by the subject line, was how this might be dealt
with in an academic environment.  Hopefully, those pursuits are designed to
lead to a professional environment.  Using an amateur point of view when
answering the question is rather less than useful, at least for the
students hoping to get jobs as a result of thier time spent.
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-ID: <3867167.1097347216355.JavaMail.root [at] ernie.psp.pas.earthlink.net>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 11:40:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: seanrmc [at] earthlink.net
Subject: Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs

Thanks all for the quick responses, but I've not done a good job describing what we need.

We have a rapid change of seasons happening behind several windows.  Rain, snow, falling leaves.  We would like to dry and reuse the leaves, but don't want to deal with a slurry of wet "snow", so we want to use one of those "soap suds" snow machines.  We've got the technology to do falling "stuff", I'm looking for snow that doesn't accumulate.

Still need a peg-leg ;)

--Sean

Sean R. McCarthy
seanrmc [at] earthlink.net


-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Persinger <gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
Sent: Oct 9, 2004 10:46 AM
To: Stagecraft <stagecraft [at] theatrical.net>
Subject: Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs

For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see <http://stagecraft.theprices.net/>
---------------------------------------------------

Here it is.

www.snowmaker.net

Check it out. 


Greg Persinger
Vivid Illumination

Greg [at] Vividillumination.com




------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20041009114242.01962510 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 11:42:42
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: RE: An academic question

>Let's not forget Winston- Salem NC, home of RJ Reynolds. 

Oh, no.  I once ran an IMAG camera for a Ligget meeting at one of the
resorts out here, and commented to the director that it was realy hard to
concentrate with all of the smokers in the room.  I smoke, and we hadn't
had a break in a whilke, and I was jonsin' a bit.  We were in a resort
ballroom, and one never smokes in a resort ballroom in AZ.  Unless, one is
a cigarette manufacturer and one is paying a mint for said resort ballroom.
 Anyhoo, the directors response was, "Well, light up!"  
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20041009114446.01962510 [at] pop.west.cox.net>
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 11:44:46
From: CB <psyd [at] cox.net>
Subject: need production staff still?

>I am interested in working on your film on your productiong crew. I am
>a costume designer.  Are you still looking for people?
>
>Laurie

I am a qualified PSM, with seven features, much television, and a handfull
of commercial credits.  I am interested in working on your crew as well.
What does it pay, what is the project, and where is it?
				Chris "Chris" Babbie
				Location Sound
				MON AZ

Delete key training and post trimming done by appointment.  Rates
negotiable, will trade for typing lessons/ADD treatment...

------------------------------

In-Reply-To: <list-4641018 [at] prxy.net>
References: <list-4641018 [at] prxy.net>
Message-Id: <182D591A-1A30-11D9-BAC9-00039313C6D2 [at] ucla.edu.>
From: "Samuel L. Jones" <sjones [at] ucla.edu>
Subject: Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 13:16:25 -0700

OK guys, this is absurd; name names.  This place needs to be ridiculed 
in public, and the architect ridiculed in public.  You just state the 
facts; I'll do the ridiculing.  If what you say is true, the place is a 
public menace.  I can't believe there would be any liability for 
stating these facts.  If you think there might be send me the info; 
I'll do the yelling.  Hey, Let's go to trial.  If the faculty and 
outside input were told to "go away," I don't think "malfeasance" is 
too harsh a word.  Now that I've blown off that head of steam, a few 
things come to mind.  I don't know what the specifications presented to 
the architect were for this space, who made them, and what the budget 
was.  Wait a minute, I don't care.  Include them all for ridicule.  
What is described below robbed the college of a useable space.  Maybe 
it would have had to become a cafeteria, computer lab or classroom; I 
don't know.  It sounds like one scary place.

Sam
Samuel L. Jones
Technical Director,
Dance Program, Dept. of World Arts and Cultures, UCLA.
sjones [at] arts.ucla.edu
========================================================================

On Oct 9, 2004, at 9:59 AM, Delbert Hall wrote:

> For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see 
> <http://stagecraft.theprices.net/>
> ---------------------------------------------------
>
> Keith knows this Florida theatre pretty well.  After spending four days
> there I wanted to slap the architect silly.  I did not mention that 
> fact
> that all of the lift lines for the #1 lineset have been muled so that
> worker can access the trap door to the roof, but doing this means that
> the cable enters the #2 loft block at a 30 degree angle.  Can you say
> bad fleet angle?
>
> -Delbert
>
>
> Delbert is actually being "kind" about this theatre, a community 
> college
>
> facility built in the late 70's.
>
> The proscenium theatre is on the second floor, with a loading door that
> opens
> out 15' above grade, directly over the door of a classroom and adjacent
> to
> large tree. The front of house lighting position is not accesible via a
> cat
> walk, the entire structure was mounted on a hand powered worm gear
> winch. Even in
> the lowered position it hit the side balconies meaning that a ladder
> periously
> placed in the seating area was still neccesary to mount or remove
> instruments.  Eventually the winch failed and the FOH was permanently
> tied off in the
> "up" position and now the only access to the FOH is via an extension
> ladder
> leaning on it.
>
> There are no dressing rooms in this theatre, or running water 
> backstage.
> To
> access dressing rooms one must go down stairs,  cross the public lobby
> and
> enter the scene shop (originally it was a scene shop now it is perhaps
> the worlds
> smallest university dance studio) and then into the dressing rooms 
> which
> were
> adjacent to the black box theatre on the other side of the building.
>
> The two side balconies, (well they aren't really balconies , but I 
> don't
> know
> how else to describe them ) have the unusual distinction of having the
> first
> two rows of seats actually HIGHER than the third.  Sight lines from
> these two
> areas are so bad that they are seldom used. From most of these seats a
> pianist
> playing downstage center would be unseen by people in the first 5 -6
> rows.
>
> Actually this list of faux pas' could go on and on and on.  This venue
> is a
> great example of a waste of taxpayer dollars and a situation where
> faculty and
> outside input was literally told to "go away" during the design and
> construction process.
>
> I accidently blasted the architect for this venue in a public setting
> when
> the building first opened. I believe I used the word "malfeasance" I
> didn't know
> his wife was present. She gave me a tongue lashing as I obvioiusly
> didn't
> know what I was talking about.
>
> The scary part is this architect is now in an offical architectual
> position
> for the State Board of Education.
>
> Hopefully Delbert and Tracy's work on this theatre will at least make 
> it
>
> safer if not more functional.
>
> very best,
>
> Keith Arsenault
> International Arts & Entertainment Group
> Tampa, FL
>


------------------------------

Message-ID: <00a501c4ae42$e9ffda70$0600000a [at] BRUTUS>
From: "Jon Ares" <jonares [at] hevanet.com>
References: <list-4641620 [at] prxy.net>
Subject: Re: An academic question
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 13:59:48 -0700

> Oh, no.  I once ran an IMAG camera for a Ligget meeting at one of the
> resorts out here, and commented to the director that it was realy hard to
> concentrate with all of the smokers in the room.

I once did a 3-day gig with a sales meeting of US Tobacco...  some smokers, 
to be sure (ashtrays placed on all the attendees' tables) but that wasn't 
the worst part.  The truly disgusting part were all the spit-cups placed on 
the tables.  US Tobacco makes not only cigs, but also chewing tobacco, such 
at Copenhagen, Skoal, etc.   (I think they've changed their name since then, 
but I don't recall the name.)  Ugh... truly disgusting.  I would have hated 
to be one of the housekeepers for those ballrooms - emptying spit cups.

At the time, they also used to own Cabin Fever Entertainment (producers of 
Lonesome Dove and other films and MFTV movies) and Columbia Crest Wineries. 
Things probably have changed now, as they always do.

     -- Jon Ares
Program Director, West Linn HS Theatre Arts
www.hevanet.com/acreative
http://www.wlhs.wlwv.k12.or.us/aresj/theatre/index.htm 


------------------------------

From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <9b.4ff1fce0.2e99bbd0 [at] aol.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:10:24 EDT
Subject: Re: Dry Ice Storage

In a message dated 09/10/04 19:08:16 GMT Daylight Time, psyd [at] cox.net writes:

> When confronted with a similar situation, our supplier was willing to send
>  us with one of his storage boxes for the run of the show.  Additional
>  charges: a seat for each of his family members.  Cheap at twice the price.
>  Check with your supplier, and start the conversation with asking him to
>  show up for a few minutes on Sat. and Sun. mornings...
>  Or, borrow a large freezer.

Freezers are contra-indicated, given that dry ice is at -40 degrees.

When we had this problem, we built a stout wooden box which, when lined with 
2" polystyrene foam, was the size of a block of dry ice. At half a block a 
performance, this held up for two days.

When not in use for dry ice storage, it doubled as a live door slam effect, 
with the addition of a rim latch.



Frank Wood

------------------------------

From: FrankWood95 [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <127.4c815a2a.2e99be79 [at] aol.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:21:45 EDT
Subject: Re: An academic question

In a message dated 09/10/04 19:31:21 GMT Daylight Time, psyd [at] cox.net writes:

> The question, as evidenced by the subject line, was how this might be dealt
>  with in an academic environment.  Hopefully, those pursuits are designed to
>  lead to a professional environment.  Using an amateur point of view when
>  answering the question is rather less than useful, at least for the
>  students hoping to get jobs as a result of thier time spent.

You learn your trade by doing it. Whether in an amateur or professional 
environment, good work is good work, and you will know what you have done, good or 
bad.

Myself, I think you learn more from bad work. Getting it right tends to make 
you complacent. Getting it wrong, and knowing it, makes you question your 
approach to the job. 



Frank Wood

------------------------------

From: IAEG [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <53.181e2a5c.2e99dc50 [at] aol.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 20:29:04 EDT
Subject: Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux


In a message dated 10/9/04 4:17:14 PM, sjones [at] ucla.edu writes:

<< What is described below robbed the college of a useable space.  >>

actually, , they are already, only 30 years after the original construction, 
considering tearing it down.  I am on the road , and will be for another 2 
weeks, , when I return if you remind me I will dig up some of the "hard facts" on 
those responsible.

very best, 

Keith Arsenault
International Arts & Entertainment Group
Tampa, FL

------------------------------

From: IAEG [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <45.18109b21.2e99dd43 [at] aol.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 20:33:07 EDT
Subject: Re: need production staff still?  ? ? ? ? ? ?


who /   what /  how did this thread start  ? ? ? ?


In a message dated 10/9/04 2:46:45 PM, psyd [at] cox.net writes:
<< >I am interested in working on your film on your productiong crew. I am
>a costume designer.  Are you still looking for people?
>
>Laurie

I am a qualified PSM, with seven features, much television, and a handfull
of commercial credits.  I am interested in working on your crew as well.
What does it pay, what is the project, and where is it?
                Chris "Chris" Babbie
                Location Sound
                MON AZ >>



very best, 

Keith Arsenault
International Arts & Entertainment Group
Tampa, FL

------------------------------

From: "Dr. Randall W.A. Davidson" <doomster [at] worldnet.att.net>
Subject: RE: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:06:12 -0700
Message-ID: <000001c4ae65$58adc690$726dfea9 [at] DrDoomsComputer>
In-Reply-To: <list-4643265 [at] prxy.net>

PLEASE LET ME KNOW. DR. DOOM

====================================================
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Assembly Technicians, and Educational Performing Arts Personnel -
Sponsored by Risk International & Associates, Inc.    April 4, 5, 6,
2005 at ELCO Performing Arts Center, Elkhart, Indiana

Brochure & Registration Form available at: www.riskit.com/workshops
====================================================
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-----Original Message-----
From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of
IAEG [at] aol.com
Sent: Saturday, October 09, 2004 5:29 PM
To: Stagecraft
Subject: Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux

For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see <http://stagecraft.theprices.net/>
---------------------------------------------------


In a message dated 10/9/04 4:17:14 PM, sjones [at] ucla.edu writes:

<< What is described below robbed the college of a useable space.  >>

actually, , they are already, only 30 years after the original
construction, 
considering tearing it down.  I am on the road , and will be for another
2 
weeks, , when I return if you remind me I will dig up some of the "hard
facts" on 
those responsible.

very best, 

Keith Arsenault
International Arts & Entertainment Group
Tampa, FL


------------------------------

From: "Jason" <OneOccy [at] hotmail.com>
References: <list-4641138 [at] prxy.net>
Subject: Re: What rental item disappointed you most?
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:31:15 -0700
Message-ID: <BAY24-DAV4opYC98Bi800002f11 [at] hotmail.com>

That pretty much the norm but now they have a lamp charge too...
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <FrankWood95 [at] aol.com>
> My recollection is that they charge about 10% if the capital cost of the
> equipment, per week. Out of this they have to pay for storage space,
bulbs, and
> maintenance and office staff, plus repaying the loan they took out to buy
in
> their stock.
>
> On this basis, if you're going to want something ten times a year, it's as
> cheap to buy it in. How easy this is to do depends on your financial
> arrangements. Hire costs come off the show budget, capital expenditure off
the
> departmental budget. Often, these two don't mix easily.
>
>
> Frank Wood
>

------------------------------

From: Bsapsis [at] aol.com
Message-ID: <d2.1872c2b3.2e9a0181 [at] aol.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 23:07:45 EDT
Subject: Re: Rigging problems that I have seen recently re dux


In a message dated 10/9/04 4:17:14 PM, sjones [at] ucla.edu writes:

<< OK guys, this is absurd; name names.  This place needs to be ridiculed 
in public, and the architect ridiculed in public.  You just state the 
facts; I'll do the ridiculing.  If what you say is true, the place is a 
public menace.  I can't believe there would be any liability for 
stating these facts.  If you think there might be send me the info; 
I'll do the yelling.  Hey, Let's go to trial.  If the faculty and 
outside input were told to "go away," I don't think "malfeasance" is 
too harsh a word.  Now that I've blown off that head of steam, a few 
things come to mind.  I don't know what the specifications presented to 
the architect were for this space, who made them, and what the budget 
was.  Wait a minute, I don't care.  Include them all for ridicule.  
What is described below robbed the college of a useable space.  Maybe 
it would have had to become a cafeteria, computer lab or classroom; I 
don't know.  It sounds like one scary place. >>


Whoa.  Hang on there a minute.  Before you go naming names in a public forum 
like this, get yourself a lawyer, 'cause you will need one.  When word gets 
back to theater x, y or z and/or the architect (and you can rest assured that it 
will) they will most definitely get there lawyers to sue you.  Doesn't matter 
if they are wrong or right.  What will happen is that they will sue you for 
slander or libel or whatever the proper term is and you will spend a buttload 
of bucks defending yourself.  And nothing will get done in the theater.

It's also important to remember that most theaters in this country are not in 
great shape.  My company has done over 1,000 inspections in the last 20 odd 
years  (some of them odder than others) and I can tell you that there are 
plenty of places in much worse shape.  Rigs with no wire rope clips at all.  Rigs 
with no rope locks (go ahead.  Wrap your head around that one).  Rigs with loft 
block attached to plaster ceilings with toggle bolts. All manner or silly 
crap.  Paying attention to your surroundings is extremely important. 
  
And be proactive.  As Delbert said, make sure the venue knows, and 
understands, exactly what the problems are.  And make sure the right people know. BS'ing 
with the crew over a beer probably won't get the job done.  A meeting with 
the general manager should.    But if they won't listen to you, go home and 
write a letter.  They cannot legally ignore the written word.

Bill S.

Sapsis Rigging, Inc.
www.sapsis-rigging.com
800.727.7471
800.292.3851 fax
267.278.4561 mobile
We stand behind, and under, our work.
                             


------------------------------

From: "Sam Fisher" <Sam [at] FisherTheatrical.com>
Subject: RE: Snow Machines and Peg Legs
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2004 23:11:44 -0400
In-Reply-To: <list-4641597 [at] prxy.net>
Message-ID: <auto-000004643961 [at] prxy.net>

Sean,

If I am correct you are in the D.C. area?
We have a LeMaitre silent storm in our rental stock.  It is the quietest
I've ever heard, especially at a slow fan speed (can't even here it if it is
behind a wall)
Depending on your show dates I'm sure we can help you out.  I do know they
are all out for a few Nutcrackers.  If you are looking to purchase, they
list for $710 but we are running an excellent special until October 18th.

Sam Fisher
VP - Fisher Theatrical, LLC.
410-455-9641 office
410-455-9643 fax
410-961-0921 cell
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Stagecraft [mailto:stagecraft [at] theatrical.net] On Behalf Of
seanrmc [at] earthlink.net
Sent: Saturday, October 09, 2004 2:40 PM
To: Stagecraft
Subject: Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs

For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see <http://stagecraft.theprices.net/>
---------------------------------------------------

Thanks all for the quick responses, but I've not done a good job describing
what we need.

We have a rapid change of seasons happening behind several windows.  Rain,
snow, falling leaves.  We would like to dry and reuse the leaves, but don't
want to deal with a slurry of wet "snow", so we want to use one of those
"soap suds" snow machines.  We've got the technology to do falling "stuff",
I'm looking for snow that doesn't accumulate.

Still need a peg-leg ;)

--Sean

Sean R. McCarthy
seanrmc [at] earthlink.net


-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Persinger <gregpersin [at] comcast.net>
Sent: Oct 9, 2004 10:46 AM
To: Stagecraft <stagecraft [at] theatrical.net>
Subject: Re: Snow Machines and Peg Legs

For info, archives & UNSUBSCRIBE, see <http://stagecraft.theprices.net/>
---------------------------------------------------

Here it is.

www.snowmaker.net

Check it out. 


Greg Persinger
Vivid Illumination

Greg [at] Vividillumination.com






------------------------------

End of Stagecraft Digest #158
*****************************